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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep. 24, 2010
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    Western NY
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    Default Post Ulcer Treatment tips

    Bro is down to his last week of Pop Rocks, he's really coming around! His back is not as near reactive as it was while saddling/girthing or grooming and he feels "looser" in general in his hind end. I also ended up putting him back on stall board, as he was not happy (read: stressed) out on field board. Every morning, he feels he has to show his appreciation by getting as much straw into his mane and tail as possible.

    I obviously want to keep his gut healthy from here on out. I know I should taper off the Pop Rocks, but how long? A few days? A week?

    Supplements: Are there any that have scientific studies/backing shown that the ingredients are worth something? I feel like I'm going cross eyed. I do have access to some free SmartGut Ultra and GastriX. I like Tractgard as it seems to have more substance than fluff.

    I canNOT change his feed (I've not been thrilled with it for a while and have offered to buy my own to no avail). He does have grass/grass hay available to him at all times though. BO feels I "oversupplement" with flax (his coat is finally looking decent!), Sel+E and electrolytes (after he colicked in Dec, I'm not taking any more chances). I do also have him on an antioxident supplement, Protandim, which has many research studies (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=protandim) and not just anecdotal tales. I'm not 100% sold on it yet, but it does seem to have actual research backing. My vet suggested it at his last chiro appointment to alleviate some of his muscle tension.

    Fingers crossed, I will be able to move him home by the end of summer and I can feed differently, but it helps to have a "game plan" before then.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
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    19,592

    Default

    Taper for at least a month in my opinion. I keep my guy on Ulcer aide and add pop rocks when that doesn't seem to cut it. http://www.breedersgold.com/pdfs/brochure%20.pdf



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan. 16, 2002
    Location
    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    I would taper over a few weeks, down from 3 to 2 packs0 for a week, then 2 to 1 for a week, then every other day for about 10 days, for instance. I think you have to look at the ingredients on the nutraceuticals and kind of choose what you value. You have your buffers (calcium carbonate, etc.), your coaters (slippery elm, bismuth, etc.), your glutamine products, and your various antioxidant/others (grapeseed, etc.), most of which come in most of the products in various combinations. Personally if I were to use a nutraceutical I'd be going for a buffer and not messing around with all the other stuff.
    Click here before you buy.


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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug. 3, 2012
    Posts
    65

    Default Diamond V YC Originals

    My ulcer prone guy came off his omeprazole with a couple flare ups UNTIL I put him on Diamond V YC originals--- yeast cultures- sold in the 50# bag for around $20.00 . I give 1/2 cup at morning and evening feed.
    Keeps his gut balanced and we have been off everything for 4 months now with NO other supplements/flare ups!

    good luck.. it is always tough to see them in pain.



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan. 16, 2002
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    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    Protandim may have "many research studies", but that doesn't mean it's particularly useful in equine ulcers or really at all when ingested. A string of small articles in obscure journals is vastly better than a big fat "nothing" in terms of evidence, but none of the papers you cited really gave any meaningful evidence that this stuff does much of anything. Doesn't keep it from being massively marketed, however. It is an extremely shifty substance from an extremely shifty company. Use the word "antioxidant" in a product, and the world will seemingly beat a path to your door. It's unfortunately not that simple.
    Click here before you buy.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2000
    Location
    Clarksdale, MS--the golden buckle on the cotton belt
    Posts
    18,250

    Default

    I'm going with U7. It's got a bunch of stuff in it and has gotten good reviews. There is also an unpublished study from an Oklahoma State vet that seems to show SOME benefit.

    It's also one of the cheapest out there if you shop. I got a gallon for $62.95 with half price shipping from KV Supply.
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar. 15, 2007
    Location
    (throw dart at map) NC!
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    4,443

    Default

    Omeprazole tx utilizes a month "weaning period", and I would suggest the same for poprocks. Is the daily amount the same as omeprazole RXs for horses? Alfalfa hay (high ca and mg feeds) provide an excellent source of buffers for excessive stomach acid. Feeding buffers will neutralize the stomach acid, but be aware that horses do need low pH stomach acid to properly digest forage,.
    Proud member of the Colbert Dressage Nation



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep. 27, 2000
    Location
    Southern California - on a freeway someplace
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    Default

    I didn't taper Star off the ranitidine, but I don't think it works the same way. When I asked the vet about gastric supplements, she said that most of them coat the stomach and may not actually do much. Her suggestion was to give him the ranitidine for a couple of days in a stressful situation which is what we've done. That was back in January and I know he didn't have ulcers at least as of three weeks ago when he ended up back at the equine hospital with colic symptoms. Now he has a thickened small intestine. I may be getting ulcers though...
    The Evil Chem Prof


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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep. 24, 2010
    Location
    Western NY
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    1,088

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    Protandim may have "many research studies", but that doesn't mean it's particularly useful in equine ulcers or really at all when ingested. A string of small articles in obscure journals is vastly better than a big fat "nothing" in terms of evidence, but none of the papers you cited really gave any meaningful evidence that this stuff does much of anything.
    This is not to help the ulcer issue, more of a "he's soo friggin tense and stiff, perhaps there is more going on that what we can see." As I said, not 100% sold on the stuff and I will admit I had a weak moment when my vet described my 6y/o as having the back flexibility of a 20y/o arthritic horse. I know the first question regarding feed/care is "what is the horse eating?" so I included it.

    And... he colicked mildly this morning again... I'm thinking the weather being so dramatic this week(high 80s + humid to 40's + rain), the grass has got to have all sorts of weirdness going on. He seemed fine after a round of Pepto and lots of walking, no real interest in grain, just the fresh grass. I actually tasted the Pop Rocks... OMG, awful! Could also be why he's becoming more and more leery of grain, guess I'll be syringe-dosing the rest.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan. 16, 2002
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    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    It is not the calcium and magnesium in alfalfa that buffer acid, (they are cations, after all) but rather the lignins in the plant. And although acid does play a role in digestion, the vast majority of horse digestion takes place in the small intestine and large intestine, where acid is already neutralized, via enzymes and fermentation.
    Click here before you buy.


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  11. #11
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    Sep. 27, 2000
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    Southern California - on a freeway someplace
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    Default

    Just chiming it to provide backup to deltawave on the Ca and Mg ions. Cations are acidic or, in some cases, neutral.
    The Evil Chem Prof



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar. 31, 2012
    Location
    Coastal NC
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    923

    Default

    I taper off and use smartgut ultra and mg (quiescence) daily. I also make sure that she has hay available at all times and try to give her plenty of turn out. She had ulcers when I got her and since I figured it out and have treated her, which has been a huge learning process with some trial and error, she is a completely different horse.

    Don't forget to use your pop rocks a couple of days before, during and after a stressful event like a show or long trailer ride. It makes a huge difference.



  13. #13
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    Jan. 16, 2002
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    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    Thank you Peggy! I felt like I was on thin ice there, being chemistry-impaired in general. But it isn't the cations in our TUMS or ROLAIDS that do the job, but rather the humble anions like carbonate and phosphate. Ummm, right Peggy?
    Click here before you buy.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep. 27, 2000
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    Southern California - on a freeway someplace
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    Thank you Peggy! I felt like I was on thin ice there, being chemistry-impaired in general. But it isn't the cations in our TUMS or ROLAIDS that do the job, but rather the humble anions like carbonate and phosphate. Ummm, right Peggy?
    Yes. You get an A+.
    The Evil Chem Prof



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