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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec. 19, 2012
    Posts
    518

    Default Succeed users - past and present

    Following up my post from a few months ago about my older mare who I was having trouble putting weight on. Fast forward 3 months and she is looking a lot better, vet was out Monday and is pleased. Said to keep up the current amounts of grain, alfalfa cubes, rice bran, beet pulp, corn oil, flax seed, as well as daily grass and 24/7 hay.

    Horse has now been on Succeed paste for 5 weeks and in that short amount of time I have seen a remarkable difference in her weight gain and appetite. I am doing the 2 month Succeed trial through the company but want to continue dosing with Succeed daily once the trial ends. However, the cost is a huge hurdle. I spoke with Larry at Succeed and he said to speak with my vet as they can order it practically at cost and then charge me less than the company would charge me. Unfortunately the price my vet quoted me was not much lower than what the company charges and I am not able to continue to spend $100/month on this. I spoke with another vet who said, "I can sell it to you for $150 per month"... Um, no thanks!

    Long-term Succeed users, vets, barn managers, show people, anybody: Is there a way one of you can help me find a more affordable rate for Succeed? I'm not sure who else to call or ask and I really, really, really want to continue to see my mare improve. I have always paid my horse bills on time, schedule supplements to be auto-shipped so they never run out, etc. and I would like to add Succeed to the list. Appreciate any suggestions you all may have. Thank you!



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 9, 2006
    Posts
    1,064

    Default

    You can get Succeed in a 'feed' form for just under $100 from Smartpakequine. You can buy it by the tub for around that much from several vendors.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec. 19, 2012
    Posts
    518

    Default

    ^Thanks mjhco, unfortunately my horse won't eat the granules but gobbles up the paste when it's top dressed on her feed. Go figure! I'm currently paying $100 per month for it.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr. 14, 2001
    Location
    Fort Collins, CO
    Posts
    16,258

    Default

    Isn't Succeed mostly oat flour and oat oil? Perhaps it would be worth trying to recreate it on your own? It's not like those ingredients are costly.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov. 8, 2012
    Location
    gulf coast
    Posts
    926

    Default

    If you are in touch with the company, can you ask them what flavor they use in the paste? I would hope, to keep you using their product, they would share that info.
    If not, I feed: 1 cup oat flour (Whole Foods bulk area) 1 cup flax seed (Whole Foods bulk area) and 1 teaspoon L-glutamine powder (Whole foods vitamin/suppliment area) per day. Half in the am/ half in the pm. To make a large batch- 8 days or 16 servings-
    8 cups Oat flour + 8 cups Flax seed +2/3 cup L-glutamine. Don't know if this is will work like Succeed does, but horses all like and eat it mixed with food.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec. 19, 2012
    Posts
    518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by csaper58 View Post
    If you are in touch with the company, can you ask them what flavor they use in the paste? I would hope, to keep you using their product, they would share that info.
    If not, I feed: 1 cup oat flour (Whole Foods bulk area) 1 cup flax seed (Whole Foods bulk area) and 1 teaspoon L-glutamine powder (Whole foods vitamin/suppliment area) per day. Half in the am/ half in the pm. To make a large batch- 8 days or 16 servings-
    8 cups Oat flour + 8 cups Flax seed +2/3 cup L-glutamine. Don't know if this is will work like Succeed does, but horses all like and eat it mixed with food.
    Thank you for the detailed reply of what exactly and where in the store you get the ingredients to make your own version of Succeed. I may try that if I can't get a reasonable price for it. I'm gong to call them next week to ask for the paste flavouring and beg for mercy.

    I know enough about medical and pharmaceutical stuff to know that the actual cost is probably very low, say $25 per month, so vets would have access to it for say $50 and then could charge whatever else on top to their clients to keep the sustained income. I understand this, however I have used the same vet for over a decade and their price was not much less than what I'm paying from the company currently which is $100 per month. There has to be a middle ground between being greedy and making a small bit of money for the time and effort required to set up an auto-delivery.

    I'm hoping some show people chime in on what they pay per month since I know it's very popular in that arena. If I could get a better idea of what others are getting then I may have a better case with the company.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr. 14, 2001
    Location
    Fort Collins, CO
    Posts
    16,258

    Default

    Unless your vet buys in quantity--a LOT of quantity--they might not get a better price from the company...so don't just assume they're trying to screw you.

    You might try calling my local vet supply place, Mountain Vet, and just checking price there. It's often VERY good, because they are a licensed pharmacy and DO often purchase in quantity, and are very good about passing their savings on to their customers (long time COTH readers will remember the excellent deals they used to get on Gastrogard, Legend and Adequan from Mountain Vet, before they got nailed for shipping RX goods out of state.) Their phone # is 970.484.2200. No website or anything...you gotta call them.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun. 28, 2004
    Posts
    175

    Default

    Just as a FWIW, I have a horse who was treated for ulcers (actually more than once) and really showed improvement after I added a cup of oat flour to her daily feed. Suddenly she was licking her pan clean and actually following me around begging for handouts (totally new for her). I can really only attribute the changes to the addition of oat flour and assume that she had hind gut ulcers that remains after the ulcer treatment.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov. 20, 2010
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    4,162

    Default

    Please excuse a bit of a hijacking of this thread. Been reading it thinking ahead to problem solving my horse's weight issues.

    My question (also based on some reading here on COTH) - do horses with hind gut ulcers usually have loose stools? Mine doesn't at all. Nice and firm and regular. Drinks plenty of water. An eating machine.

    Background: He's a 10yo 16.3 OTTB. For the past year have had him at a barn on 24/7 turnout, with unlimited hay available. This last place had a novice owner, and I've questioned the provision of hay in the off season (even offering to pay extra). He was much better when the grass was in. The amounts given him did seem stingy and he's ribby. After much cajoling and pleading and being scoffed at, soon-to-be-ex BO began to use the Nibble Net I purchased and added more hay.

    Moving to new place with top drawer barn manager who will be working with me. But I'm thinking of all the possibilities. Having his teeth floated again this week by specialist. Just took a fecal sample and it's fine for now. Will be doing one again in the near future.

    I know on the track he had ulcers, but don't they all... Last year, before moving him from very limited turnout to 24/7, tried treating him for ulcers - first w/ omeprazole which made no difference. Then with gastrogard which didn't either. 24/7 helped. New barn has excellent turnout, but not 24/7. New manager and I have been thinking ahead to treating for hind gut ulcers?

    Thanks!
    Being right half the time beats being half-right all the time. Malcolm Forbes



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar. 7, 2008
    Location
    Spokane, WA
    Posts
    242

    Default

    My horse has had both gastric and hind-gut ulcers, and she has never gone off her feed and her stool has never really been loose except when the gastric ulcers were at their very worse. I cleared the gastric ulcers up with omeprazole (blue pop rocks), but she still wasn't quite right. 1/4 cup of oat flour has made all the difference and cleared up the last few symptoms. It is cheap ($5 worth from my local health food store lasts ~6 weeks) and my horse eats it with no problem, so it is easy to try.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2001
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta, Canada, North America, Earth
    Posts
    1,078

    Default

    CVPeg - my gelding was diagnosed with hind gut ulcers and he never had loose stools at all and was never off his feed. He was gas colicky all the time tho and very very girthy.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec. 19, 2012
    Posts
    518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CVPeg View Post
    Please excuse a bit of a hijacking of this thread. Been reading it thinking ahead to problem solving my horse's weight issues.

    My question (also based on some reading here on COTH) - do horses with hind gut ulcers usually have loose stools? Mine doesn't at all. Nice and firm and regular. Drinks plenty of water. An eating machine.
    It is my understanding that hind gut ulcers are the most difficult to treat because you can not easily identify them. My horse has always had nice well-formed stools but her tummy sometimes would growl something fierce and she would look a little distressed, then go back to eating. Messy stools are a sign of frontal ulcers and something like psyllium (powdered, given 1-2x/d) which is a binding agent would help with that. The way we figured out my mare had hind gut ulcers was by a very long and extensive process of elimination. We kept her on exactly the same feed and same place and same quantities, then slowly changed one thing at a time to see if there was a reaction. Pulled enormous quantities of bloodwork and it all came back within normal limits (WNL). Horse gets quite a lot of additional supplements daily to help get water into her so dehydration was never a big concern. Her fecal checks were normal, teeth floated twice a year, no change in pasture mates or anything. Started targeting her for hind end ulcers and right away noticed a change. Just my experience and opinion, but it can't hurt to try your horse on something and see if it helps!

    Where does one buy oat flour??



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec. 19, 2012
    Posts
    518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Simkie View Post
    Unless your vet buys in quantity--a LOT of quantity--they might not get a better price from the company...so don't just assume they're trying to screw you.

    You might try calling my local vet supply place, Mountain Vet, and just checking price there. It's often VERY good, because they are a licensed pharmacy and DO often purchase in quantity, and are very good about passing their savings on to their customers (long time COTH readers will remember the excellent deals they used to get on Gastrogard, Legend and Adequan from Mountain Vet, before they got nailed for shipping RX goods out of state.) Their phone # is 970.484.2200. No website or anything...you gotta call them.
    I tried to respond to you twice but my text blocks keep disappearing or ending up somewhere else. 3rd time's the charm! The only reason I became suspicious and got a bit irritated was because the Succeed rep assured me that my vet would absolutely be able to get a better deal in the long-term than ordering it through the company. I don't like this run-around crap. I'll give Mountain Vet a call, thanks for the tip. Where do you buy oat flour?



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar. 7, 2008
    Location
    Spokane, WA
    Posts
    242

    Default

    I buy my oat flour at my local health food store. It is not expensive. Or, you can buy oats and use a food processor/blender to turn it into flour yourself.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov. 20, 2010
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    4,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TBPONY View Post
    It is my understanding that hind gut ulcers are the most difficult to treat because you can not easily identify them. My horse has always had nice well-formed stools but her tummy sometimes would growl something fierce and she would look a little distressed, then go back to eating. Messy stools are a sign of frontal ulcers and something like psyllium (powdered, given 1-2x/d) which is a binding agent would help with that. The way we figured out my mare had hind gut ulcers was by a very long and extensive process of elimination. We kept her on exactly the same feed and same place and same quantities, then slowly changed one thing at a time to see if there was a reaction. Pulled enormous quantities of bloodwork and it all came back within normal limits (WNL). Horse gets quite a lot of additional supplements daily to help get water into her so dehydration was never a big concern. Her fecal checks were normal, teeth floated twice a year, no change in pasture mates or anything. Started targeting her for hind end ulcers and right away noticed a change. Just my experience and opinion, but it can't hurt to try your horse on something and see if it helps!

    Where does one buy oat flour??
    Great - think that's just what we'll do after he's moved this week. Bad enough we haven't been able to keep him quite in condition. And they say ulcers can have so much to do with funky feet. Wouldn't it be wonderful if this was the key!
    Being right half the time beats being half-right all the time. Malcolm Forbes



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Oct. 12, 2005
    Location
    Va
    Posts
    2,860

    Default

    If you buy oats and grind it into flour, how is that different than just feeding the plain whole oats? Aren't the nutrients the same?



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