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Holy Coyote!

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  • Original Poster

    #21
    Paint- we are in Camden backing onto Hunt Country. These critters are around 40-50 lbs and appear well fed. You know we will have to contact you when we next visit the coast. Mr Fooler would love to retire in Murrell's inlet.
    We still have plenty of deer, but very few fawns in the past couple of years. Normally we have 4-6 fawns bouncing around.

    According to the vet we also have more than one dog pack reeking havoc around the community. Two dogs attacked my cat, another pack in town killed two pot belly pigs and a goat.
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim

    Comment


    • #22
      I live “out west” and yep, we have lots of coyotes.

      Never had any problems with them. Neighbor did lose a twin calf to them last year, but they have never bothered my cats or dog (they come in at night), and I have NEVER heard of a pack bothering horses. Although my mare will chase them given the chance.

      They do a good job at keeping rodent populations down. That is their main food source.
      APPSOLUTE CHOCKLATE - Photo by Kathy Colman

      Comment


      • #23
        I love Camden's hunt country! I gave out water at the half-way point of the fall hunter pace a few years ago - the Camden Hunt is a great group of folks. And of course, I love The Tack Room, too. I'll PM you next time I'm up that way and I hope we can get together. But if y'all head to the coast before that, let me know!

        Good luck with that dog pack. Scary things. We had one around here that killed a friend's corgi and nearly killed her lab.
        I'm not ignoring the rules. I'm interpreting the rules. Tamal, The Great British Baking Show

        Comment


        • #24
          If anyone is seriously interested in coyotes & their behavior, Robert Timm has written about them extensively in a scientifically sound and accurate way.

          I have a problem with groups like Project Coyote, who neglect to address the need for lethal control of specific problem animals and who have taken over legislation & policy in many places. Project Coyote is headed up by people involved with Earth First and now their big goal is Pleistocene Rewilding, which sounds crazy enough to be dismissed, but is backed by serious money and large landholders like Ted Turner. You can read about Pleistocene Rewilding here -

          http://www.columbia.edu/~dr2497/PRES...s/TREE2007.pdf

          Anyway, IMO, it is irresponsible to mislead the public -- whether by painting coyotes (or any wild animals) as more dangerous than they are OR by portraying them as completely harmless, which is what leads to idiots feeding them and habituating them to begin with.

          *As a side note, the Red Wolf has also been reintroduced in the Southeast, and they are larger than coyotes.
          "In May 2011, an analysis of red wolf, Eastern wolf, gray wolf, and dog genomes revealed that the red wolf was 76–80 percent coyote and only 20–24 percent gray wolf, suggesting that the red wolf is actually much more coyote in origin than the Eastern wolf. This study analyzed 48,000 SNP and found no evidence for a unique Eastern wolf or red wolf species.[22] However, the US Fish and Wildlife Service still considers the red wolf a valid species and plans to make no changes to its recovery program.[5]"
          from
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_wolf
          Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing

          Comment


          • #25
            We had lots of coyotes in my old area, NE Ohio. Every night you would hear them calling from multiple locations, back and forth. Regular sightings. They had ZERO visible impact on the local deer population, who also grazed their way thru my woods and gardens every day.
            Down here in central Fla, I still hear them, but not very often. We do have photos of the black bears and a bobcat who are in the area.

            Interesting, but not one of the dogs I've had over the years has ever reacted to them yipping and calling...Smart dogs I guess.
            We don't get less brave; we get a bigger sense of self-preservation........

            Comment


            • #26
              We've had coyotes here in northeastern Massachusetts for years. We've noted that they are larger, bigger boned and many have a red tint to their luxuriant coats unlike coyote we've seen in the southwest. A few years ago they were everywhere, and rare was the night we didn't hear several packs. We had no woodchucks and rabbits were scarce. Then the population crashed (so did the racoons. Rabies maybe?) and rabbits rebounded. Woodchucks are just starting to reappear. All along we've had a healthy population of foxes.

              About 10 years ago, a coyote decided to cross the paddock behind out house in broad daylight. We had three large labs who proceeded to run out at it in full alert. All the coyote did was to lie down exposing its belly in the submission position. Labs hit the brakes, kind of said "Huh!" and trotted back to the barn.

              The coyotes we worry about are the groups that demonstrate untoward attention to us. Often we'll see one on the edge of a field when we're walking. It won't back off but will stare at us. We've learned to look in the brush, and there will usually be several more just waiting for us to make a mistake (or so it feels).
              They don't call me frugal for nothing.
              Proud and achy member of the Eventing Grannies clique.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by frugalannie View Post
                The coyotes we worry about are the groups that demonstrate untoward attention to us. Often we'll see one on the edge of a field when we're walking. It won't back off but will stare at us. We've learned to look in the brush, and there will usually be several more just waiting for us to make a mistake (or so it feels).
                I think often they're just curious. I've told this story before, but when I lived in Memphis I worked second shift and walked my two chows on lead around midnight every night. We lived in a half-built suburb. There was a group of four or five coyotes who would follow me and the chows every.single.night. They always stayed back ten yards or so, but they'd follow us making this funny car-with-a-dead-battery coughy little barking sound. The coyotes never came any closer and never made any threatening moves. Eventually my murderous chows stopped making threatening moves at them, too and we just walked. I'm sure we made quite a parade.
                I'm not ignoring the rules. I'm interpreting the rules. Tamal, The Great British Baking Show

                Comment


                • #28
                  BLAM!

                  I'm pretty tolerant of predators; including coyote. If they keep to natural prey, no problem.

                  Once they cross the line:

                  BLAM!
                  Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
                  Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
                  -Rudyard Kipling

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #29
                    Totally agree JSwan, as long as they do their coyote thing and leave my critters and my neighbors alone we are OK. However they are make their presence known indicating to me that they are losing their "fear or dislike" or the human race.
                    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
                    Courtesy my cousin Tim

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #30
                      Paint, just IM me when you visit next. I will do the same next time we head for the coast
                      "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
                      Courtesy my cousin Tim

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        There are some interesting COTH member coyote experiences in the following thread -
                        http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...ghlight=coyote

                        My personal experience is with coyotes that work as a pack by splitting up - usually sending one coyote as a lure / distraction while the others circle around. It seems that many people view coyote stalking / luring behavior as cute "play"??? The difference between the behavior of livestock guardian dogs versus domestic dogs is fascinating - my two LGDs are very aggressive at barking off the coyotes and alert to them even if they are inside the house - unlike the oblivious dogs in these videos (and the idiot owner that posted the video as being funny). Most LGD breeds also have a lot of hair - especially on their tails, haunches, and necks - watching these videos makes me realize it's there for a reason!

                        http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=r...&v=v1E9RxLUAxY

                        http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwrel&v=CvrGxR9aLTY
                        Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          We had lots of ki-oats coming in the early morning. But it sounded like they were just outside our fence line. But they learned our early morning routine, iow when the little dogs went out at morning. We changed that.

                          Ever since the cows have been gone the ki-oats are less. They got rid of the cows, and plowed things up for farming. The farmer kept loosing his calves. He got two donks, which were stallions. And they paid attention to each other, one "breeding" the other one ALL THE TIME, and they seemed scared of the cows. Farmer didn't believe me that I said the donks were not a fan of the cows. He said, oh they were raised with cows. Not all donks do well with cattle, most are very mean to the cows. He kept loosing calves even with the donks, so he removed them all, and plowed up the property for farming.

                          I havent heard to ki-oats for quite some time. There was a huge pack of them though. They have moved on, as their easy food source went away.

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Oh, I could tell you all about SC DNR, LOL.... And to say "red wolves have been reintroduced to the SE" is rather an exaggeration if you have seen or been involved with the project. Wikipedia, oh how you love to lead people on.

                            And good heavens is right to whomever posted the COYOTES ARE THE DEVIL post. I love to hear them singing at night and have co-existed with them for many years. Loose dogs, on the other hand, well, their owners I'd like to horsewhip...

                            If you leave bite-sized domestic animals outside unattended, it's a bit unfair to call foul if a predator eats them. I love my cats very much...so they live in the house. If you put cats in your barn, you have to be prepared for the risks that go with that. Coyotes are opportunistic predators and scavengers and energy-wise, it is most beneficial to go after the prey that requires the least amount of effort. That's just the way it works.

                            As for shooting them, not only will you just open a niche for more, but a coyote population under "predation" pressure will actually increase its reproductive output.

                            Actual wildlife biologist, out.
                            Life doesn't have perfect footing.

                            Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
                            We Are Flying Solo

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by DQonaDraft View Post
                              About a month ago I was riding in my indoor, probably about 730pm. It was dark. The back door was slid open and I was happily doing my thing when all of a sudden my mare stopped on a dime..head up in the air, heart pounding, stock still..then a chorus of howls and yips erupted from the darkness behind the indoor!! I instantly knew what it was, as did she apparently! Then another group answered from the west side of the barn! It was very scary and something I will never forget. I am in central Maryland.
                              HOLY SH*T

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Originally posted by Cruiser12 View Post
                                HOLY SH*T
                                What???? Why? Because coyote howled outside a building? They are not zombies waiting for you to turn your back so they can eat your brains, for goodness sake.
                                Life doesn't have perfect footing.

                                Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
                                We Are Flying Solo

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by wildlifer View Post
                                  If you leave bite-sized domestic animals outside unattended, it's a bit unfair to call foul if a predator eats them.

                                  I love my cats very much...so they live in the house. If you put cats in your barn, you have to be prepared for the risks that go with that.

                                  Coyotes are opportunistic predators and scavengers and energy-wise, it is most beneficial to go after the prey that requires the least amount of effort. That's just the way it works.

                                  As for shooting them, not only will you just open a niche for more, but a coyote population under "predation" pressure will actually increase its reproductive output.

                                  Actual wildlife biologist, out.
                                  Actual farmer, in.

                                  Calves are not bite sized.

                                  You cannot keep calves in your house. Nor can you keep entire herds up near your barn, surrounded by concertina wire.

                                  True - it is most beneficial to go after prey that requires the least amount of effort. Which is why coyote will go after domestic livestock rather than hunting their natural prey.

                                  It is true that bounties do not work. However, shooting a problem animal that has abandoned natural prey and is now using your farm as a grocery store - works just fine.

                                  Livestock owners have a legal and moral duty to protect their livestock. Predators are a problem in rural areas (including free ranging or feral dogs). A livestock owner can utilize a variety of methods to discourage predators - and there is nothing wrong with using a bullet on one that doesn't take the hint.

                                  I'm not afraid of coyote. I don't mind them, I enjoy watching and hearing them. I'm pretty darn predator friendly. But I am not a doormat.
                                  Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
                                  Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
                                  -Rudyard Kipling

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    There are two special animals that can make two or more sounds at the same time, one coyotes, that one can sound like several.
                                    The other, certain native people, some in Australia, can do that.

                                    I remember that from some biology/music class on singing.

                                    That little trick is why it can sound like many coyotes out there, when there may only be a couple.
                                    That is part of what is considered overtone singing, but can't find the article I read about how that is applied to coyotes.
                                    Last edited by Bluey; Apr. 4, 2013, 11:40 PM.

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                                    • #38
                                      Coyotes aren't the devil, but they ARE predators - very intelligent canid predators that work together hunting in a pack. So, anybody responsible for prey animals needs to keep that in mind and provide appropriate protection for their stock and themselves.

                                      Personally, I think most problems come from people who don't respect wildlife as being "wild" and instead try to feed and interact w/ it. Coyotes are a little different than other predators in that they have expanded their population & territory so rapidly - rather like an invasive species. But, no, they are not evil.
                                      Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        What JSwan said - exactly!
                                        Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by wildlifer View Post
                                          Oh, I could tell you all about SC DNR, LOL.... And to say "red wolves have been reintroduced to the SE" is rather an exaggeration if you have seen or been involved with the project. Wikipedia, oh how you love to lead people on.
                                          .
                                          Well, do tell, please. What in the world is behind the coyote-wanted-posters tacked up all over the place? I have a hard time believing they are putting much of a dent in the deer population. At least not down here in the swamplands.

                                          And yeah, I remember when they tried to reintroduce the red wolves to some sea island around here. IIRC, most of them tried to swim off and drowned? Or something happened to them. Anyway, as I remember it, it was not a success.

                                          ETA: I think I was remembering Bull Island. Here's a link to the FWS article about it - caution if you're at work, it opens with red wolves howling Pretty but may get you busted at work. Anyway, reading between the lines, it doesn't sound like the reintroduction actually worked but they did get some babies out of it.
                                          Last edited by pAin't_Misbehavin'; Apr. 5, 2013, 11:43 AM.
                                          I'm not ignoring the rules. I'm interpreting the rules. Tamal, The Great British Baking Show

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