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  1. #1

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    Last edited by Iamatillman; Aug. 19, 2013 at 07:31 PM.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov. 5, 2000
    Posts
    9,314

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    De Niro is one of the best sires around these days for producing big ring dressage horses (he topped the 2012 WBFSH dressage sire rankings), but he will not refine your mare, and he usually throws a lot of chrome.

    Rotspon seems to be very popular with folks looking to produce ammy friendly horses, but he is not in the WBFSH top 100 dressage sires, so has not yet made a mark for himself as a sire of international dressage horses. He is two years younger than De Niro, though, so perhaps will have a few youngsters put him on the list in coming years, but for now, it is safe to say he is not nearly as successful a sire of top talent as De Niro. He is more inclined to give you a hunter-y foal though, than De Niro. Rotspon is referred to in some circles in Germany as a "pony maker" because many of his offspring are on the smallish side, but he also has some that end up in the 16.2-17h range.

    Since you seem to be comfortable with using frozen semen, you might want to look at Dante Weltino. He is tall (1.73m), and black with minimal chrome (he also does not carry a red gene, so cannot throw a chestnut foal). He is young (born in 2007), but a lot of people in Germany are pretty impressed with his foal crops. As an added bonus, both his grandsires (De Niro and Welt Hit II) are in the top 10 WBFSH dressage sire rankings. I don't know how he would be for siring hunters, though - I doubt anyone has bred to him for that purpose.

    Another option might be to consider a Sandro Hit son. They are all dark coated with minimal chrome, and most tend to be fairly tall with refining qualities. If you want to go with frozen, look at Sir Donnerhall I or II, or San Amour. There are also a ton of Sandro Hit sons in the U.S. and Canada, if you decide to go with fresh semen. Some of them even have offspring showing successfully in hunters.

    You didn't mention if you have a registry preference, so that will also affect your choice. For instance, Sir Donnerhall II is not approved for Hanoverian breeding, but is approved Oldenburg (OHBS/GOV).

    Edited to add that I am sure other folks will give you some more ideas, and no doubt a few stallion owners will pop on here to tout their boys...
    Last edited by DownYonder; May. 1, 2013 at 07:19 AM.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    May. 14, 2004
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    1,367

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    Really nice looking mare from that angle. How is her length of back? I like her pedigree (Contucci/Feiner Stern).
    I am a HUGE fan of Donnerhall blood as well as Rotspon (Have 2 direct daughters and bred to him this year for a top quality colt).

    Rotspon can throw any size offspring. So if size is important to you, then be cautious. But temperment, intelligence and three correct gaits are very reliable from him. Most offspring have chrome and can be multi-talented.

    Donnerhall has done well with Feiner Stern blood. Dauphin is an approved son at Celle. This line is reliable to outstanding work ethics, walk and canter. In this case though, do not use a Donnerhall son with heavy bone. Both the mare and her pedigree are substantial for it.
    For marketability, you can not go wrong with DeNiro. But there are many very nice choices within that line, some right here in the USA if fresh is needed.

    If the dam had an approved son with Sandro Hit, then that line could be an option as well.
    I am going to reccomend one of my boys because of what they have thrown and what the mare's pedigree and photo show, not just because I own them.


    Don Principe (Donnerhall/Prince Thatch xx) had TB blood up close and does not throw heavy at all. Usually minimal chrome. He has been crossed with a Contucci dam and the resulting offspring have been both bay or chestnut. Very pretty with wonderful minds. Don Principe has competed at the highest CDI Grand Prix and his offspring are following rapidly in his hoofprints. Trained by amateur and pro alike.

    Doctor Wendell (Don Principe/Sandro Hit)might also do a superior job with her. He is black with a moderate amount of chrome. He is reccomended by the German Hanoverian inspector as a refiner. His first offspring, a colt out of a heavy boned Rotspon/Ramiro Son II dam, has the refinement I was looking for with a wonderful expression of gaits. A "10" walk and canter. Outgoing friendly and fearless. Also black. You can see a photo of "Doc" working with Ingred Klimke on the CHronicle blog about the Global Dressage forum and also pg 46 of Dressage Connections.

    Both are available fresh or frozen from Hilltyop Farm in MD.
    Maryanna Haymon- Marydell Farm - Home to Don Principe & Doctor Wendell MF
    www.marydellfarm.com
    2012 USDF Champion Breeder! 2007, 2011 USEF Champ Breeder
    2009,2010,2011 USDF Res Breeder of the Year!



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan. 1, 2010
    Posts
    283

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    How about Devon Heir? He has a great temperment, has been a refiner, and has offspring who do Dressage and hunters. He is beautiful, but does have chrome. I was unaware of Dressage people not liking chrome? The ones I know don't care. They care more about gaits and rideability. Good luck! Your mare sounds lovely!



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul. 5, 2002
    Location
    Brookline, NH 03033
    Posts
    1,041

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    She is lovely. Doesn't need to add any more length for sure.

    Schroeder is a super Sandro Hit x Escudo I son that is doing very well with his offspring in dressage and jumping and super minds. You mentioned she already had a 1/2 sibling by Sandro Hit so might be a good bloodline to consider. With the Escudo I in there you also get some good jump. I have a client that just posted a nice jumping picture on my facebook page.

    Kathy
    Majestic Gaits-Dutch Warmbloods,#1 USEF Dressage Sporthorse Breeder. #1 KWPN-NA Jumpers.Standing Navarone,Schroeder,Dante MG.VDL Frozen. Approval KWPN Han OLD RPSI BWP Canadian SWANA sBs SF Holst



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov. 5, 2000
    Posts
    9,314

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    Wow, she sure got the Freiherr/Furioso II chrome, didn't she?

    I think I would be tempted to see how she did with a Sandro Hit son, since they would likely suppress her chrome. As mentioned above, Schroeder has been doing well in the show ring. Another one to consider is Shakespeare RSF, who is now showing at PSG. Soprano is another very nice Sandro Hit son - premium stallion at his licensing and proven sire of some very good young horse competitors. He is also homozygous black with no chrome, so you would NOT get a red foal and he would suppress a lot of the white. I will also mention another Sandro Hit son that is homozyous for dark coats, and with minimal chrome - Sure Hit. He has shown to FEI dressage with his owner, played with some success in the hunters, and has offspring doing well in both hunters and in dressage.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul. 5, 2002
    Location
    Brookline, NH 03033
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    Most Sandro Hits throw leg and tall. Schroeder (Sandro Hit x Escudo I) throws leggy and super toplines along with very sweet trainable characters. He is modern though, but definately not small! We just had a gorgeous colt by him born that is huge!

    Kathy
    Majestic Gaits-Dutch Warmbloods,#1 USEF Dressage Sporthorse Breeder. #1 KWPN-NA Jumpers.Standing Navarone,Schroeder,Dante MG.VDL Frozen. Approval KWPN Han OLD RPSI BWP Canadian SWANA sBs SF Holst



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