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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec. 20, 2009
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    Default Derby points system

    So I just read somewhere (for the first time) that the points system did not award ANY points for FILLY races... Thus no filly can qualify for as long as this process is in place.
    ARE THEY KIDDING? Granted there haven't been many winners, but still some very good, solid performances from the girls.
    We don't get less brave; we get a bigger sense of self-preservation........



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
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    Baltimore, MD
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    19,592

    Default

    Nothing stopping them from running in any of the qualifiers though.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2009
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    549

    Default

    If a filly is that good, why not run against the boys BEFORE the derby?



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul. 2, 1999
    Posts
    17,599

    Default

    Kentucky Oaks point races are restricted by sex, whereas Kentucky Derby point races are unrestricted by sex.

    Keep in mind with two recent filly winners of the Derby, both had hit the board in races that allocate Derby points: Genuine Risk finished 3rd in the Wood Memorial and Winning Colors won the Santa Anita Derby. Any filly who did the same this year would be in the Derby.

    There has been some talk - because a filly in the Derby generally boosts interest - that perhaps a fraction of accumulated Oaks points might be applicable towards the Derby.

    e.g., 50% of the Oaks points by Flashy Gray (which are 60 points) would be applied to the Derby ... meaning 30-points and that would've gotten her in. Although knocked a colt out of the Derby

    I'm not entirely sure they need to accommodate fillies as such.


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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar. 10, 2006
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    4,355

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 2tempe View Post
    So I just read somewhere (for the first time) that the points system did not award ANY points for FILLY races... Thus no filly can qualify for as long as this process is in place.
    ARE THEY KIDDING? Granted there haven't been many winners, but still some very good, solid performances from the girls.
    That is a blatant mistruth. All points races are OPEN company and UNrestricted by sex. A filly can run in any of those races.
    Awarding points to sex restricted filly races would be unfair to male horses.

    Three fillies have won the Derby... Regret, Winning Colors, Genuine Risk. ALL THREE of them ran in Open company before the Derby.


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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct. 20, 2001
    Location
    San Jose, CA
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    1,105

    Default

    The points system alone is absurd. There was nothing wrong with graded stakes winnings determining the field. The points system excludes not just fillies but also foreign horses, unless they run in the UAE Derby. It has essentially become a race restricted to American colts.

    Yes, a filly could run in the open races and qualify, but often connections are worried about that taking too much out of her. If you're going to get one big race against colts from a filly, better to make it in the Derby and not in a prep where you are forced to be all out to get points just to get a shot.

    Frankly the points system was unnecessary. It was designed as a marketing gimmick to create some kind of fervor about earning points. It's just dumb.

    If they want to give points, it should be for any graded stakes race, not just a select few they decide on, and if they want they can give lower points for restricted (filly) races if they want.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar. 10, 2006
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    4,355

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zevida View Post
    The points system alone is absurd. There was nothing wrong with graded stakes winnings determining the field. The points system excludes not just fillies but also foreign horses, unless they run in the UAE Derby. It has essentially become a race restricted to American colts.

    Yes, a filly could run in the open races and qualify, but often connections are worried about that taking too much out of her. If you're going to get one big race against colts from a filly, better to make it in the Derby and not in a prep where you are forced to be all out to get points just to get a shot.

    Frankly the points system was unnecessary. It was designed as a marketing gimmick to create some kind of fervor about earning points. It's just dumb.

    If they want to give points, it should be for any graded stakes race, not just a select few they decide on, and if they want they can give lower points for restricted (filly) races if they want.
    It was actually designed so that CDI could give preference to races at their tracks. They own the Derby, they want to own the run up to it too.

    But no matter, I'll take the points system over GS earnings. It allows certain races and distances to be de-emphasised, i.e 2yo races and races less than 1 mile. In the past if you won some $1m race for 2yos at a bull ring in Louisiana on a friday night in NOV you were guaranteed entry. Sorry, no thanks.
    The points system takes out the pure sprinters and horses that ran well as 2yos but haven't run a lick as 3yos.

    As regards foreign entries, over the last 15 years all the foreign runners have been supplied by either Coolmore or Godolphin and they all qualified in the past by virtue of either a) earnings from win or placing in the BC Juvenile or b) win or placing in the UAE Derby. Those routes are still available, just with points instead of GS earnings. There are no Graded Stakes run in Europe pre- May 1st, so any GS earnings would be from 2yo races, and 2yo races in Europe don't have big purses. No Euro horse would qualify on GS earnings alone, if it were not for BC races and UAE Derby. So your point does not hold water.

    And people need to give it up with the filly whining. They have every opportunity to qualify.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec. 20, 2009
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    Drvmb1ggl3 - My bad! Didn't stop to think that yes the girls could run in the races. I'll take a deep breath and go watch the Oaks....
    We don't get less brave; we get a bigger sense of self-preservation........



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