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  1. #41
    Join Date
    Feb. 15, 2004
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    Ontario
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    7,965

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    Fairfax, you know it all don't you?
    Stronach does help the horses they breed which is a lot more than many do...
    For a few years, I have been convinced and so have many of my friends, that Bluey and that other pro slaughterd guy who died, were paid by the pro slaughter to keep on harping their message.
    Now Fairfax is one of them as well.

    I have put you on ignore anyway since you use up too much of Coth band... oh and Alagirl too... I understand you are pro slaughter, fine. Accept that I am anti.. I don't have to keep reading your arguments which are really old!


    15 members found this post helpful.

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Aug. 5, 2009
    Posts
    1,400

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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    Hey Jenm, now you have a group too! That's you, me and Angela. Anyone else want to join the commie, socialist, vegan (did I leave anything out) RARAs?

    Comrade readers of the communist, vegan Toronto Star (the most widely read paper in Canada, by the way) unite!

    Comrade Laura
    Me too, me too. Except that I'm a carnivore. Can I still join?????


    5 members found this post helpful.

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    40,843

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    Quote Originally Posted by FalseImpression View Post
    Fairfax, you know it all don't you?
    Stronach does help the horses they breed which is a lot more than many do...
    For a few years, I have been convinced and so have many of my friends, that Bluey and that other pro slaughterd guy who died, were paid by the pro slaughter to keep on harping their message.
    Now Fairfax is one of them as well.

    I have put you on ignore anyway since you use up too much of Coth band... oh and Alagirl too... I understand you are pro slaughter, fine. Accept that I am anti.. I don't have to keep reading your arguments which are really old!
    Curious, I think there are some here that work for animal rights groups and part of their job is cruise web sites to push their disruptive propaganda.

    And no, I don't work or am paid by anyone.

    I may say, I have known slaughter and it's purpose in two continents and several countries and know it is not the evil certain posters want to make of it.
    Slaughter is a process by which we use SOME horses once more, as the natural, renewable resource horses have always been thru that process and still are in most of the world that uses horses, nothing more or less.

    I think many here don't know at all what slaughter really is and go by myths and propaganda only.

    I will say, with what I know of what slaughter is, it doesn't make sense at all to ban it, any more than banning rescues, because some and more all the time seem to be abusing/mismanaging horses.



  4. #44
    Join Date
    Feb. 8, 2008
    Location
    Delaware Valley
    Posts
    1,624

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    I heard the HSUS, being the richest animal rights extremist non-profit in the world, has over 50 attorneys employed and they pay good and have excellent benefits, courtesy of all those donations from the public, that thinks is giving to save the little sad kitten in their envelopes.
    You may have a bright future there.
    Thanks


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    40,843

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    Quote Originally Posted by Discobold View Post
    Thanks
    I may warn you, I have known people that worked for them long ago and didn't stay there long.
    The things that went on were not what they wanted to be part of.
    They didn't specify what it was, just that it was not what they wanted in their professional lives.
    Don't know how things are today, or may be by the time you may be eligible for a position there.



  6. #46
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2005
    Location
    KY
    Posts
    4,642

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    Present an alternative that does not cost the tax payer, and you will have the ears of the government.
    You are kidding, right?

    ************************
    \"Horses lend us the wings we lack\"


    4 members found this post helpful.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2006
    Location
    SF Bay Area, California
    Posts
    4,421

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    Quote Originally Posted by betonbill View Post
    Me too, me too. Except that I'm a carnivore. Can I still join?????
    Welcome to the group, Comrade betonbill!

    Quote Originally Posted by Discobold View Post
    Me! Me! My dream is one day - not so far in the future - to use my legal and writing skills to further the agenda of commie do-gooder animal-loving vegans.
    Comrade Discobold, you a welcome addition to the group!
    Last edited by jenm; Mar. 30, 2013 at 08:52 PM. Reason: added quote
    Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Jan. 25, 2011
    Location
    Southern Pines, NC
    Posts
    2,336

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    Quote Originally Posted by jenm View Post
    Welcome to my group, Comrade Ginger!
    Thank you, Comrade JenM! This is taking cliques to the next level...
    I've heard there's more to life than an FEI tent and hotel rooms, so I'm trying it.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Oct. 25, 2012
    Posts
    4,210

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    Lori

    I have stated as many times as possible Slaughter is only ONE piece of the puzzle. I have read the posts looking for alternatives for 100,000 horses for one year. There have been some good suggestions i.e. support some rescues but when I check them out...it is always same old same old with new MONEY sponsors i.e. Purina...but they are not even giving money..if you purchase goods from the online store...a little percentage goes to the rescue. Better than nothing but nothing new.

    I have worked trying to get the registration groups to forge a union for advertising in non horse publications extolling horse ownership and health benefits...rather than poaching members from a diminishing group.

    They are luke warm as they feel their "competition" will get ahead of them.

    Breeders have reduced each year by 50% according to the records published by registration bodies.

    Euthanization clinics have been suggested. Did you read the thread about the dead Bald Eagles from a lady who euthanized horses and did not bury them. Both she and her vet can be charged and found guilty of criminal charges and fined $50,000 PER eagle..

    The U.S. article also stated rendering the euthanized horse was not a good idea due to residue found in the meat and other animals might die..be eaten..and kill more...

    Incineration appears to be the governments only positive but gosh..it is expensive if one can even find one and then pay for hauling.

    I, like many others will gladly support a VIABLE alternative. Turning them out on Government owned land doesn't work. Chemical castration or even neutering stops more babies but does not cure the problem

    According to the USDA the average age is 6 and over..and the new breed of choice is the prolific warmblood producers. (or so I am told)...making them equal to the QH numbers.

    As I support slaughter I have worked (volunteered) to make it as safe and stress free as possible. My own time and my own money every week for four years (I no longer do it)..

    Present an alternative that does not cost the tax payer, and you will have the ears of the government.

    Present an alternative that does not bankrupt the breeder with forever taxes and you will have the ears of the breeders

    I am sure interested in valid suggestions?
    Why in the DEVIL do you keep harpin' on this? You're like the flippin' Angel of Death or something. You just have to keep these threads going endlessly while you hurl the RARA epithet at anyone who disagrees, and keep dragging everyone who can stand it through the process from auction to rendering.

    All I know is, anybody who can look a 2-year-old or an old granddad schoolie in the eyes and put 'em on one of those trucks has got a big, yawning BLACK HOLE where their compassion ought to be.

    And arguing endlessly in favor of it makes one imagine a few set-screws that need a turn or two, frankly.

    Our vet just put on a new Dr. who has an interest in equine geriatrics. As does the whole firm, whose Senior Wellness program is quite successful. Wave 'o the future, though I suppose it doesn't win you as many cowgirl-badass points, eh?

    I'd like to log on here ONCE and not see a possumbelly-wreck thread!


    25 members found this post helpful.

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2011
    Posts
    483

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    Lady,
    Sorry you are finding the truth so upsetting! Obviously, you are a proud member of the rara sisterhood. One reason nobody can say what amount of bute is permissible in humans because there is no proof that any human has ever developed any measurable amount of bute or its derivatives. In fact, it would require to a human to eat 500-600 horse meat burgers/day for years, just to reach a level where testing could detect it!
    So, as Easter arrives, let us embrace Spring and open our minds to the truth!
    And by the way, a special shout-out to Carol 'hfs' for helping the Oklahoma horse slaughter bill to pass.



  11. #51
    Join Date
    Jul. 22, 2012
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    811

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    This story is so sad. I agree that the most disturbing part is that someone tried to buy the horse, but was turned down. What kind of awful person and/or businessperson turns down the opportunity to make a profit?

    I don't care if I would have to eat 600 horsemeat burgers/day (that is a ridicuous number which makes you look nuts, but whatever I'll go with it), I don't want anything I'm eating to have been given drugs or other substances that can cause significant problems in humans. I happily eat beef because cows are bred and raised with the intention of human consumption. Although I take issue with some of the farming and slaughter practices, I can tailor my shopping to reflect my preferences. I don't support that which I find inhumane.

    If you want to raise and breed horses for human consumption, which includes submitting to the same regulations we expect of cattle farmers, and then slaughter them humanely, have at it.

    Until then, I will continue to be anti-slaughter and anti-crazy.

    Comrade Big Red


    14 members found this post helpful.

  12. #52
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2006
    Location
    SF Bay Area, California
    Posts
    4,421

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    Quote Originally Posted by big_red_ottb View Post
    This story is so sad. I agree that the most disturbing part is that someone tried to buy the horse, but was turned down. What kind of awful person and/or businessperson turns down the opportunity to make a profit?

    I don't care if I would have to eat 600 horsemeat burgers/day (that is a ridicuous number which makes you look nuts, but whatever I'll go with it), I don't want anything I'm eating to have been given drugs or other substances that can cause significant problems in humans. I happily eat beef because cows are bred and raised with the intention of human consumption. Although I take issue with some of the farming and slaughter practices, I can tailor my shopping to reflect my preferences. I don't support that which I find inhumane.

    If you want to raise and breed horses for human consumption, which includes submitting to the same regulations we expect of cattle farmers, and then slaughter them humanely, have at it.

    Until then, I will continue to be anti-slaughter and anti-crazy.

    Comrade Big Red
    Comrade Big Red, I salute you!

    Quote Originally Posted by GingerJumper View Post
    Thank you, Comrade JenM! This is taking cliques to the next level...
    Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg


    4 members found this post helpful.

  13. #53
    Join Date
    Dec. 14, 2003
    Location
    Southern New Jersey
    Posts
    371

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    Quote Originally Posted by 7arabians View Post
    Lady,
    Sorry you are finding the truth so upsetting! Obviously, you are a proud member of the rara sisterhood. One reason nobody can say what amount of bute is permissible in humans because there is no proof that any human has ever developed any measurable amount of bute or its derivatives. In fact, it would require to a human to eat 500-600 horse meat burgers/day for years, just to reach a level where testing could detect it!
    So, as Easter arrives, let us embrace Spring and open our minds to the truth!
    And by the way, a special shout-out to Carol 'hfs' for helping the Oklahoma horse slaughter bill to pass.
    Sweetie, you need to open your mind to education and comprehension, then maybe truth will be able to come to you.

    Your lack of knowledge is glaringly obvious every time you post this type of BS. A "fact" is not made because some politician is quoted saying nonsense off the cuff. As for the issue on bute, there is plenty enough evidence that it became policy for the FDA, USDA, EU, CFIA, etc, etc.

    Your RARA cries went a quite a bit "off course" in the other thread when you foolishly branded Jswan of being a RARA. Grow up, and learn what a RARA really is. Here is a hint, despite your apparent adoration of Fairfax, he is not quite sure what a RARA is, either.
    Annabelle Mayr, Arcadia Farm
    Home of Fitz, Max, Daeo & Austria
    Now over the Rainbow Bridge: Finn, Jake & Seamus


    11 members found this post helpful.

  14. #54
    Join Date
    Jan. 25, 2011
    Location
    Southern Pines, NC
    Posts
    2,336

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by big_red_ottb View Post
    This story is so sad. I agree that the most disturbing part is that someone tried to buy the horse, but was turned down. What kind of awful person and/or businessperson turns down the opportunity to make a profit?

    I don't care if I would have to eat 600 horsemeat burgers/day (that is a ridicuous number which makes you look nuts, but whatever I'll go with it), I don't want anything I'm eating to have been given drugs or other substances that can cause significant problems in humans. I happily eat beef because cows are bred and raised with the intention of human consumption. Although I take issue with some of the farming and slaughter practices, I can tailor my shopping to reflect my preferences. I don't support that which I find inhumane.

    If you want to raise and breed horses for human consumption, which includes submitting to the same regulations we expect of cattle farmers, and then slaughter them humanely, have at it.

    Until then, I will continue to be anti-slaughter and anti-crazy.

    Comrade Big Red
    I, too, salute you, Comrade Big Red! Well said.
    I've heard there's more to life than an FEI tent and hotel rooms, so I'm trying it.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  15. #55
    Join Date
    Feb. 8, 2008
    Location
    Delaware Valley
    Posts
    1,624

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    So, dear comrades, what exactly is a RARA? I think I should know since I just signed up to be one. I think my "aha" moment came when I just got plain old tired of apologizing for being a vegetarian, non-smoker, animal lover, tree hugger who drives a hybrid


    4 members found this post helpful.

  16. #56
    Join Date
    Dec. 14, 2003
    Location
    Southern New Jersey
    Posts
    371

    Default

    Theoretically, I do believe it is possible to improve the welfare of horses destined for slaughter. There are currently rules and regulations regarding the handling, transport and actual slaughter. I do believe that these are not adhered to often enough and that offenders are rarely prosecuted, but theoretically, it could be enforced to improve the welfare.

    I do have an issue with slaughtering for human consumption an animal that has not been raised for food. We currently do have rules and regulations regarding how more "typical" animals are raised and what can be fed or administered to these animals. This is done to ensure the integrity of the human food chain. I believe it is entirely wrong to have lesser standards for horses intended for human consumption. Current testing standards are entirely too lax. According to USDA published standards, every horse must be visually inspected to ensure that it is ambulatory and does not outwardly appear diseased. After that visual inspection, only 1 in 300 horses (or minimum of 1 per week) is all that is required to actually be tested for drug residues, etc. That is no where near a statistically relevant sampling of a population that has mostly individual histories of feed/medications, by that I mean that they were not raised by the same source farm/ranch.

    The current EID documents are inadequate as well. First of all, if answered truthfully to the spirit of the document, it still only requires 6 months of history and there are plenty of commonly administered substances which are, by regulation, never to administered to animals intended for human consumption. In actual practice, the document is pretty meaningless as illustrated by the fate of Backstreet Bully and many, many others.

    I do not understand how the pro-slaughter faction can continue to push that breaking these regulations is a non-issue. If regulations regarding possible contamination of the human food chain are blown off, how in the world can the industry expect the general population to believe their other promises to improve compliance on past infractions.

    If we are to believe in the inevitablity of Bluey's constant repetition of the slippery slope argument, then that would mean that if we allow the rules to be less stringent for horses, then the next thing that is going to happen is that the ag industry is going to want to lower the standards for other animals for human consumption as well. Hmmm, that is not something I want happening in my country and to our food supply.

    Fairfax constantly alludes to new testing that will allow them to test every horse while it is still alive. I have asked for him to tell us more about this, but he has ignored every one of my requests so I have to question if this is really being developed. A test such as this would be important and would show that the industry is truly trying to improve.
    Annabelle Mayr, Arcadia Farm
    Home of Fitz, Max, Daeo & Austria
    Now over the Rainbow Bridge: Finn, Jake & Seamus


    15 members found this post helpful.

  17. #57
    Join Date
    Oct. 25, 2012
    Posts
    4,210

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    Quote Originally Posted by 7arabians View Post
    Lady,
    Sorry you are finding the truth so upsetting! Obviously, you are a proud member of the rara sisterhood. One reason nobody can say what amount of bute is permissible in humans because there is no proof that any human has ever developed any measurable amount of bute or its derivatives. In fact, it would require to a human to eat 500-600 horse meat burgers/day for years, just to reach a level where testing could detect it!
    So, as Easter arrives, let us embrace Spring and open our minds to the truth!
    And by the way, a special shout-out to Carol 'hfs' for helping the Oklahoma horse slaughter bill to pass.
    You are one sick puppy.


    11 members found this post helpful.

  18. #58
    Join Date
    Aug. 5, 2009
    Posts
    1,400

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    Quote Originally Posted by ADM7040 View Post
    Theoretically, I do believe it is possible to improve the welfare of horses destined for slaughter. There are currently rules and regulations regarding the handling, transport and actual slaughter. I do believe that these are not adhered to often enough and that offenders are rarely prosecuted, but theoretically, it could be enforced to improve the welfare.

    I do have an issue with slaughtering for human consumption an animal that has not been raised for food. We currently do have rules and regulations regarding how more "typical" animals are raised and what can be fed or administered to these animals. This is done to ensure the integrity of the human food chain. I believe it is entirely wrong to have lesser standards for horses intended for human consumption. Current testing standards are entirely too lax. According to USDA published standards, every horse must be visually inspected to ensure that it is ambulatory and does not outwardly appear diseased. After that visual inspection, only 1 in 300 horses (or minimum of 1 per week) is all that is required to actually be tested for drug residues, etc. That is no where near a statistically relevant sampling of a population that has mostly individual histories of feed/medications, by that I mean that they were not raised by the same source farm/ranch.

    The current EID documents are inadequate as well. First of all, if answered truthfully to the spirit of the document, it still only requires 6 months of history and there are plenty of commonly administered substances which are, by regulation, never to administered to animals intended for human consumption. In actual practice, the document is pretty meaningless as illustrated by the fate of Backstreet Bully and many, many others.

    I do not understand how the pro-slaughter faction can continue to push that breaking these regulations is a non-issue. If regulations regarding possible contamination of the human food chain are blown off, how in the world can the industry expect the general population to believe their other promises to improve compliance on past infractions.

    If we are to believe in the inevitablity of Bluey's constant repetition of the slippery slope argument, then that would mean that if we allow the rules to be less stringent for horses, then the next thing that is going to happen is that the ag industry is going to want to lower the standards for other animals for human consumption as well. Hmmm, that is not something I want happening in my country and to our food supply.

    Fairfax constantly alludes to new testing that will allow them to test every horse while it is still alive. I have asked for him to tell us more about this, but he has ignored every one of my requests so I have to question if this is really being developed. A test such as this would be important and would show that the industry is truly trying to improve.
    Summed up in a nutshell.

    Comrade betonbill


    6 members found this post helpful.

  19. #59
    Join Date
    Jan. 25, 2011
    Location
    Southern Pines, NC
    Posts
    2,336

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    Quote Originally Posted by Discobold View Post
    So, dear comrades, what exactly is a RARA? I think I should know since I just signed up to be one. I think my "aha" moment came when I just got plain old tired of apologizing for being a vegetarian, non-smoker, animal lover, tree hugger who drives a hybrid
    Radical Animal Rights Activist, I believe. Welcome, Comrade Discobold!
    I've heard there's more to life than an FEI tent and hotel rooms, so I'm trying it.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  20. #60
    Join Date
    Sep. 7, 2009
    Location
    Lexington, KY
    Posts
    17,780

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    Good morning Comrades. Power to the horses!
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant


    8 members found this post helpful.

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