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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    Lets say they were there for 15 years as a "school". And, maybe they purchased much older schooling horses..When they were too old, ill etc they shot them in the head, or had a vet euthanize them..and then they buried them....that might be 4 horses per year over the 15 years.

    I am excluding the ones in the stalls..as they obviously "were not buried"

    There is no proof they were abused nor neglected (the ones buried) ...

    Isn't this what so many want...bury them on "your" property..so if they did smell...would be tough luck for those who were down wind.

    Problem is people. They do not want anything to die. Period. Mom, Dad, Granny...keep them on life support. Kids born with horrible deformaties..keep them alive and on life support.

    No one should be surprised when they want animals to live forever.

    Just read the forums. Now..anyone taking a horse to an auction IS A KILLER.

    Anyone selling their horse and not keeping track of it for its whole life IS A KILLER

    I remember a raid on a Dachie breeder. There were around 35 dead dogs in boxes and bags in the barn. Big hoopla...bit time press...turns out they had been euthanized..all were in the 15-20 year old range..and she took them home waiting until spring when she could get someone to backhoe and bury them..

    It took four months.

    Good thing there was no internet then. They would have destroyed her with rumour, inuendo and jumping to conclusions in their quest to find SOMEONE guilty of something because there were dead dogs.
    Quoting this classic.... such a keeper
    Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

    http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/


    3 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    I would like to here interject that this location is within easy reach of the Canadian border. The existence of the slaughter industry, which several of you tout as the answer to all ills of abuse, neglect, and ignorance, obviously once again did not prevent an inexcusable situation from going on for years.

    After all, they could have just loaded them up and gotten a big fat check . . .
    Said with a high pitched, whiny voice:

    "Do you have to make it all about slaughter?"


    3 members found this post helpful.

  3. #23
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    Mar. 18, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    I would like to here interject that this location is within easy reach of the Canadian border. The existence of the slaughter industry, which several of you tout as the answer to all ills of abuse, neglect, and ignorance, obviously once again did not prevent an inexcusable situation from going on for years.

    After all, they could have just loaded them up and gotten a big fat check . . .
    Nobody has claimed slaughter will stop abuse or neglect. We have said it will help reduce neglect as there is an option. The fact of being close to the border is meaningless. Anybody can load horses up and take them to an auction regardless of where they live.
    I support equine meat processing as an option for those who choose to use it.



  4. #24
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    Mar. 23, 2006
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    Some people are going to abuse or starve horses whether there is a slaughter plant available or not.

    Some people are going to abuse or starve horses if the economy is good, bad or indifferent.

    There are just some very lousy people in this world.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
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    Jun. 19, 2011
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    Angela As will your retraction regarding the stoppage of all slaughter from Canada and Mexico (the USA should also be up and runnning) by July ...what was your date??/// 13th or something like that....

    Now...since YOU appear or at least present yourself as so well informed..have you CALLED the newpaper the article appeard in? Have you asked them how long the business has been there? Have you asked if there have EVER been any complaints filed against them including ANY investigations>??

    We are waiting for your investigated response...



  6. #26
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    There is something wrong here..the whole story is not out. A RESCUE and stable that no one has EVER visited and seen all of these hroses.."the worst I have ever seen in my life" (this is the standard trained response for investigators to use as per article in Modern Arabian). The other..oh..they have no life in them and can't lift their heads ..BUT YET..a couple of days later they are ALL DOING WELL..a little water and food has made all the difference in the world. Sorry but that just does NOT happen with a horse emaciated and near death.

    Am not defending them but isn't this a case..that one photograph or video turned over to the police in 48 hours could have resulted in the investigation? Or should the documentors WAITED and gathered more and more evidence to ensure a possible conviction?

    Will wait regarding the bodies located BURIED on the property. Funny..the only comment from a poster was regarding possible stench and contamination...but none of the "usual" crowd have jumped on that.....I agree...hoarding and abuse have nothing to do with slaughter.



  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    Angela As will your retraction regarding the stoppage of all slaughter from Canada and Mexico (the USA should also be up and runnning) by July ...what was your date??/// 13th or something like that....

    Now...since YOU appear or at least present yourself as so well informed..have you CALLED the newpaper the article appeard in? Have you asked them how long the business has been there? Have you asked if there have EVER been any complaints filed against them including ANY investigations>??

    We are waiting for your investigated response...
    I read the other thread and the linked articles in which one of the relatives of this lovely couple detailed how she had seen with her own eyes the neglect and called AC repeatedly about the situation. She also was clear that these people were not mentally well.
    Since horses were in fact found deceased in stalls in the barn, I'm going to lean towards believing this witness and her account that this has been an ongoing problem, rather than discount it.

    I mean seriously, even if there were 50+ horse who legitimately died and were buried, those 5 horses dead and rotting in the stalls is a bad enough situation isn't it?
    I just don't get how, with the fact of the situation those 5 horses were found in, these people are being given a pass by anyone who cares for horses and their welfare. I guess some feel that all those 5 horses need is 'a little water and food has made all the difference in the world. ' ??
    Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

    http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/



  8. #28
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by maunder View Post
    Some people are going to abuse or starve horses whether there is a slaughter plant available or not.

    Some people are going to abuse or starve horses if the economy is good, bad or indifferent.

    There are just some very lousy people in this world.
    I agree.
    I just rehabbed one such horse for this past month.
    Some people need hanging.



  9. #29
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    Jul. 19, 2007
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    Michigan
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    I would like to here interject that this location is within easy reach of the Canadian border. The existence of the slaughter industry, which several of you tout as the answer to all ills of abuse, neglect, and ignorance, obviously once again did not prevent an inexcusable situation from going on for years.

    After all, they could have just loaded them up and gotten a big fat check . . .
    Oh, no, slaughter is CRUEL, ANYTHING is better than that. (Note sarcasm.) The problem is too many people think a fast death in a slaughterhouse is the worst thing that could ever ever ever happen to an animal, so it never even crosses their mind.



  10. #30
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    The problem I have with reports that no one has investigated...they just HAVE investigated...what is different this time. All it takes is for ONE person to call the newspaper and say ...we have a problem and this will be a great story for your paper.

    I know AC are not trained..not paid..not funded very well..but ALL of them can not be bad. The reason I say that is due to the fact I am working on so many cases of them going to farms where there is NO problem based on a drive by phone call.

    All I have been able to find out is the stable is "alleged" to have been in operation for over 10 years...

    The five dead in the stall is obviously a heads up and that is why I excluded them with my...the numbers could add up theory EXCEPT for those.

    I don't believe the relative. A call to mental health would have sparked an investigation. I have had to deal with a pet hoarder and there have been over 30 calls and 30 investigations. AND 30 removals of dogs and cats.

    Something is amiss....



  11. #31
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    What, exactly, is the mental health diagnosis that causes "Hoarders," of pets or anything else? Is it OCD, a need for control like anorexia nervosa, or are they just not processing reality at all? We seem to be seeing this more and more nowadays . . . years ago not so much.

    As least today it's investigated and cleaned up; 50 years ago probably would have been swept under the rug or no laws on the books.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Jun. 24, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    What, exactly, is the mental health diagnosis that causes "Hoarders," of pets or anything else? Is it OCD, a need for control like anorexia nervosa, or are they just not processing reality at all? We seem to be seeing this more and more nowadays . . . years ago not so much.
    Last I read (maybe a year ago?), psychologists think it is often tied into OCD. They weren't 100% clear on the exact tie-in relationship then, and I think they're still studying/learning.

    It is an awful disease, regardless of the exact background.
    Visit us at Bluebonnet Equine Humane Society - www.bluebonnetequine.org

    Want to get involved in rescue or start your own? Check out How to Start a Horse Rescue - www.howtostartarescue.com



  13. #33
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    Hi all! I wanted to offer a little insight, as I live just over the border in IL near this case (not involved in any way) and have been following the various groups that are taking care of all the animals removed.

    This facility, over 20 years ago, used to have a spotless reputation with the previous owners. Since the Whites bought the property, boarders, former boarders, neighbors and others have called local law enforcement for years on these two individuals, and they have been investigated, ordered to feed more, and previously complied with investigators' conditions. (I'm not saying they were seasoned or trained humane investigators, most likely sheriff's investigators.) Horses from this barn have been disqualified and sent home from 4H shows because of their emaciated condition. Teenage boarders pooled their money and purchased additional feed for as many horses as they could.

    An analysis of bone marrow fat content on all skeletal remains will determine very quickly if starvation was the cause of death. It is unequivocal; for a healthy, average horse, the bone marrow fat content (the last source of nutrition to be tapped in a starvation situation) is between 60-90%. I had a case in 2010, where the two horses that died has BMFC of 2.7% and 5.1%, which indicates long-term, continuous lack of food, not a recent "oops, ran out of hay for two weeks".

    Animal control for this and two surrounding counties is privatized, and one guy, who stepped up and IMMEDIATELY found a facility that would take all 23 seized horses as soon as law enforcement contacted him. There are no rescues or humane societies in SE Wisconsin that investigate reports of neglect or abuse, and Wisconsin has some of the weakest humane laws in the country.

    Paula White has shown no remorse, and simply thinks nosy, backstabbing people will get theirs, and should stay out of her business. Her FB page used to be public, and she talked about going out and getting "giggly drunk on moonshine" as soon as she was released from jail. Lovely.

    Police are now encouraging the community to test their water:
    http://www.kenoshanews.com/news/hors...471429745.html

    PLEASANT PRAIRIE, WI — Police are urging neighbors of a Pleasant Prairie horse farm where 69 animal carcasses were found buried to test their drinking water.

    Pleasant Prairie Police Chief David Smetana said the concern was raised on Wednesday regarding the residential wells in close proximity to the farm. Investigators were concerned the stream that feeds the area could have potentially contaminated the neighbors’ drinking water.

    In conjunction with the investigation, Pleasant Prairie Public Works personnel collected samples from two wells on the property in the 1800 block of 128th St., according to a statement from the village released Thursday.

    An independent testing lab under contract with Pleasant Prairie analyzed the drinking water samples, and both samples tested safe for drinking. The water in a nearby stream was tested by the Department of Natural Resources and also was found to be safe, reports said.

    Testing of wells as a result of the animals buried on the property is not mandatory but is recommended, according to reports.
    Investigation continues

    Officials are examining carcasses of the 69 additional dead animals located in separate grave sites on a Pleasant Prairie horse farm where five dead horses were found in close proximity to live horses on April 9. Twenty-three mistreated horses were seized from the property.

    During a second search at Hidden Lake Stables, 1808 128th St., on April 30, the Pleasant Prairie Police Department working in cooperation with the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, found the carcasses of 55 horses, 12 goats and two cows on the property, according to Pleasant Prairie police.

    The carcasses will be examined to determine the cause of death.

    In addition, the house on the property was deemed to be uninhabitable by the Kenosha County Health Department during the search, and an order was issued for the reclamation of the property.

    The property owners, David E. White, 59, and his wife, Paula S. Moctezuma, 62, were charged May 1 with mistreatment of animals causing death. They are due in court Tuesday.
    Testing kits available

    Well testing kits with sterile bottles are available for Pleasant Prairie residents. Results are available after 48 hours.

    Where:

    Pleasant Prairie Village Hall, 9915 39th Ave. and the Prange Municipal Center, 8600 Green Bay Road

    Cost:

    $25.

    Well testing kits are also available from the Kenosha County Division of Health at a similar cost. Illinois residents should contact their local municipal office for well testing policies and procedures.
    Donations sought

    Clawz and Pawz, the contracted animal control agent for Pleasant Prairie, Bristol, Paddock Lake, Paris and Wheatland, is seeking donations to help care for the horses and other farm animals. It may be contacted at 262-880-3482 or by email at clawzandpawz@wi.rr.com.

    According to the business’ owner Melissa Melby, Clawz and Paws is caring for most of the animals seized from the property, including horses, goats, lambs, sheep, ducks, geese and a peacock.

    The 23 horses and peacock are being kept at Stonehedge Farm, 935 172nd Ave. in the town of Paris. The other farm animals are being kept at a separate location that did not want to be named. The bull from the property was taken to a private residence.

    Clawz and Paws is responsible for all costs and care for all the animals, with the exception of veterinary bills.

    Melby said day-to-day operations can be followed on Clawz and Pawz’s Facebook page.

    In addition, Safe Harbor Humane Society took in a dog, three rabbits, five adult cats, and three kittens between 3 and 5 weeks old that were removed from the property.

    Donations to the Safe Harbor Humane Society can be made any time online at safeharborhumanesociety.org/support/donate.aspx or at the shelter. Safe Harbor accepts monetary donations as well as pet food, pet supplies, shelter supplies and more.

    To see what Safe Harbor needs, see the shelter’s wish list at http://www.safeharborhumanesociety.o...wish-list.aspx.

    Safe Harbor Humane Society, 7811 60th Ave., can be contacted at 262-694-4047 or animals@safeharborhumane.com, or via its Facebook page at www.facebook.com/SafeHarborHumaneSociety. The shelter is open Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday from 1-6 p.m. and Saturday from 12-5 p.m.


    Clawz and Pawz is very transparent on their FB page, and provides updates on the animals regularly.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    2horseygirls, thanks for the info.
    Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

    http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    Jun. 15, 2008
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    514

    Default good news re: the surviving horses

    so am joining the party late here, but a friend in Racine sent this link with pix and video on the surviving horses, and apparently for the most part they are recovering well:

    http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local...yj7cw.facebook



  16. #36
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    Mar. 25, 2013
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    I also live close to this facility and personally know the people who are taking care of the horses. This farm has had some many complaints for over a decade! Paula would buy horses and then would starve them and not sell them or give them back to their owners. There are people trying to find their horses that were given to paula years ago. It is a very sad situation. She would rather starve them then give them back and sell them.

    Here is the facebook page for the horses. People are trying to raise money to help and find where some of the horses that weren't rescued went.

    http://www.facebook.com/SaveBernieAn...ref=ts&fref=ts



  17. #37
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    This whole thing just reminds me of the Nancy Mackall, polo pony mess. We did track down some of the owners...so there's hope.
    Join the Clinton 2016 campaign...Hillary For America. https://www.hillaryclinton.com/



  18. #38
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    Those cases seem to be of mentally sick people that happen to have animals and so those suffer.

    There is right now some rancher in NM that has 600 head of cattle, at a time where cattle are at an all time high in prices, so it was not that he could not sell them if he didn't have enough to feed them because we are in the third year of a record drought.

    He was letting them starve, many had died by the time the sheriff found out, stepped in and started a feeding effort to save the rest.

    Some people really sadly lose it and whatever they are responsible for, humans, animals, whatever else just doesn't get attended to, some times with tragic results, as here.



  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Those cases seem to be of mentally sick people that happen to have animals and so those suffer.

    There is right now some rancher in NM that has 600 head of cattle, at a time where cattle are at an all time high in prices, so it was not that he could not sell them if he didn't have enough to feed them because we are in the third year of a record drought.

    He was letting them starve, many had died by the time the sheriff found out, stepped in and started a feeding effort to save the rest.

    Some people really sadly lose it and whatever they are responsible for, humans, animals, whatever else just doesn't get attended to, some times with tragic results, as here.
    All while slaughter is a very viable, thriving industry/option.
    Go figure.
    Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

    http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/



  20. #40
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    I don't think this thread has anything to do with slaughter...it's all about mentally ill people who are allowed to abuse animals year after year, with no one stepping in to stop them.

    This is not about making a quick buck...it is about the crazies among us.
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