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  1. #161
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    Jan. 27, 2003
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    Quote Originally Posted by skydy View Post
    Well, that was unpleasant. I had to stop after reading 3 blog posts.
    I just read a lot more than 3 posts...and I'm in an odd position of feeling kind of sorry for the girl. Despite years of riding, she's a newbie, bought an inappropriate horse for her that didn't seem to vet well but trainer told her findings weren't a big deal. Just like the rest of us, she loves her horse, inappropriate or not and wants to succeed with him. Unfortunately, someone has taught her that shortcuts are okay.

    Her world could very easily come crashing down because of an overshare on a blog. I certainly hope she learns the lessons to be had, finds herself someone who can teach her real horsemanship and grows from this experience.
    Keith: "Now...let's do something normal fathers and daughters do."
    Veronica: "Buy me a pony?"


    9 members found this post helpful.

  2. #162
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    Jul. 21, 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by RugBug View Post
    I just read a lot more than 3 posts...and I'm in an odd position of feeling kind of sorry for the girl. Despite years of riding, she's a newbie, bought an inappropriate horse for her that didn't seem to vet well but trainer told her findings weren't a big deal. Just like the rest of us, she loves her horse, inappropriate or not and wants to succeed with him. Unfortunately, someone has taught her that shortcuts are okay.

    Her world could very easily come crashing down because of an overshare on a blog. I certainly hope she learns the lessons to be had, finds herself someone who can teach her real horsemanship and grows from this experience.
    Findeight has offered to talk to her, so perhaps something positive can come out of this mess.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #163
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    Sep. 30, 2010
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    SE PA
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    I spent an hour trying to find out the trainer, and couldn't find anyone on horseshowsonline with 3 wins and 3 3rds. I am very local to this girl and trying to find a trainer for myself. If someone would be willing to message me the name of the trainer so I don't go with them I would appreciate it.

    I am pretty sure I have contacted every decent (assuming) trainer available in my area to come out to me, as I don't have a trailer. Almost no one is willing to. The law of averages says this idiot, will be the one willing to come to my barn.

    If you are uncomfortable because you don't know me, message me, and I will share my full name. My screen name is a shortened version of it. Totally not a troll.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  4. #164
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    Jul. 21, 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexS View Post
    I spent an hour trying to find out the trainer, and couldn't find anyone on horseshowsonline with 3 wins and 3 3rds. I am very local to this girl and trying to find a trainer for myself. If someone would be willing to message me the name of the trainer so I don't go with them I would appreciate it.

    I am pretty sure I have contacted every decent (assuming) trainer available in my area to come out to me, as I don't have a trailer. Almost no one is willing to. The law of averages says this idiot, will be the one willing to come to my barn.

    If you are uncomfortable because you don't know me, message me, and I will share my full name. My screen name is a shortened version of it. Totally not a troll.
    I found it easily by following the directions posted on this thread.



  5. #165
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    Jun. 17, 2001
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    down the road from bar.ka
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    Quote Originally Posted by skydy View Post
    Findeight has offered to talk to her, so perhaps something positive can come out of this mess.
    She is welcome to PM me and everything will be confidential, but so far, nothing.

    would somebody else care to PM me the trainer name? I don't have time to fool with it, not at home near my desktop and the iPhone has its limits as far as screen size and multistep searches.
    When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

    The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  6. #166
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    May. 5, 2009
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    Location: Indiana, but my heart is in Zone II
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    F8- you are a credit to horsewomen.
    Come to the dark side, we have cookies


    3 members found this post helpful.

  7. #167
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    Jun. 9, 2005
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    Unionville, PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canaqua View Post
    Now, take the Googling a bit further...check out trainer's very close "connections" and figure out why complaining to the show management folks in that area won't help at all.
    I guess you are right about that. I wonder if this will effect their business? Probably not....
    Delaware Park Canter Volunteer
    http://www.canterusa.org/



  8. #168
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by findeight View Post
    She is welcome to PM me and everything will be confidential, but so far, nothing.

    would somebody else care to PM me the trainer name? I don't have time to fool with it, not at home near my desktop and the iPhone has its limits as far as screen size and multistep searches.
    Hi, FindEight ... I PM'd you the information.
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.



  9. #169
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Just to clarify for everyone ... the rider participated in the following divisions:
    Limited Adult Equitation
    Adult Pleasure

    Both very minor and good introductory divisions - IMO

    I have a question though ... I've always thought the Limited Divisions were for "lesson" horses. I couldn't find a Prize List for the show, but am I wrong? I don't think this horse sounds like it is a lesson horse at all.
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.



  10. #170
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    Jun. 20, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammicat View Post
    Just to clarify for everyone ... the rider participated in the following divisions:
    Limited Adult Equitation
    Adult Pleasure

    Both very minor and good introductory divisions - IMO

    I have a question though ... I've always thought the Limited Divisions were for "lesson" horses. I couldn't find a Prize List for the show, but am I wrong? I don't think this horse sounds like it is a lesson horse at all.
    Limit is generally for those riders or in the case of limit hunter: horses, that haven't won a certain amount of blue ribbons at an A or AA show. The number is usually around 6-8. Academy classes are the ones that are usually for schooling horses or those in the schooling program.
    .אני יכול לעשות הכל על ידי אלוהים


    1 members found this post helpful.

  11. #171
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    The whole situation gets more and more unacceptable ... IMO. After everyone posted their "wow" comments as they discovered who the trainer was, I too decided to look at the connection. Now I have a bunch of questions ... because I am new to the world of showing:

    - Is it inappropriate for the trainer to have her students competing in a show where there is obviously a very tight connection? I know that you are not supposed to compete at a show where your trainer is also a judge.

    - The trainer is going for "r" judges license. Is there any way that the USEF would deny this given the information provided in the Blog?
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  12. #172
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunterrider23 View Post
    Limit is generally for those riders or in the case of limit hunter: horses, that haven't won a certain amount of blue ribbons at an A or AA show. The number is usually around 6-8. Academy classes are the ones that are usually for schooling horses or those in the schooling program.
    That's right ... I always get that confused I really appreciate the clarification.
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.



  13. #173
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    Location: Indiana, but my heart is in Zone II
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammicat View Post
    The whole situation gets more and more unacceptable ... IMO. After everyone posted their "wow" comments as they discovered who the trainer was, I too decided to look at the connection. Now I have a bunch of questions ... because I am new to the world of showing:

    - Is it inappropriate for the trainer to have her students competing in a show where there is obviously a very tight connection? I know that you are not supposed to compete at a show where your trainer is also a judge.

    - The trainer is going for "r" judges license. Is there any way that the USEF would deny this given the information provided in the Blog?
    Judges will chime in but I believe you have to get accepted by the USEF committee?
    Come to the dark side, we have cookies



  14. #174
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    May. 11, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammicat View Post
    - Is it inappropriate for the trainer to have her students competing in a show where there is obviously a very tight connection? I know that you are not supposed to compete at a show where your trainer is also a judge.
    There are plenty of farms that host shows in my area (many of them A rated) where the students of the farm show as well. I don't consider it a conflict as long as there is no direct connection with the judge.

    Then again....we all know how subjective hunter judging is and how small the horse world is. But you would see that anywhere....

    Anyway, particularly for a local show, it's fine. Our farm has hosted shows for our local circuit in the past where many of the students participated, and it really didn't make a difference how you placed. In my opinion the only benefit to the rider is that they can take their horse back to their stall and not the trailer



  15. #175
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    Nov. 4, 2011
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    I'm vehemently against drugging but I think this thread is awful. This girl is a beginner level rider who clearly loves her horse, spends more time with her horse than the average rider by the sound of it, makes time to take care of her horse at the crack of dawn before work and helps her barnmates at shows. There is no malice behind what she wrote. The person truly at fault is the trainer and the proverbial system. This girl only knows what she knows because of the people training her.

    Anyone making fun of a beginner rider should be ashamed. It doesn't help the rider or horse, doesn't encourage learning and seeking advice outside her circle and is just plain bad horsemanship.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  16. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by marginall View Post
    I'm vehemently against drugging but I think this thread is awful. This girl is a beginner level rider who clearly loves her horse, spends more time with her horse than the average rider by the sound of it, makes time to take care of her horse at the crack of dawn before work and helps her barnmates at shows. There is no malice behind what she wrote. The person truly at fault is the trainer and the proverbial system. This girl only knows what she knows because of the people training her.

    Anyone making fun of a beginner rider should be ashamed. It doesn't help the rider or horse, doesn't encourage learning and seeking advice outside her circle and is just plain bad horsemanship.
    IF the rider was unaware that what she did was wrong, then I absolutely agree with you! However, the rider clearly knows that drugging is wrong and has made several justifications for it. Beginner or no, there are ramifications for her actions and she is old enough to have to deal with those! I'm sorry, but that is life, and, she needs to own up to it. That said, I don't think people are being overly harsh, and no one is making fun of her. People are calling out her bad behavior - and rightly so.

    As far as the trainer ... I completely and 100% agree with you!!!!! She is totally at fault in this AND knows better AND is in a position of authority both in her barn and in the show ring. It is deplorable, and I hope that there are consequences for her actions.
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  17. #177
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    Aug. 28, 2012
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    Kansas
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    Quote Originally Posted by grandprixjump View Post
    If a printout of that blog, ended up at the feed store, tack shop, and especially at the show on the sales board...
    grandprixjump:
    I like the way you think.

    Regarding the drugging:
    Definitely not restricted to the hunter world. My background is (non-sored) flat-shod TWH and Arabians. I would expect this to be a problem across all breeds and disciplines.

    What bothers me the most is that the blogger firmly believes that this is entirely appropriate culturally normative behavior.

    Plus, the wall-of-text writing is painful to read.
    Last edited by californianinkansas; Apr. 27, 2013 at 01:13 PM. Reason: typo


    2 members found this post helpful.

  18. #178
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by RugBug View Post
    Complaints filed in court and news articles are, I believe, considered valid sources for discussion topics. Blogs are not even remotely similar. They are the musings of whomever decides they want to take the time to blog.
    I think someone who writes a blog about their nefarious dealings is fair game. They are stupid, but fair game. How do you get a more direct (and presumably accurate) account than that? If the trainer wants to rebut the story, she/he can do that.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


    4 members found this post helpful.

  19. #179
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    Aug. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennywell Bay View Post
    This reminds me of a "trainer" in my old area. Just has a bad reputation in general over many things (how her horses come to shows bone thin, etc, reported to the SPCA 3 times, once by a VET). At a local series she takes a slew of backyard horses to, she used a different Coggins for one horse and got caught, got a slap on the wrist. Drugged a horse IN FRONT OF PEOPLE, had a big old welt on its neck and one of the observers went to management. Management said though they don't condone it, they can't afford testing.
    One person who keeps their horse with her but takes care of it herself ("trainer" can't be trusted not to steal your grain and hay but is cheapest around, don't get me started). She sends young horse who trainer "trained" and showed last year to a NEW trainer for a trial to help prep for rated shows (since original trainer is shunned at bigger shows and can't present a horse to save her life). Original "trainer" had a fit.
    Do you want to guess what happened? "New" trainer got on horse and said
    "It's barely broke?"
    " OH no, this horse showed last year. It is very broke. It was reserve in w/t/c"
    Goes to a show, horse is a basket case. New trainer is done.
    Horse goes back to original trainer and guess what-IT is PERFECT at the next show 1 week later. Oh, but very tired because, you know, "SHE" knows how to work it down".
    (Did I mention horse is showing in YH at Devon?)
    Point is, as long as owner turn a blind eye (or obviously some owners just accept it) and smaller shows just don't have the resources, and people still train with these people, this problem goes on.

    I guess taking the easy way is the culture now. I find it hard to believe a newbe but ADULT rider still finds it acceptable to drug their horse. It is sad and disgusting.
    I used to be a (mexican-american) groom in the late '80s; we are the invisible ones at shows, but we see and hear everything. This kind of thing has always gone on. The only difference is that the internet and social media make it exponentially easier to expose these ghastly practices. Back then, it was vastly more difficult to prove that what you saw actually occurred.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  20. #180
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    Aug. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by hundredacres View Post
    I can relate to this. I had a young boarder who would keep her horses with me seasonally. It was her first time owning horses and the very first trainer they came across, was also the man who sold them her horses. She rode WP, which I knew nothing at all about, but I knew his reputation and was disappointed. Long story short, they left when I wouldn't hang the mare in her stall. After a couple of years, they came back, begging for a safe place, telling me they are sorry for all they've put the horses through. I hate to think of it - I knew they were bashing them in the head for head tosses, but never had the teeth done once. They used spades and used them as weapons . I have since bought the mare, a friend bought the gelding.
    I couldn't reach them myself, because I wasn't a trainer - what did I know? Thank goodness eventually they became educated enough to question him and his tactics. In the interem though, I was a dumb@$$ and they had their "professional trainer". I'm just glad they finally came round. I hope this young blogger has the same epiphany.

    ETA: obviously though, some people will always be cheaters and abusers. That's why we have the trainers like the bloggers and my boarder's. So, it will depend entirely on this bloggers conscience...if she has none, she'll only go on to perpetuate the cheating.
    Thank you for rescuing this mare.



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