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The "NO REINSTATEMENT" thread.

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  • Original Poster

    He becomes eligible to apply for reinstatement in April 2006. Again (I mentioned this on t'other thread but it's worth repeating here) WE DO NOT KNOW whether he has yet applied. But it's safe to assume he will.

    Some other updates:

    We've got a domain name! Nothing on it yet, just a parking meter, but we will have a web site very shortly thanks to a kind volunteer. You know who you are. Bless you.

    We also have a couple of staggeringly gorgeous LOGOS in the works, thanks to that same volunteer.

    I never did hear back from petitiononline so I'm going to go fix some linkies in the temporary microsite, and will BBL. You call can use the petition on that site to take to shows and whatnot.
    "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief

    Comment


    • But it's safe to assume he will
      Why?

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        Originally posted by xegeba:
        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But it's safe to assume he will
        Why? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

        Ohhhhh please. Every public action he's taken in the last 10 years has been in aid of reinstatement. All those egregiously self-serving ads???
        "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief

        Comment


        • War Admiral -
          don't you realize that other "horse killers" have already been reinstated? Nancy Banfield (as I was corrected on another thread) had the same 10 year punishment. She's been reinstated.

          I don't see clearly how you are truly passionate about this no-reinstatement for horse killers. You are only zooming in on PV because he happens to be in the spot light.

          And as for the person who asked if the ASPCA keeps an "eye" on Paul's horses.... I will gladly inform you that they are some of the best kept, best looking, and best treated animals on the circuit.

          Also, FYI - Acres Wild Farm is not suspended from USEF. Horses can be owned by AWF and shown under the name, legally, rightfully so.

          Comment


          • I am sure Mr. Valliere's horses are some of the best kept, best looking, and best treated animals on the circuit. He bills his clients quite regularly for the service, and the care of Roseau Platiere received is an indication of such. And of course Acres Wild Farm is not owned by Mr. Valliere, at least not on paper.
            POYBGP, member in good standing.

            Comment


            • Ohhhhh please. Every public action he's taken in the last 10 years has been in aid of reinstatement. All those egregiously self-serving ads???
              Maybe the guy is trying to atone.

              Comment


              • He bills his clients quite regularly for the service,
                Are you saying that he should provide the service and facility for free?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by xegeba:
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">This Rule is intended to provide guidance for suspended persons and anyone
                  contemplating taking over the responsibility for the riding, exhibiting, coaching, or training,
                  of an unsuspended horse from a suspended person.
                  What exactly does this mean? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
                  Person A is suspended. Person B is NOT suspended.

                  Horse C WAS trained (or ridden, exhibited, coached) by (suspended) Person A, but Horse C is not itseldf suspended.

                  The rule provides guidance on how Person B can take over the Training ( or riding, exhibiting, coaching) of horse C, without being charged with "riding, exhibiting, coaching or training for the benefit, credit, reputation or satisfaction of a suspended person."
                  Janet

                  chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                  Comment


                  • No, xegeba, that is not what I am saying, what I am saying is the Mr. Valliere damn well ought to take excellent care of the horses in his care, he certainly charges enough to do so. He also should have taken care of the horse he chose to electrocute, he was making enough profit ten years ago where he did not need to off a horse for the insurance money.
                    POYBGP, member in good standing.

                    Comment


                    • Person A is suspended. Person B is NOT suspended.

                      Horse C WAS trained (or ridden, exhibited, coached) by (suspended) Person A, but Horse C is not itseldf suspended.

                      The rule provides guidance on how Person B can take over the Training ( or riding, exhibiting, coaching) of horse C, without being charged with "riding, exhibiting, coaching or training for the benefit, credit, reputation or satisfaction of a suspended person."
                      Who owns horse C? or does it matter? if I own Horse C... and I decided that I want to take LESSONS with Person A... and then I show Horse C... what is this considered?

                      Comment


                      • No, xegeba, that is not what I am saying, what I am saying is the Mr. Valliere damn well ought to take excellent care of the horses in his care, he certainly charges enough to do so.
                        So... you have no arguement with the poster that said his horses are well-cared for... and what he charges and what people are willing to pay means what?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by harryjohnson:
                          War Admiral, unless you have someone on the committee willing to champion this for you, it is going to end up filed under waste in the mail room. Not that your intentions are not noble, and not that many are not in agreement, it is simply a case of the federation not being concerned with the opinion of the average member.
                          Nope....USEF will listen, and they'll pay attention. The credibilty of the NGB will be seriously damaged both domestically and internationally if the reinstatement is allowed. If the mainstream media got a hold of the story, should it happen, you can kiss any future horse show coverage by any major network goodbye.

                          Now is not the time to shrink back, but instead to go FORWARD.

                          Comment


                          • It doesn't matter who owns horse C, as long as horse C is not suspended (if horse C were owned by suspended person A, then Horse C would be suspended and this wouldn't apply).

                            If horse C is "in the care, training or custody of" person A when you show it, then you are in violation.


                            If you are riding/exhibiting Horse A "the benefit, credit, reputation or satisfaction of" person A, thren you are in violation.

                            If your "relationship, whether
                            financial or otherwise, with suspended person A would give the appearance that" you "are riding, exhibiting, coaching or training for the benefit, credit, reputation or
                            satisfaction of suspended person A", then you are in violation.

                            So, no, I don't think that "taking a few lessons" from person A, and then showing would necessarily put you in violation.

                            This rule is aimed more at the "assistant" or "alternate" trainer (person B) who is the one who shows up with horse C on the show grounds, while suspended person A is still collecting training fees for Horse C, and paying person B for being there.
                            Janet

                            chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

                            Comment


                            • xebega, of course I have no argument with the poster that said his horses are well-cared for - certainly each of them gets as good of care as the horse he so sanctimoniously had killed. And what he charges and what people are willing to pay means that for what he charges, he does not have to extend himself in any manner to provide such care.
                              POYBGP, member in good standing.

                              Comment


                              • This rule is aimed more at the "assistant" or "alternate" trainer (person B) who is the one who shows up with horse C on the show grounds, while suspended person A is still collecting training fees for Horse C, and paying person B for being there.
                                So as long as A is not getting any renumeration ... and not paying B, then C's owner is good to go?

                                Comment


                                • huh... harry? and are you still maintaining that you are "ambivalent" on this particular issue?

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by harryjohnson:
                                    If the USEF were to bend to what may be a majority of members who did not want him reinstated, I would bet that a civil suit would be in the making on his behalf.
                                    Bring it on !

                                    Again, if this were to get out into the mainstream media, that our NGB reinstated a horse killer, our industry is finito, done, no mas, nada, niente. And the USEF would be cooked, or toast, pick your favorite.

                                    Comment


                                    • Again, if this were to get out into the mainstream media, that our NGB reinstated a horse killer, our industry is finito, done, no mas, nada, niente. And the USEF would be cooked, or toast, pick your favorite.
                                      Serious? Kinda like that boycott of Aruba?

                                      Comment


                                      • serious, like the pulling of sponsors
                                        http://www.petitiononline.com/valliere/petition.html

                                        Comment


                                        • There was an article in SI about this mess... did sponsors jump ship?

                                          Comment

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