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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    um really? it's that fact that many women still choose to drop out of the workforce and become non-working dependents that is THE major contributing factor to women being paid less- why bother to pay more when she'll just leave after she gets married? is the thinking. Clearly women aren't serious about working, why bother paying them? is the thinking. Why take them seriously? they aren't serious about working, all they want is to stay home and play with babies. You SAHMs are dragging us all down.
    I can't believe some women are still so stupid that they are willing to sacrifice any chance at having a decent future and actual independence by deciding to resume a child-like state of dependence upon some man. And don't give me that hooey about how hard SAHMs work- they work less than anyone else. All of us who work do everything you do, plus we work.

    So don't choose the route of "dependent on some man who can walk off and leave you destitute and unemployable at any time he pleases".

    anyway, it depends on where you live as to how much money you need- around here, you'd better bring on over $150k or you can't afford a horse unless you like eating beans n rice and wearing rags. Also pay very close attention to the person who said you may need to think about sacrificing money for time.
    No really....tell us what you really think.

    So there it is folks...any woman who gets married, has children or stays home to raise them is RUINING it for ALL womens EVERYWHERE! I hope all y'all are happy now, you lazy co-dependent morons!

    OP...my neighbor is also an RN. Recently retired in her 50s. She has 10 acres, house, barn, newer tractor, brand new SUV, pickup and 8 horses. She can't "stay retired" due to having that many horses in Connecticut and keeping them fed. We have more woods than grass so she goes through about 2000 bales of hay annually. She keeps her horses well, but minimally. She doesn't ride, so no showing, etc. But she could do the showing and training, etc if she had fewer horses.
    But she's got her retirement and also works part time (2-3 days per week for 4-6 hours) as a visiting nurse. She has to drive 40 minutes to the area her patients live, she loves the job and the people now too. She's a single person doing it all on her own. Not sure if that helps, I don't know if nursing interests you, if it pays the same where you live or what the cost of living is where you are. Would you be willing to relocate for the horsie lifestyle affordability?
    You jump in the saddle,
    Hold onto the bridle!
    Jump in the line!
    ...Belefonte


    4 members found this post helpful.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4cornersfarm View Post
    Yes, please. I'd like to know where this magical land is!!
    Check out the CNN/Money magazine Best Places to Live list.

    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/money...s/2012/top100/

    You can't directly get at whether or not the type of land you're interested in is available, but it gives you a nice list to start with.



  3. #63
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    Oct. 25, 2012
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    Wow! Lots of interesting - and sometimes inflammatory - replies, plus an interesting array of career choices I wish I would have considered when I finished up my BS in Biology! The only two things I would add that I have not seen are:

    1) Do not go into a bunch of student loan debt for an advanced degree unless you are fairly certain that a) you will LOVE the job it prepares you for or b) it will give you a reasonable return on your investment (not that easy these days). And

    2) Start saving for retirement right away, even if it seems like a gazillion years will go by before you retire and ESPECIALLY if the company you eventually work for has any type of 401 K matching.

    Keeping your debt under control and having some financial cushion really opens up a world of possibilities when it comes to work for $$ versus work you love in order to keep a horsey life and food on the table. You have a long time to do either or both. Good luck!
    Last edited by twostinkydogs; Mar. 7, 2013 at 02:59 PM. Reason: Grammar!!!!!


    4 members found this post helpful.

  4. #64
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    Jan. 8, 2013
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    Nursing might be a good route to explore and in hind sight, I may have gone that route. A major reason being that it can't be outsourced. I've been fortunate enough to never have lost a job due to outsourcing, but know of many who have.

    As for me, I'm an accountant who's been in the field for 8.5 years. Starting salary was $40k and now make about double that.

    On $40k, in the midwest, I was able to pay for cheap board, farrier, & vet for one horse ($400/mo), and rent / house payment in modest but safe housing for me ($550/mo + $250/mo in utilities). I had a truck payment and insurance of $450/mo and spent about $300/mo in gas (3/4 ton truck) and another $300/mo in food (limited eating out). If you add all of that up, that's $27k/year. You can expect to pay 1/3 of your salary in taxes, so that pretty much takes care of all the take home pay. Note that I did not budget money for clothing, lessons, horse shows, vacations, or savings of any kind (including retirement). I made it work, but money was definitely tight and I did things like working off some of my board at the barn and picking up paid training rides on some of the other boarders' horses. At one point I picked up a roommate to share housing costs too. So, it can be done on a smaller income, but you'll need to be diligent about making a budget and sticking to it. And, you may need to pass on lessons and showing for a while.

    That said, there are some things I would have changed...

    -If at all possible, find a horse to partial lease for the first couple years of your career (whatever you choose). You will need to establish yourself in your career and likely won't have a lot of free time, so a part-time horse with less financial obligations could be ideal.

    -Start saving immediately when you get out your first job. Maximize any matching 401k contributions that your employer may offer and be sure at least 10% of your gross salary is going towards retirement (this can include employer matching). Also, build up your emergency fund right away (6 months income). You may need to start with less going towards savings when you first start, but increase your savings by the full amount of your raise each year until you have reached both of these goals.


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  5. #65
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    Jul. 18, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp View Post
    Warning: Rant Ahead:

    Ah yes, when all else fails, the SAHM vs. the WWs (working women) start in-fighting. It's a politically bad idea since, while y'all are cannibalizing each other, the gender as a whole is being paid less than men for the same job. One could better put one's energy elsewhere.

    In any case, I *do* think someone researching careers with respect to pay needs to know whether folks are talking about their career within the context of a one- or two-income family.

    Oh, and the section of the country you choose is a big deal too as the cost of living varies. IMO, we need a thread about areas of the country that have that magic combination of cheap land and well-paying jobs.
    amen on that one sista!! Lets stop bickering and lobby for equal salaries for working gals and more respect for SAHM's...
    I could only afford to own a horse and be a parttime secretary at a small company in New Mexico!! No grand jobs here except in the larger city areas but cost of living definately doable in this state. I'm married - husband pays most housing costs - I work to pay for horsey and training. I use to be a working student, paid groom, then worked in the marketing side of the IT industry - where I made a ton of $$ and traveled alot, but no horses. I'm happy now in much quieter life and one horse to dote on.


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  6. #66
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    Oct. 4, 2010
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    Hey OP!

    I recall a similar post awhile back about careers and horses and there was a lot of great information in that one as well! Might want to give it a read.

    http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...r-horse-owners

    FF



  7. #67
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    Feb. 22, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by twostinkydogs View Post
    1) Do not go into a bunch of student loan debt for an advanced degree unless you are fairly certain that a) you will LOVE the job it prepares you for or b) it will give you a reasonable return on your investment (not that easy these days).
    I have my B.S. and M.S. in meteorology (and I'm not a forecaster). Two reasons why I went to grad school: 1) I couldn't find a job in my field without being paid near poverty level (around 20K or so) and 2) I received a stipend while getting my degree. Most science fields will pay you to get your advanced degree. I was considered a Research Assistant, while a couple of my friends were Teaching Assistants (taught the lab portion of a class). But with research grant money being harder to come by, its difficult to ensure that you'll get paid to go to school.

    After I graduated from grad school, I got a nice-paying entry level job with a federal contractor. After putting in my dues there, a government job opened up in the same place I was a contractor and I was lucky enough to get it (although they did want me in the position).

    I didn't buy my horse until last year (more than a year after I got the govt position). I had saved up enough money to buy my horse and all the other things needed (saddle, other tack, etc). A year later, and I've now saved up enough to buy a truck (brand new because I can't find what I want used). I expect to be able to buy my trailer next year.

    After housing costs (share home with SO), food, horse board ($340 per month) and other bills, I have about $1200 a month in excess to play with. And I am contributing 10% of my pre-tax salary toward my 401K.

    I'm lucky enough to love the field I'm in. Try to find something that interests you and go from there. Good luck!



  8. #68
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    Jun. 24, 2005
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    I work in a corporate, senior-management-type job that permits me to have a horse in full training in an expensive area, relatively comfortably, and pay for pretty much any care I wish to have (chiro, massage, whatever). I spend about 2k a month on routine horse expenses. If I moved to the burbs, I could have two horses. However, it took me almost 10 years post-college to get to the point where I as a single person can own a horse, stay debt-free, save for retirement, and not feel like I'm living one vet bill from the edge. During that 10 years, I had extensive horse-free periods, periods where I could barely afford lessons, periods where I could afford half-leasing but not ownership, etc.

    However, my advice would be that money isn't the only factor to consider. I mean that in terms of thinking also about family, hopes, dreams, satisfying occupation, blah blah blah, but mostly I mean that money isn't the only way a job can limit your riding capabilities.

    If I had it all to do all over again, I'd also look for a) careers with jobs available in suburban or country locations, so it doesn't take you an hour and a half to get to the barn every time you want to ride, and b) careers with flexible hours or autonomy over your time.

    Lack of money may kill your riding dreams, but lack of time will kill them even faster, IMO. I rode more when I made less money, though it wasn't on my own horse.



  9. #69
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    Oct. 25, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by suzier444 View Post

    If I had it all to do all over again, I'd also look for a) careers with jobs available in suburban or country locations, so it doesn't take you an hour and a half to get to the barn every time you want to ride, and b) careers with flexible hours or autonomy over your time.
    ^^Forgot this in my list. I am fortunate enough to work for the government and was able to switch to a position with less responsibility but increased flexibility in schedule/telecommuting which made all the difference in time to devote to riding. Fortunately I did not have to take a pay cut, but I think I may have been underpaid to begin with.

    I think this also ties into the location dimension. I live in DC where the salaries are higher, but the cost of living - and particularly horse care - eats up the difference in the end. I think the trick there is to start your career in a place that has a high-cost of living and then manage your career to be able to move to a lower-cost of living area later on. I did the exact opposite in my mid-30s and now I am seriously thinking of moving back. I drool over the little farmettes I could buy for the same price as my rowhouse in a "transitional" neighborhood



  10. #70
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    Jan. 6, 2001
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    I am a marketing communications manager for a small alternative energy company. My salary allows me to pay the bills, save for retirement, work aggressively to pay off my mortgage and afford my two horses at home at the cost of up to $450/month. I generally take 2 lessons a month. I don't show (can't afford to and don't enjoy it anyway).

    I don't...have a cell phone...have cable...have an entertainment budget...drive an expensive car...live in an expensive part of the country...go out to eat much...buy much in the way of clothing very often. Primarily that's because of the aggressive plan on paying off the mortgage, not because of the horses.

    I love what I do and where I live. It would be nice to have a little more wiggle room in the budget, but I can do what I need to do, some of what I want to do, and can save for things like a trip to Disneyland.



  11. #71
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    LadyNeon...not to be nosy but could you say what careers, other than forecaster, can be done with a meteorology degree? Understood if you don't want to say what you do, was just wondering. I always assumed meteorology automatically meant weatherperson of some sort.
    You jump in the saddle,
    Hold onto the bridle!
    Jump in the line!
    ...Belefonte



  12. #72
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    Feb. 8, 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4cornersfarm View Post
    Yes, please. I'd like to know where this magical land is!!
    Lynchburg, VA

    I make a pretty darned good salary (senior accountant), and own a 5 acre farmette that has low, low, low property taxes. Think less than $600 a year.

    NoSuchPerson, the only areas in Virginia that list shows are the high dollar places around Washington D.C.

    Southern Virginia is where the cheap land and low taxes are located, not in Reston, Arlington, or Dale City, so that list is pretty much useless if folks are looking for places to have horses on a single person's salary.
    The plural of anecdote is not data.



  13. #73
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    Apr. 10, 2006
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    Interesting thread... I am in Western NY where cost of living is low, but so are salaries. It is kind of a "blue collar" town that was always somewhat depressed, so in some ways we haven't been hit as hard by the economic recession... since we were always kinda in a recession... lol. Unfortunately, in NYS, we have a lot of taxes... :P

    My husband has a good job in healthcare administration. I am a graphic designer and work in marketing/advertising. I now freelance which offers me a lot of flexibility to be with my kids, but not always a ton of stability. He makes significantly more money than I. We split the bills (though admittedly he takes care of the larger ones like the mortgage) and I fund my horse hobby myself. I work part-time as a riding instructor to help with my horse expenses.

    I will probably never buy a horse for more than 5k, will not show extensively, but that is ok. I am happy boarding at a decent facility which is mid-range in price, lessoning a few times a month, hitting up a local show/clinic here and there. That more than satisfies my horsey itch. Even if I did go back to working full-time and made more, I am happy with my current level of horsey-ness and am not comfortable devoting more funds than I currently am to my hobby.

    I think you have to adjust your expectations and your horsey hobby depending on your income, lifestyle, etc. Things change, as jobs and family dynamics change. If you can accept the fact that you might have to adjust your participation depending on those things, it makes life a lot easier/happier.
    We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.


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  14. #74
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    Dec. 18, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    um really? it's that fact that many women still choose to drop out of the workforce and become non-working dependents that is THE major contributing factor to women being paid less- why bother to pay more when she'll just leave after she gets married? is the thinking. Clearly women aren't serious about working, why bother paying them? is the thinking. Why take them seriously? they aren't serious about working, all they want is to stay home and play with babies. You SAHMs are dragging us all down.
    I can't believe some women are still so stupid that they are willing to sacrifice any chance at having a decent future and actual independence by deciding to resume a child-like state of dependence upon some man. And don't give me that hooey about how hard SAHMs work- they work less than anyone else. All of us who work do everything you do, plus we work.
    OMG. Just wow.

    FWIW, most of the stay-at-home "moms" I know are equally educated as their working partner, and some of the "moms" are the dads. So, should the working partner walk off and leave, most of us won't be destitute.

    Luckily some people ARE interested in reproducing and caring for the children that will carry on our race - sorry to drag y'all down on the way though.

    Definitely look at the area you live in for guidance on career paths - I moved to the state capital after my bachelor's degree, and really didn't have a plan. I decided to get a masters in Public Administration because of where I lived. Before I became a sponging parasite to my working husband, I earned about $80K -- ETA: forgot to say that I was an Administrative Director for government and quasi-government offices. -- After we had a family, I stopped working which allowed him to earn much more than he would have without the freedom my staying home allowed him. And since his job paid more than mine, that made the most sense.

    So, I don't feel that I've surrendered my independence or have a child-like state of dependence on some man. Frankly, I think he has a child-like dependence on ME, if you really want to know the truth.

    However, you can make horse ownership work in so many ways. It all depends on your goals and ability to budget for them. I could probably afford to show on the A circuit but I would never want to - nor am I even close to being good enough. But we own a farm and I keep my horses at home, and that works for me.
    Last edited by S1969; Mar. 7, 2013 at 05:48 PM.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  15. #75
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    Sep. 23, 2002
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    I'm an assistant librarian at a private university and make just over 36k. DH is lead engineer at a mobile game company and makes 3x as much as I do. And what I can afford horse-wise is a part-lease (one ride, one lesson a week). I'm hoping to be able to do 2-3 shows at the local schooling show series this summer. Ahh, how I love Metrowest Massachusetts! UGH.

    Granted, we've been saving really vigorously in order to sell this house and buy another closer to where we work. I'm hoping that once that's done and finances settle down after that, I can afford more. But I won't hold my breath - full board around here is INSANE and I don't have the time for rough.



  16. #76
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    Dec. 19, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    um really? it's that fact that many women still choose to drop out of the workforce and become non-working dependents that is THE major contributing factor to women being paid less- why bother to pay more when she'll just leave after she gets married? is the thinking. Clearly women aren't serious about working, why bother paying them? is the thinking. Why take them seriously? they aren't serious about working, all they want is to stay home and play with babies. You SAHMs are dragging us all down.
    I can't believe some women are still so stupid that they are willing to sacrifice any chance at having a decent future and actual independence by deciding to resume a child-like state of dependence upon some man. And don't give me that hooey about how hard SAHMs work- they work less than anyone else. All of us who work do everything you do, plus we work.

    So don't choose the route of "dependent on some man who can walk off and leave you destitute and unemployable at any time he pleases".

    anyway, it depends on where you live as to how much money you need- around here, you'd better bring on over $150k or you can't afford a horse unless you like eating beans n rice and wearing rags. Also pay very close attention to the person who said you may need to think about sacrificing money for time.
    Okay then. How about a SAHM who got her bachelor's degree, began teaching middle school, acquired her master's while teaching, and taught about 5-6 years or so and then left to have have a child or two while her husband worked and made over 100k so they're comfortable. Said SAHM also had invested money earlier in life and could now dip into that and survive for a few years should SHTF. Said SAHM did not want to "play with babies" all day. The ultimate decision was DH and SAHM did not want someone else to be raising their kids (in daycare) while paying lots of $$ for it. It's not just about women being lazy. As the kids got older SAHM will go adjunct teach at a community college more than likely. So uh yeah, don't lump all SAHM's together


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  17. #77
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    Sep. 25, 2009
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    I couldn't decide what I wanted to do as a career either, so I decided to spend my first 2-3 years out of college taking any temp jobs that sounded interesting in various fields. After each job, I'd evaluate what I liked and what I didn't like about the job, then started ranking likes/dislikes in order of importance to me. This whole process was made much easier because I was able to work/budget a lot throughout college and graduated without any debt, plus I was single, which let me be flexible about pretty much everything. I know this method wouldn't work for everyone, but it worked well for me and how my brain tends to work.

    This whole process has led me to a career path I'd never have seen myself in originally, but it's one I'm thrilled about pursuing, has a flexible schedule and starts around $60,000/yr (some fluctuations for various parts of the country, of course, but very close to that across the board). It's got 3 solid years of additional school, but tuition is reasonable and I'm easily paying for it while working my current mundane job. I've already got a BS in Equine Science (with a science concentration, as I originally thought I wanted to be a vet too, lol) and an AS in General Science and am in school again for Integrative Manual Therapy.

    Good luck with whatever you decide!


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  18. #78
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    Mar. 4, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    um really? it's that fact that many women still choose to drop out of the workforce and become non-working dependents that is THE major contributing factor to women being paid less- why bother to pay more when she'll just leave after she gets married? is the thinking. Clearly women aren't serious about working, why bother paying them? is the thinking. Why take them seriously? they aren't serious about working, all they want is to stay home and play with babies. You SAHMs are dragging us all down.
    I can't believe some women are still so stupid that they are willing to sacrifice any chance at having a decent future and actual independence by deciding to resume a child-like state of dependence upon some man. And don't give me that hooey about how hard SAHMs work- they work less than anyone else. All of us who work do everything you do, plus we work.

    So don't choose the route of "dependent on some man who can walk off and leave you destitute and unemployable at any time he pleases".

    anyway, it depends on where you live as to how much money you need- around here, you'd better bring on over $150k or you can't afford a horse unless you like eating beans n rice and wearing rags. Also pay very close attention to the person who said you may need to think about sacrificing money for time.
    Or how about someone who was a very successful independent consultant and stayed at home with her kids? Was I dragging the rest of womanhood down? Don't think so as I grossed over 6 figures for several years running AND did everything I wanted to do with my kids while they were growing up. And was supportive to my husband in his very demanding career.

    There are many roads to success these days. Very poor form to stereotype that which you apparently know nothing about.

    That was a very very rude post you made there Wendy. And unnecessarily derailed a pretty informative thread.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  19. #79
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    Sep. 4, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by arabhorse2 View Post
    Lynchburg, VA

    I make a pretty darned good salary (senior accountant), and own a 5 acre farmette that has low, low, low property taxes. Think less than $600 a year.

    NoSuchPerson, the only areas in Virginia that list shows are the high dollar places around Washington D.C.

    Southern Virginia is where the cheap land and low taxes are located, not in Reston, Arlington, or Dale City, so that list is pretty much useless if folks are looking for places to have horses on a single person's salary.
    Well, I didn't say every place on the list would be suitable, I simply said it was a place to start looking. As opposed to throwing darts in a map. Plus, that "magical land" was supposed to have not just cheap land, but also availability of good-paying jobs.

    You could also try the Forbes Cheapest Places to Live list, but I think it's a little dated. I didn't see any Virginia cities listed on that one.

    Edited to add that the reason I'm familiar with all these lists is that I've been searching for the perfect place to retire. Unfortunately, my personal perfect place doesn't seem to exist.

    I also forgot to include one of the best web sites. It asks you a bunch of questions about what you want in an area and then gives you a list of places that meet your criteria. http://www.bestplaces.net/ Select "Find your best place" from the list at the top.
    Last edited by NoSuchPerson; Mar. 7, 2013 at 07:13 PM.



  20. #80
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    Feb. 28, 2011
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    I read the other thread and I'm laughing as I type...my husband is a plumber/heating/ac mechanic. I don't work. Three grown kids. 5 horses. 3 at home. 2 boarded at a barn with an indoor.


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