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  • Grooms?

    At shows, do you prefer Full-Care of Half-Care? Usually I prefer full, but it depends on the show and how many horses I have. How many Mexicans does your barn usually bring? Do your Mexicans speak English? Only some of mine do so it makes it hard.

    <3, Kelsey

    [This message has been edited by Kelsy (edited 10-11-2000).]
  • Original Poster

    At shows, do you prefer Full-Care of Half-Care? Usually I prefer full, but it depends on the show and how many horses I have. How many Mexicans does your barn usually bring? Do your Mexicans speak English? Only some of mine do so it makes it hard.

    <3, Kelsey

    [This message has been edited by Kelsy (edited 10-11-2000).]


    • #3
      I prefer full care too. It is just too hard to take care of all of my horses with out any help. I still do things with my horses. I take them for hand walks and sometimes help tack them up. I think that is important not to ignore your horses even thought you can have others do the work. I am always spoiling them with treats!
      I get half care when I only have one horse. That way I do everything except feed and muck stalls. And that definatly makes it easier on me! I dont ahve to get up at 6 to feed or run back to the barn in the middle of watching a division to muck my hroses stall!
      What do you guys prefer?

      We usually only bring 2-3 because we have a small barn but it depends how many get full care and how many peopl get half-care.

      Only one of ours speaks English but it is ok because my trainer speaks Spanish.

      [This message has been edited by Sandstone (edited 10-11-2000).]

      [This message has been edited by Sandstone (edited 10-15-2000).]


      • #4
        When possible I perfer half-care to self-care (though I don't turn down assistance). I just have 'control & delegation' issues. God help the groom who did something wrong. Even with grooms along I like to do it myself if possible. It is my way to relax and prepare for the division. I also constantly check & re-check myself. I know I am nurotic outside the ring. But, knowing I have done everything possible to prepare for the class and everything that can be controlled has been done allows me to just enjoy the ride in the ring win, lose or draw.

        Of course I am the same way at home so it is just a natural reaction for me. All I know is that I don't have any worries once my butt hits the saddle.



        • #5
          I didn't read the rest of the post (sorry). All the grooms at our barn are working students. All are females of different backgrounds (from high school to housewife) and are really well trained by the barn. Most of the grooms who come to shows don't compete or if they do they show at the local level. I really like this arrangement, the students are there for the love of the horse and we all are close. I would (and have) trust anyone of them with the care of ANY of my horses.



          • #6
            I prefer Full-Care, I think that the mexicans can do an amazing job at getting horses extra clean. Has anyone else noticed how even the worst horses to bathe seem to stand stiller for the mexicans than anyone else? I still visit them and take them for walks and stuff though.


            • #7
              Well.. I have yet to go to a show with Pam so I'm not sure what her system is... but in my past, in GA when I was a junior I ALWAYS did everything myself. It wasnt a choice at the places that I rode to not clean your own stall or tack up your own horse.

              When I lived in VA this summer I was a slave during the week... and after I bought Rumour I sent him to Snowden Clarke... where I had EVERYTHING done for me (at home sometimes and always at shows) and it took some getting used to. But its great... because my horse looked soooo much better at the ring! haha.

              Snowden had a small amount of shower people, so we only brought one groom with us. (he actually only has 2) Jose, the one that goes with us, is absolutely incredible. He knows everything and is a step in front of us all all the time. I worship him. He is the God of all grooms. LOL. So good to the horses..And MAN... he is a nice guy too. I cant say enough great things about him. He does speak english. Not 100% fluent... but good enough. The guy that works under him that stays at home with the horses does not speak very good english, but he's learning.
              Teneriffe Enterprises- NW Indiana


              • #8
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JumpMerit:
                Has anyone else noticed how even the worst horses to bathe seem to stand stiller for the mexicans than anyone else? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                My goodness yes JM! haha. I remember showing my jumper 2 years ago.. and I was at this show and he would NOT get into the washrack for the life of him.. this guy felt sorry for me after a while, came up (didnt speak a WORD of english) took the leadrope, patted Schmee on the head.. and marched him right into the washrack without batting an eye. I was so mad! LOL. I dont understand what it is.. but Rumour wont stand for me to do ANYTHING to him! LOL and he's perfect for everyone else.

                [This message has been edited by RumoursFollow (edited 10-11-2000).]
                Teneriffe Enterprises- NW Indiana


                • #9
                  I don't use grooms. My family, friends, trainer, and I do the work. And I don't feel that that makes me any better than any of you, that is just the way you do it. But...in my opinion, you may want to consider how you ask the question. From what I have gathered, most people on this board are not heavy "A" circut riders like on Towerheads. A question like "do your Mexicans speak english?" can be seen as very derogitory. I don't want to make anyone mad, but think about that. You may be apprecative of being able to afford grooms, but remember, they are people too...


                  • #10
                    I always did all of my grooming and braiding myself, and if I ever return to showing, I would like to be able to hire someone.
                    Could you explain the difference in full and half-care, as well as give me a quick lesson on what is fair pay?


                    • #11
                      I'm sure it wasn't meant to be derogatory, but I agree with you, Paige. These people deserve our utmost respect and appreciation. We don't have "grooms" per se at our barn, but there are a few Mexican men who are employed by the owner to do stalls, feed, turn out, and keep the grounds. I respect and admire them so much. They have left their country, family and friends, to come here and do the wonderful job that they do in order to make a better life for themselves and their families. I can't say enough good about their work ethic, and their love of family. The poster above is right--the horses love and trust them; horses are a pretty good judge of character, I think.

                      I don't see the Mexicans' presence as taking jobs from Americans---businesses are crying for help here, and we sure have plenty of Americans still on welfare..don't get me started! I think a lot of us could learn a whole lot from them.


                      • #12
                        I, too, was offended by the original post. Who's to say all the grooms are "Mexicans"? Who's to say all the Mexicans can't speak English? It was also always taught to me that the term "Mexican" refers to food, and the word "Hispanic" refers to people. I can't believe that people don't have respect for grooms, period, Hispanic or not. We had a "Mexican" where I used to board; he left everything to come to a "better life" with greater opportunity. He sacrificed more than anybody I have ever met, and he also worked harder than anyone I have ever met.

                        Also -- what ever happened to people taking care of their OWN horses? I have never had the "opportunity" to have groom care at a show, we don't have grooms at my barn. Seems to me it would take away something rather than add to it...

                        [This message has been edited by Jo (edited 10-11-2000).]


                        • #13
                          I took care of four horses (all care, grooming and tacking) and showed one in Wellington last year. I exercised one of the others all the time, and the last two when necessary.

                          By the last two weeks, I told my trainer she needed to get someone else to be her slave - two of the horses were hers - she was getting paid to have one there, but I didn't get any credit for my work - hmmm. Not good.

                          The third horse was my sale horse who did not get sold. She did hire someone at that point to do her stalls, but I still did most of the everything else.

                          It was a lot of work! My only regret was not getting the chance to go watch as much as I wanted.

                          I would really rather do my own horse(s). That way, I know exactly how each one is every day, and I know what they need and when they need it. I think that is a major part of being a horseperson.

                          Had braiding been a necessity (we do jumpers, so it wasn't), I would have done that, too.

                          By the way, we did have a very successful trip!
                          co-author of 101 Jumping Exercises & The Rider's Fitness Program; Soon to come: Dead Ringer - a tale of equine mystery and intrique! Former Moderator!


                          • #14
                            Well, since my horse isn't really ready yet for the big shows, I tend to go along as the groom for our pony whenever possible. It's loads of fun, my trainer and I split the work up at the barn, and then I take care of last minute grooming and stuff ringside. After the showing is done for the day, the rider is expected to change out of her good clothes and pitch in too.
                            At the more local shows, everyone does their own work, although obviously more responsibility is going to fall on the older riders. My trainer does a LOT of the work herself though, right down to braiding for those of us who aren't coordinated enough to handle it. I may be 19, but my hands just don't work that way.
                            I too am interested in the definition of full-care vs. half-care. Those aren't terms I've come across yet in my somewhat limited showing experience.


                            • #15
                              I am glad that several people noted that the people who care for our horses are employees, not "Mexicans". Some are immigrants, some are working students, moms, etc. but all work hard and deserve complete respect from the their employers!! Yep, I have groomed (at home & at shows), my daughter grooms to pay for her showing and we always talk to the other grooms at the shows (even though my Spanish stinks). You can learn lots by taking two minutes to be polite - and believe me, your horse will get even better care [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]
                              By the way, for us, full care is everything (total care, washing, tack up, clean tack) and half care is stall cleaning and feeding.

                              [This message has been edited by jch (edited 10-11-2000).]


                              • #16
                                So much depends upon the barn at which you ride. I have ridden at every kind of barn out there... it has been different at each one. When I rode at a high profile barn in NY with very wealthy clients the help was all Mexicans. (And about the whole "mexican" thing... I am a pretty politcally correct person and I would never use the word so causually outside the horse show world... but this IS the horse show world... and "mexican" is such an accepted way of referring to the hispanic immigrants that work for barns that I have no qualms using it). This was a barn that was as full care as they come (at home too). I wasn't used to having that and I would always insist on helping... but they usually really discouraged me from doing that. They liked doing their own thing and not having us kids mess up their system. Weird! After a lot of money was lost in my family I became a working student and entered a whole new world! And, after having experienced every level of care available at every price, I can honestly say that I like doing it myself the most because it is just so much more rewarding as a horseman (errr, woman). It was so much more satisfying to win a class in the juniors knowing that I was responsible for that win because I was the one who was at the show by 5 AM to feed, medicate, muck, water, hay, lunge, bath, tack up, and ride. It was my victory alone... and not a groom's as well. Because let's face it, these days, in most cases at least, half or earning a ribbon comes from the performance you put in in the ring, and a good portion of the other half comes from the effort that was put into your horse outside of the ring. The caretaker has almost as much to do with it as the rider is what I am saying here. On the flip side, while a ribbon was so much sweeter as someone who took care of her horse, a loss was that much more disapointing... there was no finger to blame! When my horse was crazed or something else went wrong, I was the one who had to take responsibility. No groom could be blamed for not galloping my horse for long enough OR for making my horse too quiet.

                                I can't wait until I am older and "independantly wealthy" so that I can get a full time groom and just not use him or her. I think the best thing is to do all of the work yourself but know that, if need be, you can send out a call and be rescued with outside help. For example, when you get back to the barn after a ride on a hot summer day and you are exhausted and all you want to do is take your boots off, chug some gatorade, and sit on a trunk to unwide... it is definitely moments like that when it would be REALLY nice to have someone artound to take horsie out for some grass while you recover! Or, as much as I love taking care of my horse, I could live without taking the braids out ona really cold day!

                                Hmmm... I am not sure if my not-so-coherent post made any sense... oh well... too lazy to go back and fix it! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]


                                • #17
                                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rockstar:

                                  a loss was that much more disapointing... there was no finger to blame!

                                  make that no finger to point! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]


                                  • #18
                                    Usually I would not post something like this BUT I have to say that I was pretty appalled by this string- in fact I wasn't sure if the references to Mexicans was a joke. I have ridden, trained and taught in Europe and the States including in NJ, CA, PA and NC at all manner of barns. If everyone I met talked like this I would have taken up jogging long ago. One of the last "Mexicans" I shared a barn with was an MBA up here working, he had ridden junior jumpers at home and some as an adult and quite frankly could ride rings around most anyone. FYI it is NOT in fact perfectly OK to refer to your barns staff as "the mexicans", however it does make it easy to pick out the Americans on this bulletin board. If you choose to pay someone to do your horses at a show that is your choice but there is no need to be patronizing, it is a job like any other and most people would prefer a business-like relationship.

                                    [This message has been edited by letsgo (edited 10-12-2000).]


                                    • #19
                                      I don't think that me or Kelsey were trying to be mean or ofend anyone. She was just wondering. And I just answered the question.


                                      • #20
                                        At shows, I'm on full care, mostly because I'm usually late getting on with help... imagine if I wasn't on that plan? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] And it just makes me less stressed, which I found helps me relax more (duh) and I end up having a better show because I'm more focused. Our barn usually brings around 2-3 grooms, no one has their own personal groom and not everyone is on full care. At most shows, we'll have around 4 people (including 2 of the trainers) helping out w/ grooming, plus any of the students who aren't showing that day usually pitch in and help out to make it a little easier.
                                        "would you give nothing to be sitting on top of the world with your legs hanging free?" -dmb-