[Appassionato]

Appassionato...You are so nice!! Much nicer than me...lol. You can still carry on a civil conversation with that disgusting excuse for a horse owner. Try not to beat yourself up. We all have the terrible visions of her pain/suffering/and dying alone. But, you were trying to be fair to your friend as well and were put in a tough situation. Maybe if something like this happens again (especially with that guy), you will handle it differently. I honestly don't think you can change him. I honestly don't think he will change one bit. Something is the matter with him...seriously. Anyhow, life goes on. Just love on your sweet horse. My horse is recovering from founder as well. I understand the nightmare of founder and the ensuing rollar coaster ride. ((((hugs))))

Thank you drifter! My ex laughed that I have my ways of interjecting stabbing comments that folks won't get until later on. And, for the record, I wasn't trying to be fair to the owner so much as I was for the horse. He needs to find a spine and a brain. My friend, Michele, is the one I'm interested in helping today as she is trying to find a backhoe. I also told Michele this morning that if and when he starts talking about getting another horse, he's going to get reamed by me. I've been overly kind and tried every way I know how to get him to do the right thing by the this mare, and I will remind him that he needs to either set up a fund for emergencies, get a credit card, or go to hell, no horsie. He can be 8 different kinds of pissed off with me when I do get pissy with him, but he'll have to get over it. Michele agreed. I also will be talking again with the owner of the recent horse he talked about getting, "if" Charger died.

How is your boy's founder? How long now? My poor guy has been recovering since it happened in Nov. '05. As I mentioned, he's doing pretty good now, everyone is shocked when they meet him to hear about his problems since he looks fabulous. The only way they can tell is how I described what he looks like when making tight turns (which the bozo does on his own). He does that funny arthritic way of moving, and it's obvious it's a discomfort with the hoof moving laterally. Otherwise, in a straight line, he's sound! The vet that did his x rays told me that the lateral stuff is the last to heal, if it ever gets better. I keep Bodie by himself, I'm afraid for him to be with others in case he tries to get away from a kick, moves laterally, and tears laminae or something. I don't know the real possibility of that, but in any case, even the vet and farrier agreed that my old man needs to be by himself. He's ok with it, he watches the folks at the nearby apartments, he watches the trains go by, and 5 days a week there is stuff to watch at the feed mill. He's entertained.

[excowgirlie]

I just got finished reading this whole thread, and it broke my heart! Poor Charger, going through all that pain and that ignorant ass being too arrogant and proud to do anything but ignore her pain and suffering.,..He should #1. NEVER be allowed to own another ANIMAL, let alone a horse and #2. Be charged with animal cruelty..I am sure the vet, feed store owner and Appas. could all have enough evidence of neglect against him...If I had that jerks phone number I would sure give him an earful...anyway, god bless Appas. you did what you could, and this is in between tests(I took physics for a year, and know it is difficult enough with out all the added distraction) and trying to take care of your own horse...there is a special place in heaven for people like you, and please dont feel guilty or beat yourself up because you really did try everything you could! Karma will get that dick in the end, you can bet on that.

[Appassionato]

...and this is in between tests(I took physics for a year, and know it is difficult enough with out all the added distraction) and trying to take care of your own horse...

Yep. It was the second semester of Physics, designed for science majors, put in FIVE WEEKS. It was a special Hell all on it's own. And this whole mess happened during my last week of school. With a chapters test AND a final. I thought I was going to crack. As I said to my friend, if this were Bodie it was happening to, the worst thing I'd have done is on Thursday night ask for enough dope to make him comfortable until I could fully remedy the situation Friday after my test. I wouldn't have felt good about that, but I would have done SOMETHING to ease his pain. Matter of fact, I DID have to do something like that Spring semester while I had five classes (Calc II, Physics I, Orgo II, Field studies in Bio, and a Biochem research class). I doped my guy up big time to last through the week so that I could put him down over the weekend. He had a reprieve, the abcesses burst (resulted from founder) and he's still here. I was giving that horse banamine as often as 2 times a day so he could stand comfortably enough. Was I scared of his kidneys failing? Heck yes I was. But I took a gamble: bad kidneys and put him down, or put him down over the founder. What choice did I have? It seemed way kinder to just give the banamine. Once the abcesses popped BTW, I stopped the banamine. He was finally standing comfortably once the pressure was eased.

Why this guy wouldn't give her the shots he had I have no idea, other than he heard that banamine stops gut function and he thought it would make it worse. So, this poor girl did not even have pain killers after Tuesday night. And she went THAT long, till last night. That's one tough bird is all I can think of. He was also convinced that since she wasn't saying she was in pain, she wasn't in pain. No matter that we ALL told him she was.

I've REALLY appreciated this place, not only for the help I received in regards to my Bodie, but especially lately. Last night I was up till 3 am in a funk. I wasn't crying, I felt very relieved the mare was in peace, but I just couldn't rest. And TV thoroughly sucks at that hour, let me tell ya. So I just curled up with my fuzzy gray cat and thought. And thought. And thought. I'm feeling better now, mostly to you guys as well as my friends here locally. It helps me to not feel so alone. Most of the time, I do well and prefer to be alone. Not lately though. You guys have been so patient with through all of this, and I know this thread has driven you guys insane. The situation was driving me nuts. I've appreciated all the suggestions, I've shared them with folks I know as info to know if one of our own colics, so all was not lost. I kind of feel like Charger's death was not completely in vain. I hope all of us had something to take away from all this. I know some additional "tricks" to try if my guy colics, and I also will never watch something go on like this again. After 24 hours, from here on out people have a choice if I find out their horse is colicing like this: you call a vet and have them see the horse AGAIN, or I'm calling an animal rights activist (if I knew one). I will also add after that last suggestion, "might want to sleep with one eye open, asshole." but after all this, could you blame me?

[2 tbs]

I just read the whole thread too. I saw it the other day, didn't read cuz it brought up memories of my guys terrible colic, but when it said RIP, I felt horrible and had hoped it was humane...now I'm sorry I read it.

My horse, 6 months after I got him from the track, had a horrible impaction. He trashed his stall with urine and manure every night for 6 months...who would think he wasn't pooping?! One day he jumped from one pasture to the other, panicked when he couldn't get back where he belonged-it pushed him over the edge to a full blown impaction colic.

Day one: vet came, tubed, major bloody nose, freezing cold temps (it was Nov), lots and lots of lost blood, very large impaction but per vet-should pass through the night (we were dealing with vet around 8 am!).

Ok, horse is seemingly comfortable, resting, it's been 6 hours since the vet left, barn work finally done, time for me to get a bit warm and eat something. Come back less than an hour later to do nighttime barn work-horse is flat on his side in his stall...I wasn't sure if he was alive! Called his name-ear twitched, go inside, resting but seeming maybe uncomfortable. Call vet-oh, he lost a lot of blood today and the pain from the impaction will wear him out...he's fine. Me thinks maybe not but he's the vet so I believe him.

Finish night barn work, leave around 8 pm. Around 11 pm BO calls to say he was up, resting, and quiet.

Day two: I get up extra early, go to the barn. Get there-omg, horse is NOT quiet! Ok, he was quiet but he was in the middle of his stall, had pawed everything to the back, head down, ears sideways, miserable. Call vet-still not right. Call vet a second time (I called before the clinic was open but it had been at least 45 minutes since my first call with no response). Vet finally comes, does rectal-impaction too large to pass with just a tubing. Gums checked-blistered and purple! Holy crap why didn't I look there?!?!?!

Vet says...well, what do you wanna do. Call BO, they leave work to come get truck and trailer for me. Local vet inserts cath, gives one bag before we leave. We drive from Pgh, PA to Equine Specialty in OH. Horse stays there for 4 days/3 nights, is on 60L IV of whatever for three days, large doses of pain killer and gastroguard, hand walked and given whatever else is necessary. Finally, day 3 horse has manure EVERYWHERE....can you say...bring the wine, call all your friends we are having a party!

Kept one more day, given one flake of wet hay every hour, trying to eat his straw inbetween (good sign!), and drinking even though he was literally drowning in IV fluids, given a VERY soupy mash that night, and I got the call to come get him the next day.

Local vets cost me over 500. Clinic cost me around 3500. If it weren't for my moms cc I'd still be paying the clinic...instead I'm still paying her. I don't have money for that. I don't have the means to get my horse places...I borrowed, I begged, I did what I had to do and dealt with the money aspect of it later.

It was my duty as my horses caregiver to do what was right by him. Not to say "I don't have the money" or "I can't get my horse on a trailer ride for xx reason". If I found no ride or found no means to pay (assuming I at least had the local vet there already), I would have been in my horses stall administering the IV fluids myself. If none of that was an option (not wanting to deal with local vets either), I would have at least had him put down.

There is no excuse for this person to let her suffer. If he truly loved her, he would have known she was not right, she was suffering, she needed his help...and he would have given it to her. Standing by, waiting, blowing off the attempts of others to help, convincing himself and others that she was "great" was his way of letting her die without having to pay for it.

Now, as far as you Appassionato, he should be showering you with gifts of thanks for not calling the authorities on him and for doing everything you did...even if most of it was ignored/blown off. I do understand his type of person and even though it's inexcusable, there is nothing you can do about that type of person...they are entitled to their own decision making and there is nothing you could have done to get him to change. You tried, the mare knows, and now she's with all the others on the other side of the bridge where she doesn't hurt and she thanks you for trying to help her get there...

[Ghazzu]

Yep. It was the second semester of Physics, designed for science majors, put in FIVE WEEKS. It was a special Hell all on it's own.

You *truly* have my sympathy, there.

when I decided to go back to school, I took a year of physics in 8 weeks.
I don't recommend it to the faint of heart

[DressageGeek "Ribbon Ho"]

Appassionato...I am so so sorry, for the mare, for you. You were wonderful throughout this, and I am just grateful she passed.

But I swear, if that guy gets another horse, you guys WILL have to stop me from going out wherever he is and breaking his knees.

I am not wishing the explosive diahreaa curse on him - that's too good for him. Some of the very worst pain you can endure is gas in the intestines.

So I wish for him - that he gets impacted. Badly. That his intestines torque. And that he hits an emergency room where, for whatever reason, they ignore him. And he has to endure the pain for days. Forever would be best, but sadly, that won't happen.

[EqTrainer]

Appassionato...I am so so sorry, for the mare, for you. You were wonderful throughout this, and I am just grateful she passed.

But I swear, if that guy gets another horse, you guys WILL have to stop me from going out wherever he is and breaking his knees.

I am not wishing the explosive diahreaa curse on him - that's too good for him. Some of the very worst pain you can endure is gas in the intestines.

So I wish for him - that he gets impacted. Badly. That his intestines torque. And that he hits an emergency room where, for whatever reason, they ignore him. And he has to endure the pain for days. Forever would be best, but sadly, that won't happen.

Read back a few pages, you'll see that I have invoked a new curse: The Constipation Curse. Let's hope we never have to invoke it again.

[ChocoMare]

Oh thank God. Sorry for the mare, but thankful that she's finally out of pain.

I cannot begin to imagine the depths of frustration and pain you, my dear Suzanne, are in. But, please please don't feel guilty. Guilt is what you feel when you do something you know is wrong. YOU DID NOTHING WRONG! On the contrary, you did your utmost to help but were hindered due to an IDIOT

My biggest ((((((((((((((((((((( hugs ))))))))))))))))))))))))))) to you.

[Appassionato]

I just read the whole thread too. I saw it the other day, didn't read cuz it brought up memories of my guys terrible colic, but when it said RIP, I felt horrible and had hoped it was humane...now I'm sorry I read it.

My horse, 6 months after I got him from the track, had a horrible impaction. He trashed his stall with urine and manure every night for 6 months...who would think he wasn't pooping?! One day he jumped from one pasture to the other, panicked when he couldn't get back where he belonged-it pushed him over the edge to a full blown impaction colic.

Day one: vet came, tubed, major bloody nose, freezing cold temps (it was Nov), lots and lots of lost blood, very large impaction but per vet-should pass through the night (we were dealing with vet around 8 am!).

Ok, horse is seemingly comfortable, resting, it's been 6 hours since the vet left, barn work finally done, time for me to get a bit warm and eat something. Come back less than an hour later to do nighttime barn work-horse is flat on his side in his stall...I wasn't sure if he was alive! Called his name-ear twitched, go inside, resting but seeming maybe uncomfortable. Call vet-oh, he lost a lot of blood today and the pain from the impaction will wear him out...he's fine. Me thinks maybe not but he's the vet so I believe him.

Finish night barn work, leave around 8 pm. Around 11 pm BO calls to say he was up, resting, and quiet.

Day two: I get up extra early, go to the barn. Get there-omg, horse is NOT quiet! Ok, he was quiet but he was in the middle of his stall, had pawed everything to the back, head down, ears sideways, miserable. Call vet-still not right. Call vet a second time (I called before the clinic was open but it had been at least 45 minutes since my first call with no response). Vet finally comes, does rectal-impaction too large to pass with just a tubing. Gums checked-blistered and purple! Holy crap why didn't I look there?!?!?!

Vet says...well, what do you wanna do. Call BO, they leave work to come get truck and trailer for me. Local vet inserts cath, gives one bag before we leave. We drive from Pgh, PA to Equine Specialty in OH. Horse stays there for 4 days/3 nights, is on 60L IV of whatever for three days, large doses of pain killer and gastroguard, hand walked and given whatever else is necessary. Finally, day 3 horse has manure EVERYWHERE....can you say...bring the wine, call all your friends we are having a party!

Kept one more day, given one flake of wet hay every hour, trying to eat his straw inbetween (good sign!), and drinking even though he was literally drowning in IV fluids, given a VERY soupy mash that night, and I got the call to come get him the next day.

Local vets cost me over 500. Clinic cost me around 3500. If it weren't for my moms cc I'd still be paying the clinic...instead I'm still paying her. I don't have money for that. I don't have the means to get my horse places...I borrowed, I begged, I did what I had to do and dealt with the money aspect of it later.

It was my duty as my horses caregiver to do what was right by him. Not to say "I don't have the money" or "I can't get my horse on a trailer ride for xx reason". If I found no ride or found no means to pay (assuming I at least had the local vet there already), I would have been in my horses stall administering the IV fluids myself. If none of that was an option (not wanting to deal with local vets either), I would have at least had him put down.

There is no excuse for this person to let her suffer. If he truly loved her, he would have known she was not right, she was suffering, she needed his help...and he would have given it to her. Standing by, waiting, blowing off the attempts of others to help, convincing himself and others that she was "great" was his way of letting her die without having to pay for it.

Now, as far as you Appassionato, he should be showering you with gifts of thanks for not calling the authorities on him and for doing everything you did...even if most of it was ignored/blown off. I do understand his type of person and even though it's inexcusable, there is nothing you can do about that type of person...they are entitled to their own decision making and there is nothing you could have done to get him to change. You tried, the mare knows, and now she's with all the others on the other side of the bridge where she doesn't hurt and she thanks you for trying to help her get there...

I wouldn't have wished this upon my worst enemy. I was just saying to the same friend, Michele, the other day that I used to think colic was bad until I dealt with founder. But see, every colic I'd dealt with in my life except for one (not including this one) went one way or another, but either way the horse was relieved of pain by either getting better, or being put down. I could accept colic pretty easily as a diagnosis. Founder, there was just no way they were better even after a month. They might be better, but not "better". Until now. This has opened up a different side: the folks that a truly ignorant, wound up too much in their own emotions, and in general jerks. I never dreamed of something like this happening. I am sorry about your guy, BTW. If it's any consolation whatsoever, I know *I* am proud you did everything you could. I'm in a similar situation in that I am now on student loans only, but I do have some good friends that will help me as best they can. I feel blessed for that. No question my Bodie would NOT have gone through this. Not that he never would have coliced, but that he would NOT have died from me just standing there doing nothing. I'd seriously consider my advice I gave about sending him to a vet school to be used for the new vets to learn on, if they'd just put him out of his misery soon. At least not only would he be put down, but he might help save another's life. He might not get a proper burial, but his death wouldn't have been in vain.

I offered to put this mare down in every single conversation we had since Wednesday. I wish he'd taken it, but I can't turn back time, and I'm glad she's now out of pain. I did NOT check her gums last night. What difference would it have made? I am VERY angry at what he told me happened throughout the day, and how he KNEW her time was coming. And he left her! I WILL be telling this to the person he wants a horse from, just in case if he changes his mind. When he finds out, it's going to piss him off, but I just don't care.

[Appassionato]

You *truly* have my sympathy, there.

when I decided to go back to school, I took a year of physics in 8 weeks.
I don't recommend it to the faint of heart

ACK! And you lived to tell about it?

[Appassionato]

But I swear, if that guy gets another horse, you guys WILL have to stop me from going out wherever he is and breaking his knees.

Nope. I'll give you directions. Ghazzu has already mentioned she's got the bail.

[Appassionato]

Oh thank God. Sorry for the mare, but thankful that she's finally out of pain.

I cannot begin to imagine the depths of frustration and pain you, my dear Suzanne, are in. But, please please don't feel guilty. Guilt is what you feel when you do something you know is wrong. YOU DID NOTHING WRONG! On the contrary, you did your utmost to help but were hindered due to an IDIOT

My biggest ((((((((((((((((((((( hugs ))))))))))))))))))))))))))) to you.

I guess what bothers me most is I was the last person calling him to act on it all. THE last. So, I was her last hope. Everyone else shook their heads, saying "he's stubborn and hard-headed, he won't listen Suzanne." Which I knew, but I just couldn't drop it. Even poor Michele had to reason with me about second guessing my decisions about Bodie, that the decisions that needed to be made about Charger and Bo were NOT the same. But I can't shake this feeling that I let her down somewhat. But, it isn't like I didn't try at all I guess.

As you said, and I whole-heartedly agree with, thank God she's gone now.

[ariaridge]

Appassionato, you are truly a SAINT for all that you did to help out precious Charger. Thank you so much for taking a stand to help out this precious mare. My heart breaks for you and her;for all the suffering she bore and that you had to witness. I know Charger is running free, healthy and happy. As for the owner, I hope this becomes a life changing moment for him. No animal should ever have to suffer needlessly like that. I pray he develops more compassion for others, both two and four legged, and will never let this kind of incident repeat itself ever again.

[drifter05]

How is your boy's founder? How long now? My poor guy has been recovering since it happened in Nov. '05. As I mentioned, he's doing pretty good now, everyone is shocked when they meet him to hear about his problems since he looks fabulous. The only way they can tell is how I described what he looks like when making tight turns (which the bozo does on his own). He does that funny arthritic way of moving, and it's obvious it's a discomfort with the hoof moving laterally. Otherwise, in a straight line, he's sound! The vet that did his x rays told me that the lateral stuff is the last to heal, if it ever gets better. I keep Bodie by himself, I'm afraid for him to be with others in case he tries to get away from a kick, moves laterally, and tears laminae or something. I don't know the real possibility of that, but in any case, even the vet and farrier agreed that my old man needs to be by himself. He's ok with it, he watches the folks at the nearby apartments, he watches the trains go by, and 5 days a week there is stuff to watch at the feed mill. He's entertained.

Moe is a mare BTW...lol. It stands for "Memory of Eve". Eve was the older Paint I lost 4 years ago to colic. Moe is an 8 year old Pinto. She foundered last spring (05) I think it was a combination of being overweight, immunizations all done on the same day, spring grass, and her thyroid condition that wasn't discovered until after all the tests. She is hypothyroid and is on meds now. She is trimming down. Pretty much wears a muzzle in pasture. She has some free time on pasture but not much. I am too scared. She is doing pretty good. I know what you mean about tight turns though. She is shod on the fronts. Going pretty sound but not as good as before. I am thankful she is coming along as good as she has. It has been a scary trip. She has 7 percent rotation in one foot and 10 percent in the other. She is a sinker too. Thanks for asking.

[Appassionato]

Moe is a mare BTW...lol. It stands for "Memory of Eve". Eve was the older Paint I lost 4 years ago to colic. Moe is an 8 year old Pinto. She foundered last spring (05) I think it was a combination of being overweight, immunizations all done on the same day, spring grass, and her thyroid condition that wasn't discovered until after all the tests. She is hypothyroid and is on meds now. She is trimming down. Pretty much wears a muzzle in pasture. She has some free time on pasture but not much. I am too scared. She is doing pretty good. I know what you mean about tight turns though. She is shod on the fronts. Going pretty sound but not as good as before. I am thankful she is coming along as good as she has. It has been a scary trip. She has 7 percent rotation in one foot and 10 percent in the other. She is a sinker too. Thanks for asking.

Wow, rotation and sinking? Man...I feel your pain! My guy did a mechanical founder from a special type of pad, it broke his soles and cascaded from there. He's got normal angles (3 to 4 degrees) but a darn good sink. I'll share what we've done if it might be helpful to your mare (sorry for the gender confusion!). Bodie is in new balance shoes (steel) which we hammered to a harder angle so that nothing touches his sole. He's only got 4 mm of sole covering bone, so every little bit helps! I also have full steel plates made to the shape of the shoe that are then drilled and tapped so that I can use 3/8 long bolts to hold the plates. This way, NOTHING touches his sensitive soles. I also use the Keratex Hoof Hardener which really helps and makes a difference.

If I can be of anymore help here, let me know. Including giving my farrier's number to you. I know he can't come up and help your horse personally, but he might can help your farrier help your horse. Otherwise, we are looking at time being the healing factor. Best of luck to you!

[drifter05]

Thanks Appassionato. Good luck with Bodie too!! I think it is a time factor. Sounds like Bodie is not too sore right now. And Moe is quite comfortable too. I changed farriers recently and this current one works along with my vet and follows her advice. The last farrier seemed to feel like he knew it all and trimmed way too much off her feet. Plus she wasn't balanced and that will take a bit of time to improve.

I have been using turpentine on her feet. Maybe I will pick up some Keratex. Do you use any other supplements? Right now I use Synovicare (Herbs for Horses)...it has devil's claw and yucca and other anti-inflamatories in it. Is Bodie on anything for pain? Since his founder was mechanical, I guess you don't have to worry as much about diet. Or maybe I am wrong about that.

What kind of riding did you and Bodie do?

[Appassionato]

Oh, Bodie's diet...LOL! It's very involved, took a lot of tinkering, and has nothing to do with his founder for the most part! He has intestinal cancer, of which we've tweeked his diet enough that he is no longer on ulcer meds nor cancer meds. Thank you tank you, we're very proud. AND, he looks gorgeous! Everyone is always confused as to why I do not currently ride him.

He gets:

1/2 scoop FRM Trotaway
1 1/2 scoop FRM Cool Balance
1 measuring cup flax
2 1/2 measuring cup BOSS

This he gets twice a day. His supplements:

AM feeding
handful of Fastrack

PM feeding
2 1/2 scoops Farrier's Formula (scoop comes with it, 1 or 2 ounces, not sure)
1 1/2 scoop Source (scoop provided)
Corta-flx squeezed all the way to the top

He also gets Bute-less if he's not very comfortable, such as if he has muscle soreness when I did ride him. Haven't used it in a while though.

The Keratex is some good stuff, let me tell you! Coreene mentioned it to me when his soles broke, I was desperate and said WTH, I'll try it. Even my farrier was skeptical. He now swears by the stuff and tells every single mushy-footed horse client about it, my horse's problems, and how he can still buck and raise Cain! And we are talking the leap up in the air, land on those fronts kind of bucking!

Bodie is my former OTTB that I took Intermediate level eventing. I got scared at Intermediate, had some other issues going on in my life, and went dressage and jumpers for a while instead. I retired him sound at 18, and that's when we found his cancer. When I thought I was being kind and giving him several days off a week, he went downhill. I doubt retiring gave him cancer, but there was certainly an irony about it's occurence for sure!

Oh, I forgot to add this site in my other post:

www.hopeforsoundness.com

This site is what is working best for my guy. I printed off info for my farrier, and when we went to the vet's, the vet mentioned the site. The farrier laughed, "OMG! Suzanne just handed me paperwork on that site about a week ago! It had some cool information!" Looking at my horse's hoof, then looking at the x rays, then me and the farrier just looked at each other, then the farrier says to the vet, "I want you to sow me EXACTLY where to go on HIM! I see it on the x rays, but I'm having a hard time envisioning it on the feet I see before me!" We came back on his toe about another inch. And I say another inch, we had already taken a LOT off his toes. He's got some UGLY feet going on right now, but they work. I don't care how ugly they look, he's sound in a straight line and loving life. The vet also commented to the farrier later, "those plates saved this horse's life. He'll never be able to go without them." Again, I'm just happy Bodie's happy.

[Lookout]

God Bless Charger and Suzanne.

[Beethoven]

You *truly* have my sympathy, there.

when I decided to go back to school, I took a year of physics in 8 weeks.
I don't recommend it to the faint of heart

Ug I just read thew whole story! I am glad she is in a better place now!!

I will start my last week of physics tommorow! My final is friday and then I am a college graduate!! Wahoo! Anyways I am doing it in 8 weeks as well. Its pretty easy. Even if I do not take the final or anything else, I would still get a C, but I want an A which I can get as long as I do well on my test!

[drifter05]

Appassionato....Continued health and soundness and happiness to your sweet Bodie!!!!