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  1. #61
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    Jun. 17, 2000
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    Durham/Chapel Hill nc
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    Default

    Wait, so does a medic-alert bracelet now count? I still think the whole armband/bracelet rule is silly, but I've got a Medic-alert...

    Trying to remember the history which led to the armband rule. Anyone remember?



  2. #62
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    Apr. 15, 2003
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    Northeast MA
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    Default

    Blkwly, if you'd be willing to comment on the following:

    When I ended up needing emergency surgery following a fall with a significant TBI, the anesthesiologist spend quite a while (according to my surgeon) trying to do spinal anesthesia. I assume they were trying to avoid general anesthesia due to TBI. But they couldn't establish it because my entire lumbar spine is autofused. Is that something that should be available to emergency personnel or is it one of those "we'll figure it out" kind of things?
    They don't call me frugal for nothing.
    Proud and achy member of the Eventing Grannies clique.



  3. #63
    Join Date
    Oct. 29, 2010
    Location
    Indiana
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    536

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeannette, formerly ponygyrl View Post
    Wait, so does a medic-alert bracelet now count? I still think the whole armband/bracelet rule is silly, but I've got a Medic-alert...

    Trying to remember the history which led to the armband rule. Anyone remember?
    My interpretation of the rule language leads me to believe any medical bracelet with an online system to store the information is okay. Medic Alert has online + phone so I assumed it was okay... Probably worth sending an inquiry about to confirm with USEA if you already have one
    I have Higher Standards... do you?

    "For the love of my horse, I know who I am."



  4. #64
    Join Date
    Oct. 25, 2012
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    4,158

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    I would FOR SURE NOT rely on anything requiring computer compatibility or a mobile Internet connection, for all the reasons first responders above have detailed.

    How 'bout your insurance card with a hole punched in it, on a cord around your neck, with "NO ALLERGIES, NO CONCUSSIONS" written on it in red Sharpie?


    5 members found this post helpful.

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2003
    Location
    Middleburg, VA
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    12,903

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    I would FOR SURE NOT rely on anything requiring computer compatibility or a mobile Internet connection, for all the reasons first responders above have detailed.

    How 'bout your insurance card with a hole punched in it, on a cord around your neck, with "NO ALLERGIES, NO CONCUSSIONS" written on it in red Sharpie?
    Perfect!!



  6. #66
    Join Date
    Jan. 22, 2007
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    Around the beltway..MD
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    1,104

    Default Hmmm... Today I learned (TIL)

    TIL as a Type1 Diabetic i need to get that tattooed on my forearm so that emergency personnel have an easy way to identify it.

    Proud owner of a Spicy mare!!


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Mar. 6, 2013
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    26

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCRider View Post
    I'm confused. If First Responders and trauma surgeons want allergy and medicine information available without having to go online to get it, it makes sense to me that it would still be required to be accessible on the bracelet without the use of the internet, etc. How many times is live scoring down at events because of trouble with internet access? With these new approved bracelets, is that type of information still displayed for the EMS to read on site or do they have to look it up? If it's not available, then why would you, a medical professional, switch to the bracelets?
    This is exactly why I would not switch to the bracelets. At least not the ones you have to upload info. But if I could fit allergies, meds, medical history on a bracelet in writing, I might switch so I don't have to deal with the bulky arm band. Plus I could put a bracelet on at the beginning of the day, and not worry about forgetting it between dressage test and jumping.

    I think this rule change is dumb. if they really care about safety of participants, this info needs to be written out on your person. Not just able to be up loaded. Obviously, no one took the time to ask any first responders what kind of info they actually need before making the rule.



  8. #68
    Join Date
    Oct. 24, 2001
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    2,533

    Default

    I'd been toying with getting a RoadID for the last few years, not just because of riding, but because we travel a lot and hike, often out into at least moderately remote areas. More of an "ID the body" thing, just in case, morbid as that sounds. I'd been back and forth on the idea, but the ability to wear one to Event now puts it over into the BUY category for me.

    But how will they enforce the online aspect? I'd been leaning towards getting one of the RoadID Slims, with name, ICE, NKA, and insurance # on it, and nothing online. I'd think that would cover all bases of what would be needed.



  9. #69
    Join Date
    Aug. 22, 2001
    Location
    Almost Aiken
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    2,654

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    As far as I know, they don't enforce the armbands now. I've never had anyone actually check that there's anything written on mine, and it's so grubby that while you can see I'm wearing it and that there's paper in it, you sure can't see that there's writing on it unless you peer at it.



  10. #70
    Join Date
    Apr. 8, 2004
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    The Great, uh, Green (?!?!) North!
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    3,769

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    We're on a unified health system locally, that theoretically all I need to provide is my provincial insurance number and everything would come up. Wouldn't work so well at a non-local event tho...
    "Adulthood? You're playing with ponies. That is, like, every 9 year old girl's dream. Adulthood?? You're rocking the HELL out of grade 6, girl."



  11. #71
    Join Date
    Feb. 14, 2001
    Location
    Lexington, KY--GO BIG BLUE!!
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    3,223

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by saje View Post
    As far as I know, they don't enforce the armbands now. I've never had anyone actually check that there's anything written on mine, and it's so grubby that while you can see I'm wearing it and that there's paper in it, you sure can't see that there's writing on it unless you peer at it.
    When armbands were first implemented (late 90s) they actually would spot-check a few riders in the jumping warm up. Armbands were new, not everyone had one and many forgot to wear it. Competitors were caught out for wearing someone else's armband. Also, I think the COLOR of the armband information card changed every year, forcing riders to update their info... so if the year was yellow, and you had a white card, you were assumed to be out of date.

    Now, armbands are such a part of everyday competition attire (helmet, whip, armband...) that they are taken for granted. No one checks helmets to be sure they're ASTM/SEI certified, either... it's one of those things that's just assumed to be correct, because it's YOUR life on the line.

    My way of thinking: if people can't keep armbands up to date (a simple piece of paper!), how are they going to be more likely to keep online information up to date? I know I'm guilty of not updating my armband. I haven't had any major falls or accidents, but my address may not be current (phone numbers are).

    I like the idea of a medical bracelet; as everyone says, armbands fall down and can be forgotten. A bracelet worn all the time is a nice idea. But IF the medical info is so important, you shouldn't need cell/internet service to access it.
    “A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.”
    ? Albert Einstein

    ~AJ~



  12. #72
    Join Date
    May. 8, 2007
    Location
    down south
    Posts
    586

    Default

    To answer the questions my post brought up:

    As far as I know, medic-alert bracelets are not legal whatsoever in eventing. I, however, would wear one if I had the conditions I mentioned earlier (anaphylactic allergies, serious chronic conditions that could render me unconscious like type 1 DM or arrythmia, chronic use of medications like anticoagulants.) First responders and ER/trauma physicians are going to notice a medic-alert bracelet because they are common in the general population. They may very well discard your armband as they cut your clothes off in the trauma bay because they have probably never seen one before, and never will see one again. It just isn't what we are trained to look for.

    So, if I had a condition along the lines of what I've described, and I was eventing, I would wear a medic alert bracelet AND whatever the USEA required from me.

    I also mentioned that I'll probably wear one of these bracelets myself for eventing - basically because I find armbands somewhat annoying (I have skinny arms and have to secure them with pins and they bug me slightly) and I would rather have my emergency contact info somewhere it is very easy to see, without being thrown in with all the other useless info on the armband. A few years ago I was at a competition alone and had a concussion on XC - came around after 20 min and it had not occurred to anyone to look at my armband to contact anyone. I didn't know my own name, much less any family phone numbers, and it took another 10 minutes for it to occur to me that this was on my armband and call someone. Of course there are numerous issues with that story, but I hold out hope that if I was wearing a bright bracelet with just my name and emergency info, it might occur to someone to make a phone call sooner (or take me to the hospital, but that is a separate issue.)

    Frugalannie, to answer your question I have never heard of spinal anesthesia being used in in an emergency surgery due to the risk of TBI. In general it is far safer to have a protected airway and general anesthetic (which lowers intracranial pressure) and this is also much faster, which is of the essence in most trauma cases. However, if this was orthopedic surgery and you were conscious and had a negative head CT, they probably felt that they had ruled out TBI and might proceed with their preferrred type of anesthesia for the case? That is really the only explanation I have but some of the anesthesiologists here might have a better idea. I'm really only ever involved in head/spine trauma (and occasional tangentially in severe thoraco-abdominal trauma) and I've never seen a spinal used in the many hundreds of level 1 traumas I'e participated in. As for whether to indicate your spinal fusion loudly and proudly, I wouldn't worry too much about it. If you are in an accident that renders you unconscious (and thus unable to give a history) you should be getting a trauma CT of your spine anyway and they should see the hardware very easily.



  13. #73
    Join Date
    May. 8, 2007
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    down south
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    586

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SparklePlenty View Post
    TIL as a Type1 Diabetic i need to get that tattooed on my forearm so that emergency personnel have an easy way to identify it.

    I mean no offense by my suggestion! But it is very common (daily occurence where I work) to have a diabetic patient "found down" and brought to the ER emergently because they have inadvertently become hypoglycemic (or less commonly, are in DKA.) EMTs are trained to check blood sugar in these suspected situations, but it doesn't always happen like it is supposed to, especially in odd places like airplanes and horse shows! Hence I know many type 1 diabetics, including my dad and one of my good friends, who wear a medic alert. The idea being to facilitate the rapid diagnosis of a potentially fatal yet easily reversible situation.



  14. #74
    Join Date
    Apr. 21, 2009
    Posts
    84

    Default

    I propose this idea for Roadid and Teamridesafe. Why don't they make sportswatch replacement bands with this info on them as well as the online info. Most horsey people where a sportswatch all of the time

    Edit: Just found something that would work similarly: http://www.1bandid.com/
    Last edited by Bikoman; Mar. 6, 2014 at 01:28 PM.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #75
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    Nov. 8, 2000
    Location
    Upper Bucks County, PA
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    3,017

    Default

    I am disappointed that regular medical bracelets will not suffice as they at least carry your name, pertinent medical history, and emergency contact on them if you have them engraved that way. I echo everyone else that a bracelet that only sends someone to a website with your medical information is going to be pretty useless.

    My bracelet lists the 2 main medical issues that first responders and ED staff would knew to know about, as well as my name, my doctor's phone number, and my husband's phone number. My doctor has access to my full medical history and is available at all times (voicemail provides his cell phone when he is not in office). I'd much rather have him tell them my medical history than rely on an online form.

    I also think the pretty obvious marketing of the RideSafe bracelets is an excellent marketing move by RideSafe (whose business is going to pick up big time) that benefited USEA enough that they didn't mind misleading riders that RideSafe was the only permitted bracelet...mainly because the rule is still ambiguous enough that some bracelets fall in the gray area.

    Again, the rule that the bracelet must be linked to online information is a poor idea. Better to stipulate what information must be included on/in the bracelet, and if it is also online, that's fine as well. Why encourage people to make their information completely unavailable except through the Internet?
    Kelly Soldavin Harvest Moon Farm
    www.harvestmoonfarmpa.com


    3 members found this post helpful.

  16. #76
    Join Date
    Oct. 22, 2001
    Posts
    5,133

    Default

    Doesn't quite answer your question, but speaking solely in my personal capacity, I would make the argument that a medical bracelet that contained on it the same information required to be on a medical card ("any relevant medical history, injury (particularly to the head), drug allergies and current medication.") would satisfy the rule. I would also note that it'd be my view that the question of what aspects of that information is "relevant" is best determined by the rider and his/her personal physician and outside the purview of the governing bodies or officials.

    Regardless though, let's also please all recognize that it is USEF that makes and passes rule changes, not USEA.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  17. #77
    Join Date
    Feb. 23, 2007
    Location
    Jawja
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    1,365

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bikoman View Post

    Edit: Just found something that would work similarly: http://www.1bandid.com/
    Great idea and I agree that the online information is helpful, but not critical as quite a few have pointed out that the online information isn't likely to be perused until after your critical event has been managed and will wind up being more of an afterthought.

    I suspect the 1bandid will past muster at an event inspection unless they're going to have someone on hand with a tablet or something to pull up your information online and verify it's there? Unlikely, though I could see the possibility of having this information be requested on an entry form? As in: "Please identify where you're pertinent medical information is stored online and give website address." Though I do wonder at the legality of that given HIPAA.
    Let us ride together; blowing mane and hair; careless of the weather; miles ahead of care...Fat Cat Farm Sport Horses



  18. #78
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2002
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    5,174

    Default

    I think this is a great idea but flawed in the implementation. Instead of requiring the interactive version, I think riders would be better served by mandating the critical information required to be engraved on the band. If I am injured, I sure don't want emergency personnel spending time screwing with their phone, when everything pertinent can easily be printed on my band. For riders with more extensive health history, the interactive version could be an option, or continue with the traditional medical armbands.

    I've used Road ID for years and love it. I only use the printed version for the reason stated above. I have one version for when my husband is home, and one version with different contacts when he is away (military). My Road ID contains the following info:

    MY NAME / YEAR OF BIRTH
    ICE 000-000-0000 NAME
    ICE 000-000-0000 NAME
    ICE 000-000-0000 NAME
    NKA - B NEG - NO MED HX
    TRICARE INS- MIL SPOUSE

    I don't see why this is insufficient for eventing? I have no head injuries as noted by "NO MED HX", no allergies, lists THREE contacts, and my insurance provider. A first responder doesn't need to know my general doc's name because they wouldn't be able to reach them on a weekend anyway.

    I prefer Road ID because of the band options (I have both the Sport and the Slim), quality product, great service, and reasonable price. Less than $20 for most of their options. Not a fan of RideSafe because the website won't offer pricing without logging in, more expensive, one band choice, and only the interactive version is available, which I do not want. I want a first responder to be able to look at my wrist and see my name, age, that I don't have any allergies, no med history, and have contacts if they need them. I don't want to be a big mystery waiting on someone to be able to log in due to a poor phone or internet signal.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Apr. 20, 2013
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    Area IV
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    1,040

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    Quote Originally Posted by frugalannie View Post
    Blkwly, if you'd be willing to comment on the following:

    When I ended up needing emergency surgery following a fall with a significant TBI, the anesthesiologist spend quite a while (according to my surgeon) trying to do spinal anesthesia. I assume they were trying to avoid general anesthesia due to TBI. But they couldn't establish it because my entire lumbar spine is autofused. Is that something that should be available to emergency personnel or is it one of those "we'll figure it out" kind of things?
    That sounds odd to me. We almost NEVER do a spinal in an emergency case unless the pt is wide awake, has a history of severe post op nausea, requests no general anesthesia or has a full stomach which is quite common. The fact that you don't remember the attempts at your spinal (did I read that correct?) means you probably had a great drug called Versed but if you didn't, that worries me. Spinals are nice for a lot of reasons but we (I mean our hospital) don't usually do them for emergency cases. But they can be the safest choice if the only part injured is a lower extremity.



  20. #80
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    Jan. 19, 2005
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    PA
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    12,622

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    Quote Originally Posted by GutsNGlory View Post
    My interpretation of the rule language leads me to believe any medical bracelet with an online system to store the information is okay. Medic Alert has online + phone so I assumed it was okay... Probably worth sending an inquiry about to confirm with USEA if you already have one
    There is nothing in the rule requiring online information. If you don't have any allergies or other medical history....there is no need to have more info online.
    ** The difference between genius and stupidity is genius has its limits. -- Albert Einstein **


    1 members found this post helpful.

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