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  1. #161
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    I haven't looked at all of the news footage, but was the trailer actually a double decker? I know that some of them have floating decks, but were the horses actually on two levels or one? I just assumed that it was one of those godawful long single level trailers.



  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by betonbill View Post
    I haven't looked at all of the news footage, but was the trailer actually a double decker? I know that some of them have floating decks, but were the horses actually on two levels or one? I just assumed that it was one of those godawful long single level trailers.
    no, it was a single tier stock trailer. A long one. (godawful? )
    Quote Originally Posted by Bristol Bay View Post
    Try setting your broomstick to fly at a lower altitude.
    GNU Terry Prachett


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  3. #163
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    The worst part here? Do you all think for one second that driver gives a damn about any of this? In particular, our petty arguments and insult flinging nonsense in this thread?

    Nope.

    Whatever led up to it, 30 horses died an agonizing death. And the main reason was because slaughter exists.

    What can we do, as horsemen, whether pro or anti slaughter, to minimize and end this?
    That's what we should be talking about. But that's not nearly as fun as arguing, is it?

    What about humane euthanasia? Why is there no one really looking at this? What would happen if there were no financial incentive to take one's horse to slaughter? If, at the low end auction, there were no meat buyers?

    And there will always be ignorant, cruel, uncaring owners. but, for instance i the case of the woman who basically breeds to slaughter, she would not any longer be rewarded for that behaviour.

    Euthanasia needs to become more acceptable. Yes, even convenience euthanasia. Better a quick bullet, or the end of the needle than this.
    My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
    You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

    Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  4. #164
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    No kidding.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Ok, she has seen them closer than in pictures, but she has not been very close to say how they are constructed and how horses load and travel in them.
    She was assuming that from reading the animal rights extremist myths and propaganda about that.
    You should not believe everything you read.




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  5. #165
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    Bluey - I get it. It's not that. In fact a decent horse trader, even at that level, tries to get the horse at least up to a profitable weight, or tries to sell to private - more money that way.


    I'm saying that a hauler who goes from sale to sale over a period of up to weeks, will haul horses, in let's say,less than desirable conditions. All the while, the horses, who came from rpivate homes, the ractrack, etc., their conditions both physically and mentally, deteriorate.

    It's suffering, anyway you look at it. And not to be combative, but you can't say that they "just bought those horses". You can't know that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Do you realize what horse traders do?
    They buy and sell horses.
    They take mismanaged horses the rest of the horse owning public dumps and make the best they can to get them sold somewhere else, many times after rehabbing them if they can.

    The reason you see horses in bad shape is because they just bought those horses like that, they didn't own them until they were in bad shape, they are buying what they think they can improve and resell at a profit.

    Sure some traders are evil, so are some top trainers and and some backyard owners also, but in general, they are like the rest of us, doing the best we can with what we have.
    My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
    You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

    Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandy76 View Post
    Bluey - I get it. It's not that. In fact a decent horse trader, even at that level, tries to get the horse at least up to a profitable weight, or tries to sell to private - more money that way.

    Like, really? noooooooooooo.
    I am pretty sure that in a business when the sales price is calculated per pound this option has crossed their minds.
    as well as selling to the 'public' at inflated prices.
    Oh, bummer, they can't win doing that either....just look at the gleeful hand rubbing in the AC4H thread....the special few still want the dealer to die in a fire (pun unavoidable) and for his extended family to rot in the poor house.


    I'm saying that a hauler who goes from sale to sale over a period of up to weeks, will haul horses, in let's say,less than desirable conditions. All the while, the horses, who came from rpivate homes, the ractrack, etc., their conditions both physically and mentally, deteriorate.
    their mental state? No doubts. That is not something most horses are used to. Heck, a lot of horses gt a little wound up at the elite sales, when they spend 3 or 4 month in the same barn, although with ever changing riders....
    but physical condition?
    Again...that's an assumption that the dealer just fell off a turnip truck.

    It's suffering, anyway you look at it. And not to be combative, but you can't say that they "just bought those horses". You can't know that.
    but you can't know otherwise. Only assume.

    and we are back to square one.....

    and in the end, all there was was a truck caught fire, unfortunately hauling life/flammable cargo. And we are jumping to the conclusion that they were all lame, beaten, starved.....
    Quote Originally Posted by Bristol Bay View Post
    Try setting your broomstick to fly at a lower altitude.
    GNU Terry Prachett


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  7. #167
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    You are hysterical.



    Let it go, if you can.

    Jumping to conclusions? Where did you get that? Or is this more attacking me for what others wrote?

    Alagirl, how many have you rehabbed? Bought off the truck behind the auction? Any?
    Have you ever worked an elite sale?


    So, yes, from personal experience, these things do happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alagirl View Post

    Like, really? noooooooooooo.
    I am pretty sure that in a business when the sales price is calculated per pound this option has crossed their minds.
    as well as selling to the 'public' at inflated prices.
    Oh, bummer, they can't win doing that either....just look at the gleeful hand rubbing in the AC4H thread....the special few still want the dealer to die in a fire (pun unavoidable) and for his extended family to rot in the poor house.



    their mental state? No doubts. That is not something most horses are used to. Heck, a lot of horses gt a little wound up at the elite sales, when they spend 3 or 4 month in the same barn, although with ever changing riders....
    but physical condition?
    Again...that's an assumption that the dealer just fell off a turnip truck.



    but you can't know otherwise. Only assume.

    and we are back to square one.....

    and in the end, all there was was a truck caught fire, unfortunately hauling life/flammable cargo. And we are jumping to the conclusion that they were all lame, beaten, starved.....
    My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
    You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

    Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Ok, she has seen them closer than in pictures, but she has not been very close to say how they are constructed and how horses load and travel in them.
    She was assuming that from reading the animal rights extremist myths and propaganda about that.
    You should not believe everything you read.
    Wrong again, Bluey. I have seen how horses load and travel in them, and I'm sure this will disappoint you, but I don't fall for "animal rights extremist myths and propaganda". Despite what you have posted about my intelligence in the past, I really am smarter than that.

    As others have said, you use attack mode to side track people. I'm still waiting for you to show proof of horse slaughter transporters being assaulted.

    In the meantime, please stop trying to believe you know everything about me.
    Last edited by jenm; May. 8, 2013 at 02:57 PM. Reason: punctuation
    Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg


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  9. #169
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    Yes "Ignore" is my friend. Alagirl and Bluey, your blah blah blah is hidden. I just wish people would stop quoting you and even responding to you... going in circles over and over again.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  10. #170
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    Brandy, the Horse Plus Humane Society recently took their Last Act of Kindness program nationwide. Now anyone can ask for help with money for euthanasia if they need it. I don't think that anyone truly believes that it's people who need to put a horse down, but can't afford it, that are fueling slaughter. Perhaps that's why it isn't discussed more.

    http://horsehumane.org/lak.htm
    \"Non-violence never solved anything.\" C. Montgomery Burns



    4 members found this post helpful.

  11. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenm View Post
    Wrong again, Bluey. I have seen how horses load and travel in them, and I'm sure this will disappoint you, but I don't fall for "animal rights extremist myths and propaganda". Despite what you have posted about my intelligence in the past, I really am smarter than that.

    As others have said, you use attack mode to side track people. I'm still waiting for you to show proof of horse slaughter transporters being assaulted.

    In the meantime, please stop trying to believe you know everything about me.
    She forgets we work for PETA/HSUS... so duh of course we've seen these rigs.
    Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

    http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/


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  12. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by FalseImpression View Post
    Yes "Ignore" is my friend. Alagirl and Bluey, your blah blah blah is hidden. I just wish people would stop quoting you and even responding to you... going in circles over and over again.
    and we stick the fingers in our ears and yell 'NANANANANANA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!'



    don't quote me, I am on ignore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bristol Bay View Post
    Try setting your broomstick to fly at a lower altitude.
    GNU Terry Prachett



  13. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandy76 View Post
    The worst part here? Do you all think for one second that driver gives a damn about any of this? In particular, our petty arguments and insult flinging nonsense in this thread?

    Nope.

    Whatever led up to it, 30 horses died an agonizing death. And the main reason was because slaughter exists.

    What can we do, as horsemen, whether pro or anti slaughter, to minimize and
    end this?
    That's what we should be talking about. But that's not nearly as fun as arguing, is it?

    What about humane euthanasia? Why is there no one really looking at this? What would happen if there were no financial incentive to take one's horse to slaughter? If, at the low end auction, there were no meat buyers?

    And there will always be ignorant, cruel, uncaring owners. but, for instance i the case of the woman who basically breeds to slaughter, she would not any longer be rewarded for that behavior

    Euthanasia needs to become more acceptable. Yes, even convenience euthanasia. Better a quick bullet, or the end of the needle than this.

    I think what would happen IMO is horses would suffer even more. I know someone on AZ that told me a couple years ago when the slaughter houses were closed that people were just letting horses go around where he lived. You could ride down the road and there would be a skinny horse on the side of it in the middle of nowhere. It's lime people that are to cheap to put their dog or cat down, or they don't spay their dog and have puppies that they can't afford or get rid of. It cost to drop them at the pound, they have to pay I think here is 25 dollars an animal to surrender it so they just drop them on side of the road. I have had sooooo many dogs and puppies being dropped at my farm. Covered in fleas and ticks, starving and it's to sad. Same as when I worked as a vet tech. People would just leave animals by the door and expect us to take care of them. If these people can't afford the horse anymore and send it to auctions and they don't sell what do you think is going to happen to those horses? I highly doubt they will go home to a comfy life of retirement. A lot of people don't have the money or land to dispose of a horse after they put it down. Around here it's a dollar a pound for cremation and that's what I've always done. If I had room (my property is the house and pasture so no where to bury one safely) then it would cost about 250 for someone to come and dig the hole. If people are flat broke and don't have 400 dollars to euthanize and then bury this animal what do you think they will do? It's all about responsibility IMO. This may not be a popular thing I'm about to write but IMO if you can not afford a horse you shouldn't have one. And of circumstances change were suddenly you can't afford them anymore idk what to say. That's a hard fact that there is not an answer to. But if each state had a slaughter house in it and were overseen properly then maybe it wouldn't be as bad for these horses. But you can also always donate to your zoo. They go into a quite room and are well Shoot or bolt gun in the head, same as a slaughter house but at least it's not as hard on them as slaughter has become, or donate to your university vet program were they can pts and study the horse. There are different options but laziness of people it's sometimes easier to just ship them to the auction and put them on the truck.
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole


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  14. #174
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    rabicon - I don't disagree. With or without slaughter, people will do this. Weren't there reports of people abandoning horses even within miles of slaughterhouses when they were still open?

    We can't make people be more responsible. I am just trying to think of alternatives to rewarding the behaviour.

    MandyVa- that's a great thing. But I do think there are people out there who want to for whatever reason, move a horse on, and they may not have other alternatives. If they cannot sell, and cannot keep, the auction/slaughter pipeline should not be the only option.

    I am fairly sure there are a large number of veterinarians who will not euthanize a horse just on an owners say so.
    My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
    You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

    Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.



  15. #175
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    Your friend in AZ must have failed to notice that even more horses have been slaughtered every year since the US slaughterhouses closed, Rabicon. Stupid people always have and always will do things like abandon their horses.
    \"Non-violence never solved anything.\" C. Montgomery Burns



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  16. #176
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    I'll say it again, ignore is your friend...unless you like the rehashed, regurgitated, pro slaughter, use one last time garbage, with a side of nasty.
    Join the Clinton 2016 campaign...Hillary For America. https://www.hillaryclinton.com/


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  17. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenm View Post
    WHAT?! The only reason they may have been followed by animal welfare people is to document the inhumane conditions the horses were subjected to.

    Double decker trailers were designed for short necked animals such as cows and sheep, not for horses who carry their heads much higher. Horses were being forced to travel long distances with their heads in a lower position which was uncomfortable.

    I'm astonished to learn you think the ban was not because of horse welfare but because of un-PC like behavior. Wow.

    As for your allegation of assaults, please provide evidence of this.
    Well, gosh, didn't you know, according to Bluey, that all double deckers use the adjustable flooring for horses. Yessiree, those KB's take all the time they need to adjust the floors to make sure all their horses are comfortable. After all, they don't want to damage the goods.......


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  18. #178
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    The AVMA supports horse slaughter, but vets won't put down a horse just because? Perhaps THAT is the problem, it it's really the case.

    If there was really a supply of horses needing euthanasia, there would be plenty of industrious cowboys advertising their willingness to come and shoot them.
    \"Non-violence never solved anything.\" C. Montgomery Burns



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  19. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela Freda View Post
    She forgets we work for PETA/HSUS... so duh of course we've seen these rigs.
    Good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dispatcher View Post
    Well, gosh, didn't you know, according to Bluey, that all double deckers use the adjustable flooring for horses. Yessiree, those KB's take all the time they need to adjust the floors to make sure all their horses are comfortable. After all, they don't want to damage the goods.......
    Another good point!
    Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg



  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by rabicon View Post
    If people are flat broke and don't have 400 dollars to euthanize and then bury this animal what do you think they will do?
    What would they do if it had a broken leg? A lot more horses die from causes other than slaughter every year in the US, and somehow people manage.
    \"Non-violence never solved anything.\" C. Montgomery Burns



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