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  1. #41
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    Jan. 14, 2012
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    Boise, Idaho
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    282

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    I don't get it with the plethora of cameras, phones and youtube.

    The last horse I sold I videoed ground manners, trailer loading,
    saddling and some riding. It didn't take that long although that was the only horse I was selling. Stuff like that can save people a trip if they don't like what they see or vice versa...she looks cool I want to see her. Doesn't really matter how much the horse is selling for. It doesn't have to be professionally produced. Just short clips that anyone can edit into a short youtube vid.

    Susan


    3 members found this post helpful.

  2. #42
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    Jun. 30, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by meupatdoes View Post
    I think you should post a video of yourself every time you demand one from someone else.
    I thought it a polite request which might be ignored/acknowledged as desired ...


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Mar. 13, 2013
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    52

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    Thank you all for the advice and stories, and suggestions for places to look =) I've just found this situation weird and stressful for what seemed like a pretty basic thing. I'm happy to drive a few hours to have a first look at a horse that I don't have much info about, but beyond that having a few questions answered and conformation shot or two is really important to me. I'd understand if they told me that they didn't have any, and it would be a while until they would...it's more the 'oh, yeah I have some pics - I'll send them to you tomorrow' that makes me wonder... Though I usually respond with 'awesome, as soon as it's convenient for you, no worries if it takes a bit' so maybe me trying not to be a bother comes across as I don't really care??


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  4. #44
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    Jul. 6, 2010
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    386

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    I didn't read all of the replies, so I apologize if this has already been said But when I was looking for a horse last year (and finally found one!), I found I got a lot farther if I put my phone number in the email or called if they had one listed. That way people knew I was truly serious and I could ask the health history when I was talking to them, and many people were more than happy to acommodate all of my questions. I made sure they understood I was several hours a way (usually the case for all I looked at), but would come a certain date (usually the next weekend) if I liked the pics and vid. But good luck with your search! I hope you find your new baby soon!



  5. #45
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    Jun. 30, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isabeau Z Solace View Post
    Or, if you live in my area, she'll be riding at the Memorial Weekend Show. You could catch her live!!

    Thanks for the tip
    I'll have to limit myself to video though as I hate flying



  6. #46
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2009
    Location
    Wisconsin
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    2,670

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    I will be honest, as a seller if I have a person email on my horses and I have nice video and pictures of them from show season or for the ones not shown have video and and photos of them from when it is not winter I don't want to go get more footage or photos. I take those at those times for a reason. Unless the horse has improved in training I don't take new video till it is nice out.

    Also, when I have people email me and say they have been seriously looking for 2 years but still haven't bought anything and then ask to see extra stuff those are the ones that I will write off. I have had to many of them waste my time either in email or when they come to see the horse put in an offer for them for a 1/4 of their price because that is all they can afford. And with the exception of two of my horses over the years they are all priced under $20,000 as we do resale.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Mar. 11, 2006
    Location
    Arizona
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    2,243

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    Truthfully, not trying to derail the thread; but, I do have a question to those both buying and selling. How many who get calls from long distance buyers asking for more video, pictures or simply expressing an interest and wish to come see the horse ask the potential buyer to supply video of their riding?

    Does this ever come into play with you? Buyers how prepared are you to comply with such a request?

    Years ago I had a holsteiner for sale who was very talented but needed a specific type of ride. The individual interested in him was flying in from outside the state. I had the horse with a trainer because quite frankly I did not want to deal with the whole selling nightmare. She was going to be out-of-town for a clinic and couldn't show the horse the one weekend the potential buyer was available so I ended up doing it. I as did the trainer explained very clearly what type of ride the horse needed to do well. We both got ad nauseum reports on how good this rider was/is (both from the potential buyer and her coach). She was looking for something that she could eventually show at CDIs. Well she arrived in sneakers, jeans and with her sponsor. She had no helmet, no clothes to change into. I lounged the horse and got on him myself. I then asked her where her boots, spurs, helmet, etc were? She informed me that she forgot them and didn't need them, refused to borrow mine. I refused to let her get on and at that time her sponsor who was a lawyer threatened to sue me for the cost of the trip. Let's just say the individual was still not allowed to get on my horse. I saw her later that year at a large show and was thankful that I NEVER gave her the opportunity to ride him. It would NOT have been a good match and probably nothing but a huge liability. Had I seen her ride before or around the time she inquired about my horse or at least a video of her riding I could have saved her the trip; but as it was we only had the word of she and her coach. We were very upfront with both of them; but, they felt she has the ability for such a horse.

    This is a huge reason why I prefer to sell locally. I have actually gone to see a potential buyer take a lesson once after calling to inquire about one I had for sale. After watching the lesson I had to tell their coach/trainer that what I had for sale wouldn't work for them. The horse went on to a more suitable situation and the potential buyer ended up buying a horse that really was a good match (I have watched her progress over the years at the local shows). I understand that buyers go to expense to travel to see horses (BTDT) and want to do what they can to make sure the horse could be the "right" one; but, I too feel that I have a responsibility to make sure the one coming to look is a good match for my horse. I don't want the buyer spending money unnecessarily any more than they do. I also don't want them getting on if they are over-horsed or overstated their abilities.

    I lucked out on a previous sale which was to someone far away. I searched youtube and found a video she had posted of her riding her current horse. She also had given me the name of her trainers/coaches who I actually knew. Because of those things I was comfortable to let her travel to come see my horse. I at least had some confidence that her skill level and that of the horse would be well matched. To me I was protecting her wallet as much as I was trying to protect my horse who I was selling but given that she is related to my stallion it was/is imperative that the buyer be a happy one
    Ranch of Last Resort
    www.annwylid.com


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  8. #48
    Join Date
    Jan. 24, 2000
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    Somewhere in the Midwest
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    I have thought many times to ask for a video of the rider. I had a dead quiet lower level packer type for sale...three buyers in a row (all came from FAR away) showed up that misrepresented their ability (First Level riders). All were afraid toe canter. First could not post, second had no idea the seat was an aid and could not hold the reins, third was terrified of horses in general and screamed bloody murder when the poor horse broke into a slow jog. Enough! So I changed her ad to scare people off and really screened subsequent lookers. Now there is Centerline Scores to verify claims of show records. I look them up and google in general to find any videos, photos, show records. The last horse I sold was a young horse so was very careful but It turned out great. As a recent buyer with a low 5 figure budget, it is ridiculous how you get blown off. 70% do not return calls or emails, the rest fail to answer simple questions or provide photos or video (riding horses). I ask for current videos if the one in your ad is 2 years old. I look up scores, etc. and almost all lie about the horse's records. So as a buyer or seller it is a slippery slope. My theme is "give me SOMETHING to want to buy a plane ticket!" Make me want to come see your horse and spend $1000 for travel. Thankfully I just found a gem so I hope my horse buying days are far behind me.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  9. #49
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    Mar. 25, 2012
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    72

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    Quote Originally Posted by NJRider View Post
    subsequent lookers. Now there is Centerline Scores to verify claims of show records. I look them up and google in general to find any videos, photos, show records.
    I would be interested in how you determine the competency of a rider by the data on Centerline Scores.



  10. #50
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    Jan. 24, 2000
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    Somewhere in the Midwest
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justice~for~Horses View Post
    I would be interested in how you determine the competency of a rider by the data on Centerline Scores.
    It is a tool. Also exposes the liars and frauds (like all the "trainers" out there) that claim to have done something they have not. Or when they say they are winners and champions but their scores are in the 40's and 50's. Here is an idea...just don't lie.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  11. #51
    Join Date
    May. 9, 2007
    Posts
    548

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    I have often wanted to ask a buyer for a video of them riding. They e-mail and ask all sorts of questions, request video etc., when i could tell very very quickly by a vid of them riding if the horse would suit.
    When people who tell me they've been riding 3rd level, and they get on my horse and can't even post the trot correctly, well.OMG, what do you say?
    would save everyone lots of time and angst for sure.



  12. #52
    Join Date
    Mar. 24, 2010
    Location
    Tucson
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    6,096

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    Quote Originally Posted by exvet View Post
    Truthfully, not trying to derail the thread; but, I do have a question to those both buying and selling. How many who get calls from long distance buyers asking for more video, pictures or simply expressing an interest and wish to come see the horse ask the potential buyer to supply video of their riding?

    Does this ever come into play with you? Buyers how prepared are you to comply with such a request?

    Years ago I had a holsteiner for sale who was very talented but needed a specific type of ride. The individual interested in him was flying in from outside the state. I had the horse with a trainer because quite frankly I did not want to deal with the whole selling nightmare. She was going to be out-of-town for a clinic and couldn't show the horse the one weekend the potential buyer was available so I ended up doing it. I as did the trainer explained very clearly what type of ride the horse needed to do well. We both got ad nauseum reports on how good this rider was/is (both from the potential buyer and her coach). She was looking for something that she could eventually show at CDIs. Well she arrived in sneakers, jeans and with her sponsor. She had no helmet, no clothes to change into. I lounged the horse and got on him myself. I then asked her where her boots, spurs, helmet, etc were? She informed me that she forgot them and didn't need them, refused to borrow mine. I refused to let her get on and at that time her sponsor who was a lawyer threatened to sue me for the cost of the trip. Let's just say the individual was still not allowed to get on my horse. I saw her later that year at a large show and was thankful that I NEVER gave her the opportunity to ride him. It would NOT have been a good match and probably nothing but a huge liability. Had I seen her ride before or around the time she inquired about my horse or at least a video of her riding I could have saved her the trip; but as it was we only had the word of she and her coach. We were very upfront with both of them; but, they felt she has the ability for such a horse.

    This is a huge reason why I prefer to sell locally. I have actually gone to see a potential buyer take a lesson once after calling to inquire about one I had for sale. After watching the lesson I had to tell their coach/trainer that what I had for sale wouldn't work for them. The horse went on to a more suitable situation and the potential buyer ended up buying a horse that really was a good match (I have watched her progress over the years at the local shows). I understand that buyers go to expense to travel to see horses (BTDT) and want to do what they can to make sure the horse could be the "right" one; but, I too feel that I have a responsibility to make sure the one coming to look is a good match for my horse. I don't want the buyer spending money unnecessarily any more than they do. I also don't want them getting on if they are over-horsed or overstated their abilities.

    I lucked out on a previous sale which was to someone far away. I searched youtube and found a video she had posted of her riding her current horse. She also had given me the name of her trainers/coaches who I actually knew. Because of those things I was comfortable to let her travel to come see my horse. I at least had some confidence that her skill level and that of the horse would be well matched. To me I was protecting her wallet as much as I was trying to protect my horse who I was selling but given that she is related to my stallion it was/is imperative that the buyer be a happy one
    I had been watching my filly's progress online for over two years before I bought her. She was my favorite young horse I saw online for my riding strengths and weaknesses, but I thought she would sell before I was ready to buy and that she might be beyond my ability, even with good professional help. Her breeder had another young horse who was under saddle I was interested in who was less flashy and shorter, and I thought might be a better fit. Well, her breeder and I happen to be friends on facebook, so she has seen videos/photos of my riding and knows where I'm strong and weak, and she told me that she was sure the two year old was a far better fit for me. When I went out I got to ride her full sister and absolutely loved her, and now am about to start the now-three-year old. But her breeder definitely tries to make correct matches, and if she thought she would be too much for me would have told me not to bother flying out.

    I think it's really hard when buyers are dishonest - one of my friends had a lot of that in trying to sell a horse who was trained solidly through third level with some movements above that. Since most potential buyers were coming from out of state it was really hard for her to deal with people who wanted to come even after she flat out told them they would be a poor fit.
    My horse is a dressage diva so I don't have to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by katarine
    If you have a fat gay horse that likes Parelli, you're really screwed



  13. #53
    Join Date
    Oct. 21, 2003
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    8,680

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    I have sent video of me riding to many people I. I will also let you add me as a friend on facebook so you can see who I am. I delete people later though, and fear I have offended people!


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  14. #54
    Join Date
    Nov. 24, 2002
    Location
    Northern KY
    Posts
    4,469

    Default I would simply not bother looking at a horse that did not include a video

    I don't know what the people who say "I won't do a video for anything under
    5K, because it isn't worth my time" do for a living. Maybe they are brain surgeons. For under 10K, my video request is "Just knock the dirt off, we aren't going to the prom, I know what I'm looking at". Horse is probably being riden or at least handled daily, a smart phone, u-tube video will work.

    If it's over 10K, and of course over 20K if it doesn't have a video, I'm not getting on a plane.

    I bought my last hunt horse off the best sales video I'd ever seen. Showed horse working, jumping, bathing, loading, going thru a shoulder deep ditch full of water and showed the guy standing on his back, sliding off his rump, pulling his tail and sticking his fingers up his nose then cracking a whip right in front of him. The video was so good I wired the money and had him shipped down.

    He was exactly what the video showed and was perfect.

    It probably took the guy two hours to get the whites white (paint horse, white from the shoulders down) and a half hour to shoot the video. So, guy spent three hours max to make a 12K sale. That's 4K/hour people, do the math, shoot the video, or don't post on here about whackadoodle buyers that aren't buying your fancy 3-4yr olds. I get a video per month from a guy in Denmark that I sent an "I'd like some more info" on a horse email. The horses look like they are going to an inspection.

    It's just not that hard.


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  15. #55
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    Aug. 15, 2010
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    1,678

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    Quote Originally Posted by partlycloudy View Post
    I have often wanted to ask a buyer for a video of them riding. They e-mail and ask all sorts of questions, request video etc., when i could tell very very quickly by a vid of them riding if the horse would suit.
    When people who tell me they've been riding 3rd level, and they get on my horse and can't even post the trot correctly, well.OMG, what do you say?
    would save everyone lots of time and angst for sure.
    Yeah, we hear all the time how awful the seller is - I actually find many horse sellers (especially breeders) are actually quite honest. But I've had a few potential buyers come out that should NOT be looking at green horses. I do ask questions and clarify that the green horses are GREEN - do you work with a trainer is one of my first questions?

    I had one buyer a few years ago who said she'd started several young horses, shown 2nd level, etc - no need for a regular trainer, she was very experienced. I had a nice, fairly green 4 year old - she was W/T/C, about 90 days under saddle. After less then a minute, I did ask her to get off and go look at other horses, this match wouldn't work - it was SO obvious she had not ridden green horses (or many horses - she didn't even know how to steer). Later found out she bought another green horse, went through about a year of hell and being bucked off and had to give that horse away I was relieved it wasn't my poor little mare who now had the bad reputation!

    On the bright side, I've met a lot of nice people - some who came and tried a green horse and admitted they weren't ready for something so green just yet, others who have brought along wonderful trainers and ended up with great teams. The horse business is a tough business, but after being in it for many years, there are a lot of great people involved too! We mostly hear about the problems, but I do like to remind everyone there are so many good buyers and sellers too.

    I will say - there are a lot of tire kickers who ask for special video and pics and then never exercise the professional courtesy of an email or phone call that just lets us know they aren't interested. And for the poster who said a phone call (or at least including a phone number) may help indicate a really serious buyer - YES! As a breeder who sells young horses - I really want to talk to interested people.

    And for those who say getting video is really easy - it isn't. It takes more then one person - and it takes decent equipment. I HATE video taken on cell phones - it is useless. Bad video and bad pictures can easily destroy a potential sale. And back in the days of FUGLY - it could land a decent horse on a nasty blog being ripped apart because many people can not tell the difference between good photos and bad!


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  16. #56
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    Jun. 7, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Couture TB View Post
    I will be honest, as a seller if I have a person email on my horses and I have nice video and pictures of them from show season or for the ones not shown have video and and photos of them from when it is not winter I don't want to go get more footage or photos. I take those at those times for a reason. Unless the horse has improved in training I don't take new video till it is nice out.
    I completely agree with this. If the video is current and accurately represents the horse a buyer would find if they tessellated to the barn aisle immediately, I will not go shoot another one for giggles. This is the horse. This is STILL the horse.


    The other thing I won't do is take a special head shot.
    You want to see what the horse's head looks like? Direct your eyes to the part of his pictures that SHOW HIS HEAD. We have five or six pictures under saddle that show his head from several angles, we have two conformation shots one from each sides neither of which has cut off his head, if you really must have a special head shot just use the crop tool on your home computer.



  17. #57
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    Aug. 26, 2008
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    1,770

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    exvet/partlycloudy, I have supplied videos of my riding (more often photos) to buyers several times, voluntarily. Usually it's about a size match, I would show them a horse I felt was "big enough" with me riding, then a horse I felt was "not big enough" and some background data.

    That helped reduce the number of times I went out to look at teensy little Arab crosses who might have sticked 16hh in shoes, with a winter coat and a wither mohawk...and wore Xnarrow saddles. I'm 5'11, a former Rugby front-rower. I'm not small. My legs are as long as most 6'0" to 6'2" mens'.

    One caution though, if you want to alienate buyers REALLY fast, give the impression that you're trying to find out if they are good enough for your precious, special-snowflake horse. I had one woman instruct me to counterbend her horse and travel on a diagonal, and insist that any beginner needed to master that skill before they should be cantering/jumping. Ummm, I guess so, that's one perspective. On the other hand, Thoroughbreds off the track are kind of notoriously hard in the body, and so while I was familiar with the IDEA of counterbend, I was used to asking for it a few strides at a time, on the straight, long side, and rewarding slight softening, then asking for regular bend again. She insisted that I curl the horse's neck and FLY sideways. To me, that kind of sustained counter-bent work is fairly advanced...and this horse was advertised as being w/t/c, but not much more. I told her that the horse obviously needed a more talented rider, and she agreed. He sold to a student of hers, which was obviously a much better fit for her...her students worship her and her word on riding is law.

    Then there was the woman selling the "show-ready" Arabian gelding. He was quite sweet, I really liked him, and was ready to pay her exorbitant price. Except that she insisted I needed to ride with my legs out in front of me (she rode saddleseat, and wondered why "everyone asked her that") AND when I sent her gelding out on a loose rein to warm up, she had a FIT and insisted that I bridle him up, to "ride him properly," which meant, to her, having his nose in his chest. I figured out pretty quickly why...when the gelding could SEE the arena, he was fairly green. Not a bad guy, but definitely not ready to show if you wanted to release the choke hold on the reins. When I asked if I could try him without the ring martingale, she scoffed that there was nothing wrong with ring martingales and I didn't know what I was talking about. So apparently not? I told her that I'd be wasting the horse's potential, and she agreed. He's still for sale, 3 years later, now down to half her original price.

    A lot of sellers wanted to know what I had done, riding-wise, and I was honest. I was also honest in what I wanted and very upfront about my price limit. If they'd asked to see a video of my riding, I probably wouldn't have provided it...but from the way people answer riding-related questions, and describe what they like in a horse, it seemed like most sellers could get a pretty good handle on the skill level. It's easier when the sellers have a few horses to try, but I did have good experiences with single horse sellers...I came to try the horse, and it was nice, as-described, I rode it ok, and it just didn't work for me for whatever reason. I don't think that's a terrible thing to have happen...for me as a buyer it was nice to try a good horse, and realize that it wasn't the best one FOR ME, but was still very nice and worth trying. As a potential buyer, I also appreciated being warned about any rules for the property. Even if they seem very basic, like "you need a helmet and boots to try out the horse, is that all right"...that's perfect for me. Usually I ask at that point about tack and other equipment too.
    Lifestyle coordinator for Zora, Spooky, Wolfgang and Warrior



  18. #58
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    Nov. 7, 2012
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    I have spent quite a lot of time looking over the last few months and have a few comments to make about what feels reasonable to expect in an ad from a buyer's perspective:

    1) Conformation shots
    2) Flat video
    3) jumping video if appropriate for horse's age and level of training

    In terms of interaction with sellers, at almost any price level, it feels reasonable to expect a return phone call or email within a couple of days. There are so many horses on the market, that if someone doesn't respond to multiple attempts to contact them over the course of a week or two, I have to assume they either sold the horse or aren't serious about selling.

    I've typically sent emails from my work address (w/ signature at the end) to make it clear I'm a serious adult not some unknown schmo on the 'net who is kicking tires. It's surprising how many people don't bother responding if only to say the horse was sold or whatever.

    I have met quite a few sellers who have been absolutely wonderful to interact with though.



  19. #59
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    Jan. 27, 2012
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    I was on that search last year and found my mare on Craigslist, of all places. I don't know what your price point is but mine was only about $2000 and I never ran into a problem getting pics once they knew I was serious.

    If I couldn't get at least a good pic of the horse's full body, I moved on.

    I figured if they don't have it together enough to at least be able to offer a good pic, there is something wrong. I know if I was selling my horse, it would be a very big, serious deal and I would have a lot of pics and videos to make sure I find the perfect match. Sounds like some sellers just aren't too worried about it.



  20. #60
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    Aug. 30, 2001
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    Purcellville, VA
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    I like to buy yearlings to two year olds. Or Horses on the track. In neither case do I expect to ride.

    My last purchase was a long yearling at Hilltop Farm in MD in Dec 2011. You know, they want the horses to go onto a nice life, being well cared for. Showing is not essential. The fact that I am an amateur who considers a 60 or higher an accomplishment did not make my experience any different.

    I keep most of my horses for life, they do what they like best. I hope to eventually earn my USDF gold medal. I got my bronze last year on my mare I bought as a yearling in 2005. I hope to get my silver on her, soundness and money gods willing.

    I only look at horses when it is time to buy and I usually only look at a couple before I buy one. Personality is key for my horses.

    the result? I have horses that I ride, perhaps to lackluster scores, but I ride for fun first.

    The rare sales horse, video and pictures are provided. I never take on a horse I am not willing to care for until death because buyers are nuts and are looking for a perfectly machined bicycle, not a living animal, so there is always a chance that my sound horse won't vet to this standard.



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