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  1. #41
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    Here's how I see it. Keep in mind my advice is worth exactly what you're paying for it.

    1. Who cares what OF thinks or feels. He's just provided evidence once again that leopards don't change their spots. Be finished with him. Refuse his calls, block his email and facebook. He doesn't get to make the decision to make the baby "disappear".

    I would skip the facebook announcement for now. The people who you care about will know soon enough anyway. My guess is he doesn't want to see it on facebook because that will mean you aren't terminating the pregnancy. In this case better to just let it be. If it's not "in his face" he's less likely to continue to pressure you.

    2. Don't terminate the pregnancy. Abortion is hard enough for women who don't want to be pregnant, I don't think you'd ever get over it.

    3. Your husband was a bit of a tool for "changing his mind" about kids after you were married. Almost seems like he knew he didn't want kids but figured he tell you what you wanted to hear so you would marry him.

    You agreed to an open marriage, I'm guessing he either figured you wouldn't take him up on it or that you wouldn't get pregnant if you did. Well you did.

    So, where to go from here? Your husband doesn't seem like he's going off the rails over it. He may warm up to the child once he/she arrives, if not you can discuss divorce at that point since you can't do it before then anyway.

    Right now I would stay put, try to keep your stress level low and concentrate on taking care of yourself and having a healthy baby. If you feel that you'll want to get divorced start planning on how you'll make ends meet. Do you have a support system close by?

    You might want to use this time to seek counseling, both individual and couples if your husband is willing to go. You may or may not stay married but at least you can get a little insight into your life and why you've made the choices you have. Then you can take that and work to build a good solid life for you and the baby.

    Good luck.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  2. #42
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    I would stay put and give yourself time to process. Get yourself into counseling immediately so you are in a position mentally to make decisions about what you want for yourself and your baby going forward.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #43
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    NMRN, lcw said, "And I have known men who claim not to want any more kids who end up falling in a heap for a new baby." - made me smile. Years ago, I casually dated a divorced man with three kids. When he met a young lady he really fell for, he told me first, and told me about the house he was designing/building. I questioned the size (2 bedroom) - his response: "I have three grown kids. I'm not planning on repopulating the earth!" Well, he died a few years ago, and through his obituary, I learned that they had had three [I think] children. I smiled when I read it, and smiled again, when I read lcw's comment.

    All of which has nothing to do with you. But in your situation, if you truly care about each other, and if your husband is able to accept the 'final outcome' of a mutual agreement made several years ago, then stick with him. You both may find a great deal of joy in the child you raise together.

    Best wishes....
    www.ayliprod.com
    Equine Photography in the Northeast


    3 members found this post helpful.

  4. #44
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    CONGRATS, OP!

    I agree with the advice that others have said, but just letting it go about FB for now. The people who matter are going to know, and everybody else will just be rubber necking to the train wreck that will follow once sperm donor finds out and (I'm sure) reacts in the most upstanding way. *eyeroll*

    Forget about him. Forget about his family. Forget about his drama. I know, MUCH easier said than done, but I would cut off all communication with him. Let him know that you will be bringing this baby into the world and then be done with it. He can put his big boy panties on and deal.

    As for your husband, I agree with going to therapy. Not just for this, but for other reasons as well. Is there a reason why you didn't before you decided on an open marriage? 10 years is a long time to live with somebody as just roommates. Get to the root of the reason why you feel like he's so standoffish. I really, REALLY don't mean this to be snarky, but it sounds like you are both married to each other because you don't want to be alone. There is nothing wrong with that, if it works out for you, however you now have another person to think about.

    If he is willing to stand up and care for this child as his own, then I applaud him. I wonder if possibly you feel that he doesn't care is because you were so wrapped up in your feelings for OF that you just stopped noticing him. My DH isn't outward about his feelings about me... at all. However, it's the little stuff... cleaning off my car in the winter, setting up the coffee pot in the morning, picking up a favorite snack at the grocery store, that shows me how much I mean to him. When I get wrapped up in what's going on in MY life, I don't notice it and sometimes it seems like he doesn't care or that he's standoffish. It has to be frustrating to him!

    I also noticed that this is his 8th child? So my guess is that this isn't his first rodeo. He knows what to expect, and it's not as exciting to him as it would be if it were his first, or second... even if the circumstances WERE totally happy.

    I say leave it be for now. Let the dust settle and maybe re-evaluate after the baby is born. Don't stress, enjoy this with your family and friends. Get thee to therapy ASAP. You have your COTH family for support. Remember this sperm donor jerk has NO power over you. Don't let him. He'll grow up. The baby won't remember the first years anyways, so use them to build a solid life for when he/she starts to remember. Weather it is with or without your current husband.

    Good luck!
    Quote Originally Posted by MistyBlue View Post
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    New Year, New Blog... follow Willow and I here.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  5. #45
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    There is an ancient common law precedent called "Lord Mansfield's Rule" that states than any child concieved or born during a legal marriage is presumed to be the child of the husband. However, in this age of DNA testing, your husband can deny the child is his and demand a DNA test, should you divorce and ask for child support. The state will only force you to ask for support if you apply for state benefits such as food stamps or Medicaid, otherwise they don't care if you get support or not. Baby Daddy cannot unilaterally terminate his parental rights to avoid paying support and I would strongly urge you not to allow him to do so. In the event you and your husband do divorce and he is declared not to be the father, your child may need the financial support of its bio-dad. Don't hurt your child just to assuage your conscience.

    Frankly, I think the idea that you have to be madly in love in order to have a successful marriage is a lot of nonsense. You and your husband get along, you sound like you are reasonably happy, he's not pushing for divorce and isn't asking you to get an abortion, so, if I were you, I'd let things ride for now. He may change his mind once the baby gets here but you can cross that bridge when you get there.

    As far as FB goes, I'm not a big fan of spreading personal business all over the internet but a pregnancy isn't something you can hide forever. Again, if I were you, I'd just announce that I was expecting and let it go at that. If people want to speculate about who's the father, there's nothing you can do to stop them but you don't have to go into details on the internet about the child's paternity.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  6. #46
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    OK - have read a couple more response. Just finished TM's and need to put in a few cents.

    My mother was married 4 times. My father was the first. I knew he existed; I knew his name (I think - at least by the time I was in Jr Hi). My mom told me I shouldn't try to 'find' him because he might (also) have remarried and not told his wife about me. He & I (and she) finally met when I was 20. He sort of knew where we lived, but hadn't wanted to reach out to me for the same reason Mom had given me. What if I hadn't been told about him? Not sure why he'd have thought that I wouldn't have wondered - Mom & first step married when I was 6 and I was in their wedding. Then again...but that's a whole 'nother topic of strangeness.

    As a 22 year old camp counsellor, one parents' day, I sat and talked with a mom who was distraught because she was getting divorced and was so afraid that it would be devastating to her son. I tried to reassure her that my brother and I had lived through a divorce (well, me - 2) and were relatively normal, adjusted kids. I told her that I thought it was FAR better to have one parent around (perhaps one at a time) who was happy, comfortable, had positive energy to share rather than two who were at each other's throats all the time with tons of negative energy sapping everyone.

    That's my long reponse to TM - and my way of saying to YOU that if you and your husband can see the future and want to raise this child as yours (yours & his, that is), then go for it. I believe (well, what can anyone really know of one another from reading a few posts on COTH forum) that thinking this all through is a good thing - and sometimes it's a lot easier with 'strangers' who have no dog in the fight.

    Do the legal paperwork to get that sperm-donating jerk out of your and your child's life. And I do believe I'd bypass the paternal grandparents.

    Best of luck to you -
    www.ayliprod.com
    Equine Photography in the Northeast


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by NMRN View Post
    I feel like I've misjudged both of them-DH is a much better person than I gave him credit for. And OF is apparently not as good as I thought.
    OP, have you been to any therapy through all this? Because you just described a guy who beat you, knocked you up, demands an abortion, and somehow has control over what you can and can't post on Facebook as "apparently not as good as I thought."


    9 members found this post helpful.

  8. #48
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    Thank you all very much for all of your perspectives. it really has helped me organize my thought a bit better. I especially appreciate the pov of the child expressed so very well. I hadn't considered that OF's family might not want to be involved with the child- I know his dad pretty well, and have a lot of respect for him. Mom I don't know so well. I want to make the baby available to them if they are interested in seeing it. For now I think I will let things lie. I am going to look into therapy, for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is i have read that children who are hurt often hurt their kids as adults- and I NEVER want to be that person. I can't imagine that I would, but I want to be sure that I have good ways to cope. I have done well with the stepkids- the youngest was only 5 months when we met and is now 10-and VERY excited for the new sibling. I have a lot to think about-having you all to talk to has been a help for sure.


    11 members found this post helpful.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by lcw579 View Post
    Enjoy your pregnancy, enjoy your baby. Write off the old flame and his family. He sounds like a horror show and why bring that into a child's life kicking and screaming? Let him go for good this time.

    Husband - is willing to keep up the status quo and raise the baby with you. How does that sound? Sounds like a nice guy to me. I'd give the baby your husband's last name, I'm assuming it is yours too. Maybe you can find some of what you had now that you have the baby you've been longing for. Marriages change throughout the years. If you get along with your husband and have been content enough muddling along don't rush into any big changes while you are pregnant. Hormones really do make you a bit loopy. And I have known men who claim not to want any more kids who end up falling in a heap for a new baby. And it doesn't always matter if it is theirs biologically.

    ETA - I agree about getting some therapy for yourself as a survivor of abuse. It will help you as a person and a mother.

    Good luck!
    I agree--it sounds like your husband was angry, but has come around to the reality (which seems only fair given the open marriage), Old Flame sounds like a grade-A jerkass, you've been reasonably content up to now with your arrangement...I'd give the baby the husband's last name as he's legally the father in your state anyway and wait to make any long-term changes until you're well past pregnancy hormones and post-partum depression/craziness/insomnia.


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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by NMRN View Post
    Thank you all very much for all of your perspectives. it really has helped me organize my thought a bit better. I especially appreciate the pov of the child expressed so very well. I hadn't considered that OF's family might not want to be involved with the child- I know his dad pretty well, and have a lot of respect for him. Mom I don't know so well. I want to make the baby available to them if they are interested in seeing it. For now I think I will let things lie. I am going to look into therapy, for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is i have read that children who are hurt often hurt their kids as adults- and I NEVER want to be that person. I can't imagine that I would, but I want to be sure that I have good ways to cope. I have done well with the stepkids- the youngest was only 5 months when we met and is now 10-and VERY excited for the new sibling. I have a lot to think about-having you all to talk to has been a help for sure.
    Many hugs and jingles!

    You can do it!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozart View Post
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  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccoronios View Post
    OK - have read a couple more response. Just finished TM's and need to put in a few cents.

    My mother was married 4 times. My father was the first. I knew he existed; I knew his name (I think - at least by the time I was in Jr Hi). My mom told me I shouldn't try to 'find' him because he might (also) have remarried and not told his wife about me. He & I (and she) finally met when I was 20. He sort of knew where we lived, but hadn't wanted to reach out to me for the same reason Mom had given me. What if I hadn't been told about him? Not sure why he'd have thought that I wouldn't have wondered - Mom & first step married when I was 6 and I was in their wedding. Then again...but that's a whole 'nother topic of strangeness.

    As a 22 year old camp counsellor, one parents' day, I sat and talked with a mom who was distraught because she was getting divorced and was so afraid that it would be devastating to her son. I tried to reassure her that my brother and I had lived through a divorce (well, me - 2) and were relatively normal, adjusted kids. I told her that I thought it was FAR better to have one parent around (perhaps one at a time) who was happy, comfortable, had positive energy to share rather than two who were at each other's throats all the time with tons of negative energy sapping everyone.
    I'm really confused by this? I would never advocate someone stay with a spouse they're miserable with for the sake of their child nor did I ever imply that. And I have no idea what the first situation has to do with the OP or what I said.

    The OP should focus on her baby because the men in her life may come and go for one reason or another. But her baby will always be her baby. She needs to gather her support network around her and get her own emotions worked out as best she can.


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  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    I agree--it sounds like your husband was angry, but has come around to the reality (which seems only fair given the open marriage),
    My guess would be that the anger stemmed from the fact that, although an open marriage was agreed upon, the OP getting knocked up as a result of the agreement was not part of his plan. Or maybe he did tell her that would be fine too. I guess that's possible.

    The focus on whether or not it's acceptable to post this on facebook is one of the more disturbing things about this whole thread.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  13. #53
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    To the OP, I picked up something very interesting in your post (#48). It sounds like you have more to consider than just your current husband and the old flame. If your 10 year old step child is very excited about the baby, it sounds like you have forged some strong bonds with your step children, and how would they feel if you up and leave your husband and them with your unborn baby?

    Even though you had an open marriage, it's one thing to fool around but another to become pregnant. If your current husband is angry but you think he can get beyond that to understand this is something that means so much to you, and his biological children are invested, perhaps there is some way to build a family here before you throw everything away. Is he basically a decent man? If so, please don't just react to all the chaos you're experiencing right now without really thinking things through.

    As for the baby-daddy, he has shown his true colors and I can't help but wonder if there is some part of you that thinks telling his parents will cause them to come to your rescue, or at least put pressure on their son to step up and accept his responsibility for the baby, even if there is no hope of a life for you with this man. I think his past actions, the fact that he struck you and his absolute rejection of your unborn baby speaks volumes about who he really is and your best course of action is to keep this troubled man out of your life and your baby's life.
    I agree that finding a good, supportive counselor is your most immediate course of action and I truly wish you all the best.


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  14. #54
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    Let the baby daddy walk and have a frank conversation with your husband. See how he truly feels about this. While this is definitely a train wreck stuff happens and sometimes for a reason. I am very happy for you that although this wasn't how you imagined it you are able to be a mother as you wanted to be.

    As far as Facebook and the grandparents... I am the opposite. FB was the very last place my pregnancies were announced, but I am a private person and I don't want people's opinions on how I choose to live my life. The grandparents? Sticky situation but as danceronice was saying, no rash decisions... Wait until all the hormones and crazy late nights have passed to heavily consider that.

    I would also advise therapy. You need to be at a good place mentally and emotionally and very stable by the time this baby comes.

    My other advice? Love that child. Love it with your whole heart and put it first, as someone else said men can come and go but that will always be your baby. I have known plenty of people scarred by difficult domestic situations their mothers were in, where their focus was not on the child. Don't do that.

    Congratulations, amidst the chaos I am very happy for you.


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  15. #55
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    I am as pro-choice as they come. The woman gets the choice. Not the sperm donor, baby daddy, husband, whoever. The woman who is pregnant.

    Nobody can force you to have an abortion, EVER.

    I'd say the therapy suggestion was good. I'd unfriend the old flame, and move on with life, however that ends up nobody can see the future.


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  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by chai View Post
    As for the baby-daddy, he has shown his true colors and I can't help but wonder if there is some part of you that thinks telling his parents will cause them to come to your rescue, or at least put pressure on their son to step up and accept his responsibility for the baby, even if there is no hope of a life for you with this man. I think his past actions, the fact that he struck you and his absolute rejection of your unborn baby speaks volumes about who he really is and your best course of action is to keep this troubled man out of your life and your baby's life.
    I picked up a little bit on this as well, but chai said it better than I could have. I'm thinking that what you had with OF (healthy or not) was attention that you are seeking from your current husband. Passion, romance, spontaneity, etc. You were seeking that (and I don't blame you. To me, marriage should be exciting and passionate and all that.) and 'forgot' about the bad. I think that you still want that, and a little piece of you is thinking that if you tell his parents, they will force him to come around and you will have the passion/excitement that you need.

    Just remember. Babies don't change anything. I see my friends getting knocked up because they think that it will make their partner love them more, or behave better... it never works.

    Please, PLEASE don't go back to this jerk. No matter how exciting it may seem. I've been there, hun, it's NEVER worth it.
    Quote Originally Posted by MistyBlue View Post
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    New Year, New Blog... follow Willow and I here.


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  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superminion View Post
    I picked up a little bit on this as well, but chai said it better than I could have. I'm thinking that what you had with OF (healthy or not) was attention that you are seeking from your current husband. Passion, romance, spontaneity, etc. You were seeking that (and I don't blame you. To me, marriage should be exciting and passionate and all that.) and 'forgot' about the bad. I think that you still want that, and a little piece of you is thinking that if you tell his parents, they will force him to come around and you will have the passion/excitement that you need.
    Part of why the OP "needs" that passion and excitement, and seeks it so much from current hubby, is because of her past history as a victim/whatever sort of family issues she was raised with that pushed her down the path to being easily victimized.

    That's why it's SO important that she get to therapy, for herself and for future baby. Seeking out chaos (not excitement, chaos) is unhealthy. She's already admitted that current husband is a good guy, better than she thought.....I imagine most of why she has felt so dissatisfied with him is her programmed need to seek out chaos, and since he does seem to be interested in raising this child, I think she owes it to him to take a second look at the relationship.


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  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by NMRN View Post
    I am going to look into therapy, for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is i have read that children who are hurt often hurt their kids as adults- and I NEVER want to be that person.
    BRAVO BRAVO BRAVO!!!
    Don't feel like you'd turn into some beatinous monster, but our children mimic us, so we need to make sure what they are observing (and they're more perceptive to our thoughts and feelings than our horses ) is what we want them to become. Therapy will help any mom or dad to be display what's best for their children.
    I'm really relieved to hear you're seeking counseling. Do keep us posted!
    www.destinationconsensusequus.com
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  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    If the situation were reversed, and the now pregnant woman didn't want the child, but the bio-dad did, she would be justified in exercising her right to choose, right? He can't make her keep it, though the potential child is also his.

    So why can she unilaterally decide to keep the child, when he doesn't want one, effectively forcing him into parenthood
    Because 1. She has the right to her body. It is her body and her decision, and the list of people who have control over it ends there. That is not to say that the wants of the man are unimportant, but they are overridden by the right of a woman to control her body.


    Quote Originally Posted by ynl063w View Post
    If I were you I would also start putting away money for therapy for the child. Poor thing will surely need it. Lots of it.

    Have you even thought about how all this drama is going to affect your child?
    Deep breath, deep breath, deep breath. How. Dare. You.
    Where I come from we are taught to treat our fellow human beings with the decency and respect that they inherently deserve as fellow members of this race. I'm sorry for whatever it is you having going on in your life, if you woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, or if someone ran over your cat- but being a judgmental bitch to someone you don't know, who is reaching out, over the internet isn't going to help you or anyone else, it is a misdirection of your energy. Just stop.


    Quote Originally Posted by TequilaMockingbird View Post
    My point in all this is that you're only thinking about you and YOUR problems and what's going to make YOU feel better about the situation you got yourself in to. When really, you should be way more worried about what kind of life you're going to give this child and how you're going to make this child feel loved. You've got two father figures who don't want anything to do with this child so far.
    Simple. By loving it. You are overcomplicating an extremely simple thing. You love this child, and tell it you love it. It really is that easy.


    Quote Originally Posted by wireweiners View Post
    Frankly, I think the idea that you have to be madly in love in order to have a successful marriage is a lot of nonsense. You and your husband get along, you sound like you are reasonably happy, he's not pushing for divorce and isn't asking you to get an abortion, so, if I were you, I'd let things ride for now.
    I completely disagree, but perhaps we have different ideas on what constitutes a "successful" marriage.



    NMRN-
    I want this to serve as your daily reminder that self-indulgence can be a form of self-care, that because "it makes me feel better" is a COMPLETELY valid reason for doing something. If something makes you happy then it is not pointless, or a waste of your time. That if doing something makes you feel better then it is not something that is unproductive to do, and that doing something that makes you feel better is just as important as anything else.

    Do what makes you happy. Life really is too damn short to settle for anything. "A thousand candles can be lighted from a single flame, and the life of the flame will not be diminished. Happiness can never be decreased by being shared." Your baby will not be hurt by being raised by a single parent, by a lesbian couple, or in a 'traditional' family- but he or she will not be helped by your unhappiness, and it sounds like at the very least a big something is missing, and has been missing in your marriage for a long time, and it sounds like it IS making you unhappy.

    I know sometimes its hard to believe, especially if you're an abuse survivor- but you do deserve to be loved, and loved deeply and wholly. You deserve to be happy.

    I have several friends whose parents divorced when their children were old, and they all talk about what a relief it was. How happy they were, and how guilty they felt that their parents had remained unhappy, and not taking advantage of opportunities for happiness to be a "family". A mother, father, child does not a family make.

    I am so happy for you and that you are going to have this child, who I can already tell is going to be SO loved.

    PS- for what it is worth, I have a close friend, an older woman, who's second marriage recently dissolved in a rather messy way. She has three wonderful stepchildren whom she loves immensely, she moved over 1,100 miles across the country after her divorce to where one of her biological children from her first marriage lives- they are all still very close and have wonderful relationships, despite her terrible relationship with their father. It sounds like your husband is not a bad guy, and should you chose to divorce him I would assume you could do so amicably, and very possible preserve the relationship you have with your stepkids.

    The absolute very best of luck to you, and all in your life. There are very many aspects of your story that hit very close to home with me, and if you ever want to chat please shoot me a PM
    "Sit back and prepare to be pissed off!"

    Eventer, Ballerina, Dancer, Model, and Waitress Extraordinaire (cos a girls gotta eat!).


    3 members found this post helpful.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mickie So Fine View Post
    Deep breath, deep breath, deep breath. How. Dare. You.
    Where I come from we are taught to treat our fellow human beings with the decency and respect that they inherently deserve as fellow members of this race. I'm sorry for whatever it is you having going on in your life, if you woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, or if someone ran over your cat- but being a judgmental bitch to someone you don't know, who is reaching out, over the internet isn't going to help you or anyone else, it is a misdirection of your energy. Just stop
    My life is so under control to the point that I don't have to ask for any advice from all of you strangers on Off Topic Day, my bed is a non-issue in my life, and I don't even own a cat, so I feel extra lucky today!!!

    I'm so sorry if my practical, realistic advice offended you. Maybe you have something going on in your life, you woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, or someone ran over your cat. I'm terribly sorry, but to be honest that has nothing to do with the OP's post. Perhaps you could start your own thread?

    Good luck however you choose to proceed!


    8 members found this post helpful.

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