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  1. #21
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    Jun. 18, 2007
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    PAs are not Doctors.

    On an ER trip this last year, while I was sitting in the ER room waiting, I of course read every sign and notice in there. Right up there next to the "we will NOT refill your chronic narcotic pain meds" sign was one saying something like, "The ER uses the services of Physician Assistants as well as Medical Doctors. PAs have had extensive training and work under the oversight of a doctor, but they are not doctors. If you are seen by the PA and wish to be seen by the supervising doctor instead, simply ask."



  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar. 26, 2005
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    Back to Normal.. or as close as I'll ever get
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    "Dr." PA needs to perform a self-egoectomy.

    A friend's SIL is a pharmacist - so possesses an Rph - he refers to himself as "Dr."
    Another candidate for ego removal.
    *friend of bar.ka*RIP all my lovely boys, gone too soon:
    Steppin' Out 1988-2004
    Hey Vern! 1982-2009
    Cash's Bay Threat 1994-2009


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  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jul. 25, 2007
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    Arizona
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    925

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2DogsFarm View Post
    "Dr." PA needs to perform a self-egoectomy.

    A friend's SIL is a pharmacist - so possesses an Rph - he refers to himself as "Dr."
    Another candidate for ego removal.
    This person is a pathological liar plain and simple. The lies usually deal with things to make them feel superior to everyone else. This is a person who rides like crap but has told people they won Maclay Medals (confirmed to not be true)



  4. #24
    Join Date
    May. 6, 2004
    Location
    Charlotte
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    1,613

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    I agree that's it's just plain wrong for the PA to claim to be a doctor.

    Personally, (and thankfully) I've had the complete opposite experience. My GP office is fairly large, and I don't have a "primary" doctor- I don't mind seeing whomever is available. This particular practice has about 5 PAs, and I actually find myself requesting a PA over an MD. All of the PAs I've seen have introduced themselves using their first names, and they seem (to me at least) to spend more time and not seem as hurried. I'm fortunate to have had great experiences.

    The one downfall is that I see a PA every 2 months for a long-term narcotic that I'm taking. Even though she has a DEA number of her own, printed on the Rx pad, I cannot get the Rx filled in my state. Drive 5 miles down the road across the state line to the same drug store chain, no problem. Crazy!
    "Life is too short to be a slave to the whims of others." -- RugBug, COTH



  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jun. 4, 2008
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    Close to Ocala,fl
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    829

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toadie's mom View Post
    I'll make this vaguely horse related. Because of "horse related" injury I saw a neurosurgeon. Because I absolutely detested his PA I'm now seeing a different surgeon. Along with obviously being a Dr. wannabe, aforementioned P A was so condescending I almost cussed her out. I did have to see him once more, and when I made the appt. I told them under no circumstances would I drive the 60 miles to his office unless I ONLY saw the real Dr.
    This…..I have had the same experience with a P A . Very arrogant and condescending. I realize they have a good deal of education but I really would rather see a real DR. to treat me. I had to change DR. because he got mad at me because I didn't want to see the P A I wanted to be seen by the DR and said he didn't have time for all his patients. I know this isn't all P As of course but my experience was not good.



  6. #26
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    10,033

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne View Post
    Incorrect. Nurse Practitioners practice autonomously. They are NOT under the supervision of an MD. Physician's assistants must practice with supervision. In some states NPs can own their own practices.

    One can obtain a PhD in nursing, and these people can correctly be called "Dr. So and So" but most nursing PhDs work in academia or administration, so it's unlikely that one of them will be providing bedside care, causing confusion with their title. I'm not aware of any PhD programs in physician's assisting.
    Usually nurse practitioners see patients under the supervision of a MD, but they can practice alone.



  7. #27
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    Jan. 31, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by grayarabpony View Post
    Usually nurse practitioners see patients under the supervision of a MD, but they can practice alone.
    Um, no. NP's DO NOT NEED TO BE UNDER SUPERVISION!!!!!
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people.
    W. C. Fields


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Mar. 24, 2004
    Location
    Pottstown, PA (East Coventry)
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    3,191

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    My NP also had her DVM/VMD (not sure where she graduated). My DH recently found that out on his last visit. She was a vet with her own practice that treated cats. She developed a severe allergy to cats so got her NP as her new career.
    Oh, well, clearly you're not thoroughly indoctrinated to COTH yet, because finger pointing and drawing conclusions are the cornerstones of this great online community. (Tidy Rabbit)



  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jan. 25, 2005
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    upstate New York
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    3,403

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    I work with docs and physician assistants. The patient is usually the ome to reference having seen dr. So and so. I correct them, he/she is a p.a. and the conversation continues. They always greet patients with their name and title when they enter the exam room. Most patients are okay with seeing a p.a. but there is the occasional patient who demands an m.d. we accomodate when possible, but our docs don't have enough hours in the day to stretch any thinner. I am personally fine with mid-level providers, and usually prefer them.

    My ex has his doctorate and runs a prestigious research program at an ivy league school but rarely addresses himself as dr. Eventhough he is entitled, it usually only comes up in his professional capacity in an academic setting. The physician assistant in question may be an inadvertant victim of a patient assumption.



  10. #30
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eye in the Sky View Post
    Um, no. NP's DO NOT NEED TO BE UNDER SUPERVISION!!!!!
    Funny, because my husband did oversee nurse practitioners in the practice he works in.

    Has the law changed in the past 2 years? Appears to vary by state: http://kff.org/other/state-indicator...oner-autonomy/
    We're in NC.



  11. #31
    Join Date
    May. 16, 2003
    Location
    Arizona....the desert part.
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    423

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    Quote Originally Posted by SharonA View Post
    The person should have assured the PA that the person would be only too happy to counter sue. This misrepresentation is probably a violation of the PA's license and in any case is a red flag for "secretly dangerous and wacko health care provider" to me.
    This. I am a Physician Assistant, have been for 24 years. In addition to being a serious moral and ethical violation, it also violates their license and is illegal. This would be the case even if they HAD a PhD in heathcare, or anything else. Report them to the state medical board, they will take care of it. This really makes me angry...gives all of us in the profession a bad name.
    I'm not tense, just terribly, terribly alert!
    If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to be a horrible warning!



  12. #32
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    May. 16, 2003
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    Arizona....the desert part.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eye in the Sky View Post
    Um, no. NP's DO NOT NEED TO BE UNDER SUPERVISION!!!!!
    It depends on the state where one practices. In many states NPs do not need supervision, but I believe in some they do. Also can vary hospital by hospital. I believe in my state, AZ, NPs may practice independently (although I am not sure, as I am a PA and not as familiar with their rules and regs), but in the hospitals where I work, they must practice under MD supervision, as per those hospital's rules. The same reason that I was allowed as a PA to insert chest tubes and central lines when I worked in Boston, but cannot here in AZ....hospitals rules were different.
    I'm not tense, just terribly, terribly alert!
    If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to be a horrible warning!



  13. #33
    Join Date
    Oct. 6, 2002
    Location
    Philadelphia PA
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    I have a doctoral degree, technically (a JD). I would never us "Dr." Even in an academic setting it would be "Prof."
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    1 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Feb. 20, 2010
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    All 'round Canadia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne View Post
    Incorrect. Nurse Practitioners practice autonomously. They are NOT under the supervision of an MD. Physician's assistants must practice with supervision. In some states NPs can own their own practices.
    Exactly. An NP can run their own practice; where I am there are a few minor restrictions they have that make them different from a doc, but not that many and none that would substantially interfere with an autonomous practice.

    A PA is, by license, a physician extender. That's not to look down on them, but that is what they are, and the vast majority of PA's are proud of their title and happy to stay in their lanes.

    (In the military they get called doc all the time. The medics do too. Sometimes the unit's first responder does. But that's a cultural thingy in the military.)
    Proud Member Of The Lady Mafia



  15. #35
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    Jul. 4, 2008
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    The Great Northwest!
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2DogsFarm View Post
    "Dr." PA needs to perform a self-egoectomy.

    A friend's SIL is a pharmacist - so possesses an Rph - he refers to himself as "Dr."
    Another candidate for ego removal.
    Some Pharmacists are Doctors of Pharmacy (they have a PharmD) but others just have masters. It depends on where and when they went to school. So yes some Pharmacists are Doctors, but not all of them.
    Foaling Around www.facebook.com/foalingaround
    Custom Equestrian Items and Bath Products


    3 members found this post helpful.

  16. #36
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coanteen View Post
    Exactly. An NP can run their own practice; where I am there are a few minor restrictions they have that make them different from a doc, but not that many and none that would substantially interfere with an autonomous practice.

    A PA is, by license, a physician extender. That's not to look down on them, but that is what they are, and the vast majority of PA's are proud of their title and happy to stay in their lanes.

    (In the military they get called doc all the time. The medics do too. Sometimes the unit's first responder does. But that's a cultural thingy in the military.)
    In some states NPs can practice autonomously.

    http://www.kaiserhealthnews.org/stor...-practice.aspx



  17. #37
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    Jan. 31, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by grayarabpony View Post
    Funny, because my husband did oversee nurse practitioners in the practice he works in.

    Has the law changed in the past 2 years? Appears to vary by state: http://kff.org/other/state-indicator...oner-autonomy/
    We're in NC.
    If a person has to be under supervision, they are not fully credentialed. I am from NC and live in MD, and my understanding from colleagues is that the laws are VERY similar if not the same.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people.
    W. C. Fields



  18. #38
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    Rules are different when practicing in a hospital setting, but it is that hospital's rules, not state rules/laws that prevent an NP from being autonomous.

    I refer several clients to NP's for medication management. Both NP's I use have practiced in hospital as well as PP settings. Those of us that have been in a hospital setting ALWAYS have a "supervisor" but it doesn't mean we cannot practice outside of an MD - it's just how hospitals are structured.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people.
    W. C. Fields



  19. #39
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    Apr. 20, 2013
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    Area IV
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eye in the Sky View Post
    Um, no. NP's DO NOT NEED TO BE UNDER SUPERVISION!!!!!
    That's what she said.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  20. #40
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eye in the Sky View Post
    If a person has to be under supervision, they are not fully credentialed. I am from NC and live in MD, and my understanding from colleagues is that the laws are VERY similar if not the same.
    Well you're wrong, state laws regarding supervision of NPs are different in Maryland and NC.

    I believe there is a special provision for NPs to practice alone in high need rural areas in NC.



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