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  1. #141
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    I note we're at the 9pm mark and we haven't actually discussed the last agenda item yet, about expanding 'persons responsible' except maybe ever so tentatively to veterinarians.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket



  2. #142
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    Dec. 22, 2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by poltroon View Post
    I note we're at the 9pm mark and we haven't actually discussed the last agenda item yet, about expanding 'persons responsible' except maybe ever so tentatively to veterinarians.
    I wonder if we should form a quick betting pool on the actual finish time. I will take 9:40 for $5, Alex.



  3. #143
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    Interesting: rules committee member saying that many of his fellow members did not have the background necessary to understand the importance of the proposed rules.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket


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  4. #144
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    Jul. 21, 2011
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    I've asked another question, we'll see...



  5. #145
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    The vets are the big issue in expanding responsibility, because they usually are not USEF members or the official show vet and therefore are not directly under the USEF jurisdiction. We had that issue in the draft Code of Conduct for members and officials. Like Sonja just said, they are trying to find a way to get to the people who are really responsible and not just be limited to members and officials.

    BTW, for those who remember from a few years ago, the proposed Code of Conduct lives. The Ethics Committee revived it last year, we strengthened it, and it is now being circulated to the committees for comments. It is not getting the "we can't do that because we're just a show organization" objections that it got last time around.
    "I don't want to sound like a broken record here, but why is it that a woman will forgive homicidal behavior in a horse, yet be highly critical of a man for leaving the toilet seat up?" Dave Barry


    2 members found this post helpful.

  6. #146
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    May. 17, 2000
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    Hmmm, John Long wants to contact vets, Then let them join the mailing list for free/have a free info membership with a DVM license # and use the AAEP mailing list. It does not always need to be about a membership fee!
    Definition of "Horse": a 4 legged mammal looking for an inconvenient place and expensive way to die. Any day they choose not to execute the Master Plan is just more time to perfect it. Be Very Afraid.


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  7. #147
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    If the only goal of the USEF with respect to veterinarians is only providing educational material, there's no need to cause them to be members - you can put the info online and have email lists for bulletins without charging. It seems to me we could use that plus the state boards to do what needs doing there.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket



  8. #148
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by poltroon View Post
    Interesting: rules committee member saying that many of his fellow members did not have the background necessary to understand the importance of the proposed rules.
    Well, you might as well put me on that thar committee, then.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


    2 members found this post helpful.

  9. #149
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    Apr. 30, 2013
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    I am not satisfied by the loophole of allowing a barn manager/head groom to sign as a trainer when drug infringements are assigned to that person by USEF rules. My question has not been addressed.



  10. #150
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    Oh well.. I did try to participate, Mr. Long..


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  11. #151
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    Jun. 19, 2001
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    None of the 3 questions that I submitted about a week ago were addressed. Was the audience hand picked? I can't believe that so few people attended, and there didn't appear to be many (any?) from the h/j community.



  12. #152
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    Aug. 12, 2001
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teachequine View Post
    I am not satisfied by the loophole of allowing a barn manager/head groom to sign as a trainer when drug infringements are assigned to that person by USEF rules. My question has not been addressed.
    I asked that also and got no response.
    "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief



  13. #153
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    The meeting was in Lexington and not in conjunction with another event that would cause people to travel there, so the in-person crowd was bound to be weighted towards the saddle horse crowd. It wasn't hand picked, but it did have a lot of folks who are active in governance, which was also to be expected. I'll be interested to see what the numbers were for people online.
    "I don't want to sound like a broken record here, but why is it that a woman will forgive homicidal behavior in a horse, yet be highly critical of a man for leaving the toilet seat up?" Dave Barry



  14. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Portia View Post
    The meeting was in Lexington and not in conjunction with another event that would cause people to travel there, so the in-person crowd was bound to be weighted towards the saddle horse crowd. It wasn't hand picked, but it did have a lot of folks who are active in governance, which was also to be expected. I'll be interested to see what the numbers were for people online.
    I just asked @USEquestrian that on Twitter; I too will be interested. Will post if I get a reply.
    "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief



  15. #155
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    Jul. 21, 2011
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    Unfortunately , the rest of the world will only see the online video replay and the questions asked and answered there, not the unanswered questions posed online and by other means.


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  16. #156
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    Dec. 25, 2005
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    I would love for them to go after the vets. At the very least, it will give the vets an out so if a big-time client asks for, say Mag or Oxytocin, they can say "no, I could end up losing my license." I think many of these vets give in to trainers' demands because they make a lot of money from their barns, not because they support doping horses. They don't want to risk losing that source of income. And those really big barns can bring in a LOT of income.

    At the very least, it will help get rid of the sleazy vets...


    4 members found this post helpful.

  17. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Portia View Post
    The meeting was in Lexington and not in conjunction with another event that would cause people to travel there, so the in-person crowd was bound to be weighted towards the saddle horse crowd. It wasn't hand picked, but it did have a lot of folks who are active in governance, which was also to be expected. I'll be interested to see what the numbers were for people online.
    But Country Heir crowds will all pull in in the next 2-3 days, I don't understand why it was not scheduled for next Monday.

    Maybe I'm being selfish, but I really wanted a bigger HJ slant on this conversation.
    ExchangeHunterJumper.com
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  18. #158
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Portia View Post
    The vets are the big issue in expanding responsibility, because they usually are not USEF members or the official show vet and therefore are not directly under the USEF jurisdiction. We had that issue in the draft Code of Conduct for members and officials. Like Sonja just said, they are trying to find a way to get to the people who are really responsible and not just be limited to members and officials.
    I think the vets know what's waiting for them and don't see any advantage to getting closer to the USEF.

    I don't see why enlarging the set of potentially culpable people surrounding a drugged horse helps. Why not just make the cheating hurt really, really bad for one central player and let him control everyone else?

    To wit: If the HO or trainer who would be kicked out of showing forever on her first D&M infraction would make damned sure the vet was in line.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


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  19. #159
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    So help me out here - I intend to send a follow-up letter - fill in the blanks w/ as many issues/unanswered questions as you have, and I'll include yours along w/ mine:

    The questions I have that were not answered are:

    What is the timetable for accomplishing the next steps?

    If members wish to become more involved in the process, are there any plans to make that happen other than us submitting more questions that don't get answered?

    Will the loophole issue of grooms signing as trainer ever be specifically addressed?

    [add yours]

    The most frustrating aspect of this meeting for me was:

    --No real timetable for next step

    --I really don't want to hear one SINGLE word more about allowing the Hearing Committee "flexibility" in penalties/suspensions: establish a range for each offense beyond which the Committee *cannot* stray. NO exceptions.

    --No real mechanism for members to volunteer to become more involved if they wish to be.

    [add yours]
    "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief


    3 members found this post helpful.

  20. #160
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    Jan. 27, 2000
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    My take away? Members outside H/J discipline want to decelerate the process, take a much closer look at these extraordinary rule change proposals before sending said rule change proposals to the BOD for a vote.
    I also heard John Long stress the affiliates should focus on their own house cleaning and then and only then bring it to the federation.



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