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  1. #81
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    Once you realize the horse is too dangerous for a trainer, why would you not just put him down?
    I have a Fjord! Life With Oden


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  2. #82
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Oh yeah, the mark of a compassionate trainer is one who sells on an allegedly incurable flipper so some other unsuspecting person can be paralyzed. Competition for Mother Theresa right there!
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


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  3. #83
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    Oct. 29, 2000
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    Southern Pines, N.C.
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    I have only read through p2, so my post may be repetitive. Sorry, if so.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Yes, lying to get a horse which is advertised as "free to a good home" IS against the law.

    The tort is "Fraud In The Inducement". Since no consideration changed hands, there was no contract, but there was fraud.

    'But for" the lie the seller would never have given her horse to this trainer.

    The problem here is the issue of damages. Seller has already proven that the horse has no monetary value. So she cannot get damages for the fraud. However, the judge is free to award punitive damages against the trainer, both for fraud and pain and suffering.

    I am not sure if punitive damages are available in small claims court, though.

    I sure would have sued the trainer in small claims court. If nothing else, you get a judgment against him which will show up for 5? 7? years if anyone checks.
    "I used to have money, now I have horses."


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  4. #84
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    Oct. 29, 2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cindyg View Post
    Once you realize the horse is too dangerous for a trainer, why would you not just put him down?
    ^^^^^ This.

    No ethical horseman would/should get rid of a horse who might seriously injure the new owner. Even if the flipping problem is the real story, this trainer is still grossly unethical/negligent in selling a horse "to a private home" without full disclosure.

    And, if he fully disclosed the "problem" there is no chance that the horse would be sold to an individual.

    This trainer is a sleeze bag no matter which story is true.
    "I used to have money, now I have horses."


    8 members found this post helpful.

  5. #85
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    May. 24, 2011
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    New Jersey
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    As someone who rode with him I can say he is extremely unethical and this news does not surprise me at all. I saw several things in that barn that would make me run far away. This one only makes me want to run faster


    7 members found this post helpful.

  6. #86
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    Feb. 18, 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helpus View Post
    I saw that post on my FB page too. It made me ill. Thank the Internet for being able to spread the word about people like this. I am glad the story had a happy outcome.
    I would say quite the opposite. The internet, Facebook especially is what assists in spreading the word, the words that are often untrue.


    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    why would someone take a free horse and then dump it at an auction? esp if they are a well known trainer? must be far more to this story.....

    also, i find it disturbing (but wish i had thought of it sooner!) that someone can take a private/friends only FB post and do a screen shot and then post it publicly.

    <shudder> well there goes the last amount of FB posting i will ever do!
    I agree with every bit of this, two sides to every story and this person's side sounds highly unlikely. The reposting or screen shot availability is so intrusive and shouldn't be allowed.



  7. #87
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    Jul. 25, 2003
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    Boston Area
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    You can screen shot anything. It's no big secret and no one should post anything that's private and expect it to stay that way.

    The post that was circulated was not private.
    Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
    EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.


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  8. #88
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Philadelphia PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by strides View Post
    I would say quite the opposite. The internet, Facebook especially is what assists in spreading the word, the words that are often untrue.




    I agree with every bit of this, two sides to every story and this person's side sounds highly unlikely. The reposting or screen shot availability is so intrusive and shouldn't be allowed.


    You know what I find SUPER weird...

    There are a number of long-time posters with sufficient post history that it's not hard to figure out who they are and that they are who they appear to be. Many of them have first-hand experience with the trainer at issue. All of them, some more politely than others, but ALL of them seem to question the trainer's ethics/business practices.

    The only "defenders" of this trainer are a poster with 35 posts who hasn't revealed any bias but perhaps might have some to reveal? And another one who seems to have been created exclusively to respond to this thread.

    One's reputation in the community speaks volumes, IMHO. And it's spoken not only on public BBs but elsewhere too.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    4 members found this post helpful.

  9. #89
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    Aug. 15, 2008
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    Well this took a turn, eh?

    I suspected it might, but it took longer than I guessed.
    "Aye God, Woodrow..."


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  10. #90
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    Jul. 23, 2007
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    New Jersey
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long Spot View Post
    Well this took a turn, eh?

    I suspected it might, but it took longer than I guessed.
    HUH? not sure I get what you are saying here??
    Adriane
    Happily retired but used to be:
    www.ParrotNutz.com



  11. #91
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    May. 24, 2011
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    New Jersey
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    141

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    He really isn't a well known trainer though. He has a bad reputation and next to no clients. He got lucky and into a few nice, big barns without trainers but he quickly lost good graces there.


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  12. #92
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    Aug. 5, 2007
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    Jersey girl!
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    Quote Originally Posted by strides View Post
    I would say quite the opposite. The internet, Facebook especially is what assists in spreading the word, the words that are often untrue.



    I agree with every bit of this, two sides to every story and this person's side sounds highly unlikely. The reposting or screen shot availability is so intrusive and shouldn't be allowed.
    Well I have heard his side of the story and it wasn't much different than what was posted. Just slightly twisted but even his version didn't make him sound innocent or in the right.
    Celtic Charisma (R.I.P) ~ http://flickr.com/photos/rockandracehorses/2387275281
    Proud owner of "The Intoxicated Moose!"
    "Hope is not an executable plan" ~ My Mom
    I love my Dublin-ator


    3 members found this post helpful.

  13. #93
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Showjumper28 View Post
    Well I have heard his side of the story and it wasn't much different than what was posted. Just slightly twisted but even his version didn't make him sound innocent or in the right.
    That's the problem with people who lack ethics, they tend to not understand why people are mad and end up defending themselves against the completely wrong point. As someone who was going to spend money on this trainer, I am so thankful for Facebook, the Internet, and COTH. I would have hated to find out after the fact or the hard way.
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  14. #94
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammicat View Post
    That's the problem with people who lack ethics, they tend to not understand why people are mad and end up defending themselves against the completely wrong point. As someone who was going to spend money on this trainer, I am so thankful for Facebook, the Internet, and COTH. I would have hated to find out after the fact or the hard way.
    So true. In some way, the trainer's "defense" was MORE unethical than the original accusation. Imagine being a professional and passing along to a totally unsuspecting buyer through auction and horse you think has a pre-existing problem that could KILL a rider! That's in some ways much worse than duping someone into giving you a horse so you can flip it for financial profit. At least in the latter no one will get physically hurt?!
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    4 members found this post helpful.

  15. #95
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by vxf111 View Post
    So true. In some way, the trainer's "defense" was MORE unethical than the original accusation. Imagine being a professional and passing along to a totally unsuspecting buyer through auction and horse you think has a pre-existing problem that could KILL a rider! That's in some ways much worse than duping someone into giving you a horse so you can flip it for financial profit. At least in the latter no one will get physically hurt?!
    Exactly!
    ~ In the chaos of the showing, remember riding should be fun for all, including our 4-legged kids.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  16. #96
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    Aug. 15, 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parrotnutz View Post
    HUH? not sure I get what you are saying here??
    Nothing nefarious. Just that "someone" showed up who "knows all about it" to proclaim everyone else knows nothing about it and we should find better things to do than to discuss it.

    AKA...the usual kind of train wreck.

    The "took longer" means I was sort of expecting it since the first post, but then it died down and the thread seemed forgotten until, BAM! And insider sets everyone "straight" while at the same time, bumping up something everyone had forgotten about. Again, the usual.
    "Aye God, Woodrow..."


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  17. #97
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    Jul. 23, 2007
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    New Jersey
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long Spot View Post
    Nothing nefarious. Just that "someone" showed up who "knows all about it" to proclaim everyone else knows nothing about it and we should find better things to do than to discuss it.

    AKA...the usual kind of train wreck.

    The "took longer" means I was sort of expecting it since the first post, but then it died down and the thread seemed forgotten until, BAM! And insider sets everyone "straight" while at the same time, bumping up something everyone had forgotten about. Again, the usual.
    HAHAHAHA I See said the Blond woman.
    Adriane
    Happily retired but used to be:
    www.ParrotNutz.com


    4 members found this post helpful.

  18. #98
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    Feb. 18, 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by vxf111 View Post
    You know what I find SUPER weird...

    There are a number of long-time posters with sufficient post history that it's not hard to figure out who they are and that they are who they appear to be. Many of them have first-hand experience with the trainer at issue. All of them, some more politely than others, but ALL of them seem to question the trainer's ethics/business practices.

    The only "defenders" of this trainer are a poster with 35 posts who hasn't revealed any bias but perhaps might have some to reveal? And another one who seems to have been created exclusively to respond to this thread.

    One's reputation in the community speaks volumes, IMHO. And it's spoken not only on public BBs but elsewhere too.
    I don't have any "first-hand experience with the trainer at issue" and I do not find myself being one of the "defenders of this trainer" either. I'm stating my personal opinion, which was that "there are two sides to every story" and that "Facebook especially is what assists in spreading the word". So no, I am not defending the trainer and I have not a clue of who this person is beyond what was stated in the OT. No one is trying to hide their reputation or identity, especially considering the fact that you and I connected no more than a month ago.

    Facebook can be a useful tool and a weapon. I agree that it is a great method to find information, but it can also be a weapon to spread false information. Whether this information is false or true I don't know, to be honest I skimmed the thread until I came across the Facebook statement. Perhaps I should have thoroughly read all of what I was contributing to.
    Last edited by strides; Apr. 2, 2013 at 11:01 PM. Reason: Adding last few words


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  19. #99
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by strides View Post
    I don't have any "first-hand experience with the trainer at issue" and I do not find myself being one of the "defenders of this trainer" either. I'm stating my personal opinion, which was that "there are two sides to every story" and that "Facebook especially is what assists in spreading the word". So no, I am not defending the trainer and I have not a clue of who this person is beyond what was stated in the OT. No one is trying to hide their reputation or identity, especially considering the fact that you and I connected no more than a month ago.

    Facebook can be a useful tool and a weapon. I agree that it is a great method to find information, but it can also be a weapon to spread false information. Whether this information is false or true I don't know, to be honest I skimmed the thread until I came across the Facebook statement. Perhaps I should have thoroughly read all of what I was contributing to.
    How are there "2 sides to every story" when the trainer posted his "side" on THIS VERY THREAD (posts 74-77) and it was WORSE than what he was accused of originally?! Pretty much the last 2 pages of this thread are about the trainer's "side?!"Go back and read his own "defense" of what he did and then maybe you'll see why it seemed really odd to me that someone would say "there are 2 sides to this story." The trainer's own "side" was that he sold onto some poor unsuspecting person a horse he had deemed too dangerous for a professional to ride and unfixable.

    If we met, I don't remember and I apologize or else you'll have to better jog my memory.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


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  20. #100
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    Feb. 18, 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by vxf111 View Post
    How are there "2 sides to every story" when the trainer posted his "side" on THIS VERY THREAD (posts 74-77) and it was WORSE than what he was accused of originally?! Pretty much the last 2 pages of this thread are about the trainer's "side?!"Go back and read his own "defense" of what he did and then maybe you'll see why it seemed really odd to me that someone would say "there are 2 sides to this story." The trainer's own "side" was that he sold onto some poor unsuspecting person a horse he had deemed too dangerous for a professional to ride and unfixable.

    If we met, I don't remember and I apologize or else you'll have to better jog my memory.
    Again, like I said before I did not read the entire thread and I had no idea that the trainer herself contributed to this post. I specifically said "there are two sides to every story" clearly one is untrue. I don't know this person or her story, suppose I should go back and read the previous 4 pages. Curious to see what the trainer had to say here.
    Last edited by strides; Apr. 2, 2013 at 11:09 PM. Reason: Correction: Himself



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