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  1. #1
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    Question Thoroughbreds Going To Auction

    I was asked a question today that I have no idea what the answer is and I could not find it on google.

    If a horse comes off the track and is sold or given to a private party, can it then be taken to a horse auction? Is it like a Mustang that you have to have a year before you can sell it? I know trainers can get in trouble setting their racehorses at auction, but what are the actual laws regarding this? Does is vary state to state?



  2. #2
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    Its not a law, but certain tracks have rules that horses who race there cannot be sold to slaughter.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/hor...ory?id=3594167

    However, trainers get scammed sometimes. http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ra...-them-is-dead/


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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by LockeMeadows View Post
    I was asked a question today that I have no idea what the answer is and I could not find it on google.

    If a horse comes off the track and is sold or given to a private party, can it then be taken to a horse auction? Is it like a Mustang that you have to have a year before you can sell it? I know trainers can get in trouble setting their racehorses at auction, but what are the actual laws regarding this? Does is vary state to state?
    Other than possible restrictions placed by certain racetracks preventing owners/trainers that want to race horses there from selling to slaughter, I don't think there are restrictions.

    When my TB came off the track and to me, I know for sure that no one said "boo" about anything. Theoretically, I am sure I could have sold him to slaughter the very next day if I was so inclined (I would of course never do that).



  4. #4
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    Why is the word auction the same as slaughter?


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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    Why is the word auction the same as slaughter?
    It's not. But while tracks may not place restrictions on "auctions," some of them do place restrictions on horses ending up in slaughterhouses. If you send a horse to auction, it would be quite difficult to make sure it doesn't thereafter end up in a slaughterhouse, even if the person who buys it at auction isn't the one who ends up sending it there.



  6. #6
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    So the argument goes back to - if you take on a horse you can never move it on as it may end up at slaughter.


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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    So the argument goes back to - if you take on a horse you can never move it on as it may end up at slaughter.
    Did you read any of the links I posted? That's not how the rule works.


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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    So the argument goes back to - if you take on a horse you can never move it on as it may end up at slaughter.
    Not really. I think most track policies basically say that IF a horse that ended its career at their track EVER later ends up at slaughter, the owner/trainer of that horse will be permanently banned from racing future horses at that track.

    The track doesn't place restrictions on the purchaser of the horse post-racing, but it does hold the racing trainer/owner accountable for what happens to that horse...forever, I believe. It is meant to provide an incentive for the horse's racing connections to make DANG sure that a horse that raced under their colors does not ever end up in a slaughterhouse. The racing trainer/owner needs to decide for themselves how careful they need to be to make sure their horses don't end up at slaughter, knowing that the risk of making a bad choice is that they are banned from racing at a certain track.

    There are ways to sell racehorses that greatly reduces or elimiates the risk of the horse ending up at slaughter. Selling via auction isn't one of those ways. Selling to known commodity, private individuals is much safer...or through an organization like CANTER, which I believe screens purchasers, etc.


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  9. #9
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    No.

    Again, check into the rule at which ever specific track its is you are concerned about, but the rules are intended to prevent the owner/trainer from SELLING DIRECTLY TO SLAUGHTER.

    If Joe Schmo buys the horse, and then sells it to slaughter, no problem. If the owner/ trainer sells DIRECTLY to the kill buyer, THEN the owner/trainer can get banned from the track. This is not a lifetime prohibition from selling to slaughter for the horse.


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  10. #10
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    Yes, they have tried to self-police the TBs to avoid the SH. But in reality, recent investigations have found that many of the retired TBs which were sent to wonderful retirement homes where they could run in lush pastures, actually went to holding farms where they were starved to death!
    So, choose the future wisely. To a 'retirement' home where they may linger for months before dying, or the SH where one, painless impact from the bolt gun ends its suffering!


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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    So the argument goes back to - if you take on a horse you can never move it on as it may end up at slaughter.
    while the rules don't state that, it's how it plays out when the wrong people find the horse you once raced....
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozart View Post
    Personally, I think the moderate use of shock collars in training humans should be allowed.



  12. #12
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    I am curious as to how a horse can be tracked, is it through the lip tattoo? Is it relatively easy to alter or destroy the tattoo?

    I certainly can understand blaming a trainer/owner if a horse goes from track to slaughter directly or within a defined time frame, but it is a burden if it happens five/ten/twenty years out.

    Sorry I am a slow typer and Judysmom answered the question. Thanks



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineAlready View Post
    Not really. I think most track policies basically say that IF a horse that ended its career at their track EVER later ends up at slaughter, the owner/trainer of that horse will be permanently banned from racing future horses at that track.
    I don't know of any tracks that would have a forever prohibition on horses going to slaughter/auctions. Most that do have rules just prohibit the trainer/owner from selling directly to slaughter. The tracks that we deal with do investigate if horses end up at New Holland or other area "high kill" type auctions, as to how the horse got there. The frustrating thing is if the race owner can say they sold or gave the horse to someone in good faith, they can't really be held accountable (even when there's good indication they knew exactly what they were doing). If horses from one trainer show up repeatedly on 'broker listings' or similar, they can get in trouble. Either way the track rules about this are hard - they are not easy to enforce as there are often third parties involved (and sometimes fourth and fifth parties, even in the space of a week), and also because they encourage people who want to get rid of horses fast to just sort of "disappear" them - sending them with dealers with strict instructions not to try and sell the horse (at auction or otherwise) so they don't get caught (instead going direct to kill). Some tracks will consider a sale to certain dealers they know of the same as sending a horse directly to auction or slaughter, but there's always more people willing to pick up horses for a cheap buck so it's hard to keep up with (and some trainers really are misled or duped, been involved in a few of those situations)

    There are ways to sell racehorses that greatly reduces or elimiates the risk of the horse ending up at slaughter. Selling via auction isn't one of those ways. Selling to known commodity, private individuals is much safer...or through an organization like CANTER, which I believe screens purchasers, etc.
    CANTER only screens purchasers if the horse has been donated to us and is part of our retraining programs.
    "smile a lot can let us ride happy,it is good thing"

    My CANTER blog.


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  14. #14
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    Skyking,

    Auction=Slaughter because the rescue groups and hsus et al have worked very, very hard and craftily to make everyone believe that. This whole scam of going to the auction house and 'rescuing' a poor unfortunate horse from slaughter is the modus orperandi of most of the rescues. It is how they pay the mortgage on their farms, pay for the farrier, and even the diapers on their babies! It's how they invest in the 401-k retirement plans! The smalls have learned from the talls, as hsus and other nationals/internationals have grown outrageously wealthy by pleading for money to intercept a horse on the 'slaughter ride'.
    Your question proves that their deceptions have had an effect.


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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    I am curious as to how a horse can be tracked, is it through the lip tattoo? Is it relatively easy to alter or destroy the tattoo?
    Yes, they are frequently tracked through tattoo. And there have been some cases of people trying to deface the tattoos, either by tattooing over the top of the old ones, or even slicing up the horse's lip to render them unreadable.
    "smile a lot can let us ride happy,it is good thing"

    My CANTER blog.


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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judysmom View Post
    No.

    Again, check into the rule at which ever specific track its is you are concerned about, but the rules are intended to prevent the owner/trainer from SELLING DIRECTLY TO SLAUGHTER.

    If Joe Schmo buys the horse, and then sells it to slaughter, no problem. If the owner/ trainer sells DIRECTLY to the kill buyer, THEN the owner/trainer can get banned from the track. This is not a lifetime prohibition from selling to slaughter for the horse.
    Ah, my mistake. I don't think a rule that only prevents direct sale to slaughter really prevents much at all, unfortunately.



  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by caffeinated View Post
    I don't know of any tracks that would have a forever prohibition on horses going to slaughter/auctions. Most that do have rules just prohibit the trainer/owner from selling directly to slaughter. The tracks that we deal with do investigate if horses end up at New Holland or other area "high kill" type auctions, as to how the horse got there. The frustrating thing is if the race owner can say they sold or gave the horse to someone in good faith, they can't really be held accountable (even when there's good indication they knew exactly what they were doing). If horses from one trainer show up repeatedly on 'broker listings' or similar, they can get in trouble. Either way the track rules about this are hard - they are not easy to enforce as there are often third parties involved (and sometimes fourth and fifth parties, even in the space of a week), and also because they encourage people who want to get rid of horses fast to just sort of "disappear" them - sending them with dealers with strict instructions not to try and sell the horse (at auction or otherwise) so they don't get caught (instead going direct to kill). Some tracks will consider a sale to certain dealers they know of the same as sending a horse directly to auction or slaughter, but there's always more people willing to pick up horses for a cheap buck so it's hard to keep up with (and some trainers really are misled or duped, been involved in a few of those situations)



    CANTER only screens purchasers if the horse has been donated to us and is part of our retraining programs.
    Thanks for the clarifications!



  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7arabians View Post
    So, choose the future wisely. To a 'retirement' home where they may linger for months before dying, or the SH where one, painless impact from the bolt gun ends its suffering!
    Or, you know, to a devoted owner like me, who retrained my TB as a hunter and gives him the best of everything. The options are not: (a) long slow death by starvation or (b) death by slaughter.


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  19. #19
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    FineAlready,

    Thanks for not adding to the problem with your TB. Sadly, over 10,000 TBs are sent to slaughter per year.



  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineAlready View Post
    Or, you know, to a devoted owner like me, who retrained my TB as a hunter and gives him the best of everything. The options are not: (a) long slow death by starvation or (b) death by slaughter.
    I think this is what he is referring to:
    http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/mo...icle-1.1072384
    http://www.paulickreport.com/tag/horse-rescue/page/2/
    it was rather shocking to read that the receiving farms were expected to feed the horses on around 3-4 dollars a day...
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozart View Post
    Personally, I think the moderate use of shock collars in training humans should be allowed.



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