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  1. #21
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    Of course the sisterhood will act all uppity and claim that they must save these horses, but as always, it is just talk. They have no more intention to save horses in Spain than they do in the U.S. Remember, Wayne wants all animals dead in one generation!



  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by spookhorse View Post
    I have a hard time wrapping my bead around people wanting to pay big bucks to import these horses when there are so many in the US that need homes and groceries. The transport, import, and quarantine fees for one horse is in the thousands of dollars, yet sometimes only a few dollars and a little work will save a horse in your own county.
    Yes, those horses are like Gypsy Vanners, Friesians and such, fad breeds.
    Then, for those that those kinds of horses appeal to, just like some like chihuahuas, others great danes, why not?

    Mind you, I like them also, admire them, but consider them of limited uses, so would not have one on just "liking" them, if I don't have any direct use for them, is not what fits my riding.


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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Yes, those horses are like Gypsy Vanners, Friesians and such, fad breeds.
    Then, for those that those kinds of horses appeal to, just like some like chihuahuas, others great danes, why not?

    Mind you, I like them also, admire them, but consider them of limited uses, so would not have one on just "liking" them, if I don't have any direct use for them, is not what fits my riding.
    I realize that many of us have a "type" or preference for a breed of horse, but its not like Spanish horses of all breeds aren't here on US soil needing rescue. There was just an Andalusian mare and her half Arab offspring on the Giveaways forum recently. Where are all those Spanish horse lovers for those horses here?


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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Yes, those horses are like Gypsy Vanners, Friesians and such, fad breeds.
    Then, for those that those kinds of horses appeal to, just like some like chihuahuas, others great danes, why not?

    Mind you, I like them also, admire them, but consider them of limited uses, so would not have one on just "liking" them, if I don't have any direct use for them, is not what fits my riding.
    I realize that many of us have a "type" or preference for a breed of horse, but its not like Spanish horses of all breeds aren't here on US soil needing rescue. There was just an Andalusian mare and her half Arab offspring on the Giveaways forum recently. Where are all those Spanish horse lovers for those horses here?



  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by spookhorse View Post
    I realize that many of us have a "type" or preference for a breed of horse, but its not like Spanish horses of all breeds aren't here on US soil needing rescue. There was just an Andalusian mare and her half Arab offspring on the Giveaways forum recently. Where are all those Spanish horse lovers for those horses here?
    Yes, that was a chance to get a horse of the "rare" kind AND a rescue to boot, so you can use that in your signature and to brag every chance on internet forums.
    Yep, some live for that and that is ok, whatever floats their boat.
    I have to say the rest of us like the stories, they are heartwarming, I agree.

    Similar as the 200+ dogs our local rescue lady flew over from the hurricane, that made the news locally for days and brought out so many adopters.
    Once those dogs were placed, in less than three weeks, any more callers were directed to our animal control shelter, that has identical dogs for adoption, but the callers were not interested, they wanted a "hurricane rescue" dog, no other would do.

    I would expect that kind of mentality is the ones that would have been all over that one horse like roosters on a June bug.

    Fine, if it gets the horse or dog a good home, just gives pause about humans and their motivations some times.


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  6. #26
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    Sep. 11, 2008
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    I actually agree with you on the Michael Vick thing. I think it undermines HSUS's credibility which in the long run is a good thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    The mark of zealots, fanatics for their causes, they will defend even the indefensible at any cost, here the HSUS and the Vick connection.

    Honestly, after what that man did, why would any decent human think it is good PR to put him on display for your cause?
    Only another a twisted mind could think that makes any sense:

    http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=6510


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Irish Draughts were sent to slaughter en masse after WWII. I would hate to see this happen to the Spanish horses. Yes I know that there are horses in need in NA and i have donated to help them. But if anyone knows of a fund to help the Spanish horses and their breeders I would donate to them also.
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
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    I hope they realize that once those bloodlines are lost, they're lost forever; some of them likely go back to the time of the Crusades.

    Now's the time for people into Baroque riding, all over Europe, to step up to the plate.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    The mark of zealots, fanatics for their causes, they will defend even the indefensible at any cost, here the HSUS and the Vick connection.

    Honestly, after what that man did, why would any decent human think it is good PR to put him on display for your cause?
    Only another a twisted mind could think that makes any sense:

    http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=6510
    Vick is a spokesperson for HSUS! Well that says it all!
    "you can only ride the drama llama so hard before it decides to spit in your face." ?Caffeinated.



  10. #30
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    The sisterhood is very nervous as they can't believe their puppetmaster has actually put them in the position to have to cheer for the good mr. vick! So, it would appear that most of them are pretending they don't hear or see any of it!! How can Jenm, Idaho, Lori, Laura, all support vick? The world just isn't making any sense?


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    I wonder how many of those Pura Raza Espanola owners had taken out second and third mortgages on their homes and property during the "good times" to buy them?

    Sounds very, very familiar.
    “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by debt.”
    John Adams


    2 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Eboshi View Post
    I hope they realize that once those bloodlines are lost, they're lost forever; some of them likely go back to the time of the Crusades.

    Now's the time for people into Baroque riding, all over Europe, to step up to the plate.
    I doubt any great bloodlines will be lost from the equivalent of a BYB with fugly QH sending a bunch to slaughter.

    People bred too many horses and now they can't unload the unmarketable ones. Same as with breeding in the US.

    People breeding NICE PREs are still selling them for good prices.

    Going to the news and spinning the romance angle was marketing genius, and I'm sure that breeder is patting himself on the back all the way to the bank.
    ______________________________________________
    My Blog -horses & photography


    2 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaitedincali View Post
    I doubt any great bloodlines will be lost from the equivalent of a BYB with fugly QH sending a bunch to slaughter.

    People bred too many horses and now they can't unload the unmarketable ones. Same as with breeding in the US.

    People breeding NICE PREs are still selling them for good prices.

    Going to the news and spinning the romance angle was marketing genius, and I'm sure that breeder is patting himself on the back all the way to the bank.
    The way some went about breeding those horses is similar to those that bred ostriches and sold pairs for tens of thousands, until the market crashed, too many for a very niche market.
    Then you could find ostriches running loose all over East TX, when even small slaughter plants didn't want them.

    The same happened with AQHA horses six years ago and when the economy tanked, the next five years, the AQHA some of those years only had 1/3 registered, for an average of 1/2 of the previous numbers in these last five years.

    The market determines what your horses are worth and that means demand and supply.
    Just as in the USA but much worse, Spain is in a recession, with 25% unemployment and that 50%+ in the younger people.
    Their horse market just shrunk tremendously.
    Hard to afford any horses when you have trouble making basic ends meet.

    In Europe, unlike in the USA, you do have the slaughter option for all those horses that are not finding any other use alive and that is what they are using to reduce numbers.

    I have a feeling the whole world's standard of living is slowly getting better for more and more, in basic ways and at the same time squeezing our resources to where we will have to learn to use them judiciously.
    No more throwing away whole horse carcasses, that could have been used one more time after dead, on some fringe extremist's drives to change the world.
    Doing just that never made much sense, even less so today.

    For those that only see horses as a mythical figure and maybe have owned a handful if that many in a lifetime, they just don't realize that the reason they even had A horse for their desires was because there is a whole horse industry behind them, that provided them with those horses AND made the hard decisions with the oversupply.
    Without them, they would not get to have that one or few so well loved horses to enjoy.
    Without the horse industry we have today, providing all with the horses they want, horses would become a status symbol for the few, like owning a tiger or very rare Amazon bird.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    It's a shame.
    But I'd rather see these horses go to slaughter rather than being abandoned and starved by their owners and suffer a slow death (which, according to the article I read, is less and less likely since the horses are micro-chipped and if a horse is found starving or neglected, its owner can be tracked down and faces steep fines.)
    Ottbs - The finish line is only the beginning!


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  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolprudm View Post
    Irish Draughts were sent to slaughter en masse after WWII. I would hate to see this happen to the Spanish horses. Yes I know that there are horses in need in NA and i have donated to help them. But if anyone knows of a fund to help the Spanish horses and their breeders I would donate to them also.
    From The Foundation for the Pure Spanish Horse:

    The problem of unwanted horses in Spain is known to The Foundation because the number of requests for help to our rescue program here in the USA has tripled in the last year. We have been working very hard to help protect horses in need.

    If you can help please contribute to The Foundation’s rescue fund on our website
    http://prehorse.org/Store/donate.lasso Please help the legendary horse of Spain.
    No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill



  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSP View Post
    From The Foundation for the Pure Spanish Horse:

    The problem of unwanted horses in Spain is known to The Foundation because the number of requests for help to our rescue program here in the USA has tripled in the last year. We have been working very hard to help protect horses in need.

    If you can help please contribute to The Foundation’s rescue fund on our website
    http://prehorse.org/Store/donate.lasso Please help the legendary horse of Spain.
    Thank you
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.



  17. #37
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    This is NOT about slaughter. This may be very like the Arabian horse bubble burst or the rock bottom economy in Spain but I know it isn't about Bull fighting or slaughter.

    Breeders are coming down on their prices. They have backed off breeding. And breeders outside of Spain are trying to get horses out of Spain.

    The horses in the giveaway are not purebred and the owner has been contacted by people that want the horses. Maybe she has changed her mind. They still carry a good price even in our economy.

    So I think it is a huge tragedy that registered PRE are going to slaughter. Transportation of a single horse is $6 to $10k to the USA. Making rescue a bit difficult.

    When I think P.R.E Andalusian I think of war horse or dressage or driving. I don't get this threads direction; Bullfighting and slaughter?
    No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill



  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSP View Post
    This is NOT about slaughter. This may be very like the Arabian horse bubble burst or the rock bottom economy in Spain but I know it isn't about Bull fighting or slaughter.

    Breeders are coming down on their prices. They have backed off breeding. And breeders outside of Spain are trying to get horses out of Spain.

    The horses in the giveaway are not purebred and the owner has been contacted by people that want the horses. Maybe she has changed her mind. They still carry a good price even in our economy.

    So I think it is a huge tragedy that registered PRE are going to slaughter. Transportation of a single horse is $6 to $10k to the USA. Making rescue a bit difficult.

    When I think P.R.E Andalusian I think of war horse or dressage or driving. I don't get this threads direction; Bullfighting and slaughter?
    Thank you for trying to keep this on track.
    The Economy in Europe, and in this case Spain especially, is far worse than that in the USA. The horses at risk would NOT have been at risk in a better economy.

    There is a likelihood of losing bloodlines and that is not something one can restore after the fact.

    The Pura Raza / Andalusian is a breed that has been in existence with a studbook going back at least as far as the Thoroughbred, and without 'restructuring' and introducing off-type blood.

    In other words, they are not a fad breed, nor a recent creation, nor mongrel. Rather it is a foundation from which many breeds have been developed, putting it in a class with Thoroughbreds, Arabians, Akhal Tekes, etc.

    It is not for everyone, but for enthusiast of this breed the current likelihood of losing genetic diversity is distressing.

    I hope your link to the foundation brings inquiries and that there is real results that conserve at least some of the breeding horses for the future.


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  19. #39
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    For anyone that would like to know more, you can go to the Foundations facebook page and you will find the email address for the US and Spanish breed foundations that are trying to rescue the horses. Send them an email if you would like to help. I do not know what they are planning to do at this time. The discussion has been active since the story came out so you will need to read through to find the information.

    Also, this is a Breed Registration Org not a rescue so disregard some of the random postings from confused facebook posters.

    There is also a link to the breeders web site mentioned in the story. He is trying to sell his horses for very reduced prices until after the horse festival, so June is his deadline. After that he will send them to slaughter.

    I came to the COTH looking for a thread on this thinking I would find a think tank and maybe some great connections to help save these historical horses. Imagine my shock to find this thread comparing the Andalusian horse to Gypsy Vanners! Read up on the history of horses will you! They are old, relatively rare in the USA and they are highly prize and have always been. And it would be tragic to lose them.

    And please if you do find a registered PRE sitting in a rescue let me know, I will look around for the flying pigs. That is after I adopt the horse!
    No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill


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  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSP View Post
    The horses in the giveaway are not purebred and the owner has been contacted by people that want the horses. Maybe she has changed her mind. They still carry a good price even in our economy.
    Thanks for pointing that out. I would love an Andalusian, and I help rescue many horses each year through the rescue. Because I work in rescue, I don't have the funds to purchase an Andy, though, so I admire from afar. I saw the two mares posted on the Give Aways forum, but if I finally get an Andy I would like a registered one that I could possibly show. I'm NOT insensitive to the plight of rescue horses (I have five here that I'm feeding myself and almost 700 that I'm responsible for through BEHS). But if I am going to take on another permanent mouth to feed, I want to take on the exact horse I want. (And if that makes me a criminal, so be it!).
    Visit us at Bluebonnet Equine Humane Society - www.bluebonnetequine.org

    Want to get involved in rescue or start your own? Check out How to Start a Horse Rescue - www.howtostartarescue.com


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