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  1. #41
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    Jul. 11, 2011
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    262

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    I have seen (non-successful) trainers use both side reins and draw reins at the same time. Sad but true!


    3 members found this post helpful.

  2. #42
    Join Date
    May. 4, 2003
    Location
    Canada
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    13,986

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    I thought your story was going to go full circle wher the friend's friend was going to lambaste you for involving yourself in her darling rider -- good for you for having the moral courage. Pity the horses that rider gets next time.
    Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    636

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    Good for you, Arab_Mare! You should be commended for your courage. If you are ever in Kansas, let me know and I'll buy you a drink or two. *bows respectfully*

    Having a vet and a chiro come out on a Sunday is completely plausible, especially at the bigger barns.

    I was a working student/head groom at a BNT barn lo these many years ago. I had carte blanche to call out the vet for any horse in the barn (no chiro back then) without prior authorization any time day or night.

    Grooms/working students (esp. mexican-american ones like me) are pretty much invisible at the bigger barns and at shows. I could tell you stories from those days that would give you nightmares. Things Were Different back then, the protections that we have in place now did not exist then. I did what I could, but still...

    So yes, Arab_Mare's story rings true.

    If anyone thinks that I am making things up or am otherwise trolling, please feel free to PM me.;I'm more than happy to send you my horsey CV and references.

    My number of posts is low, too. I'm horribly painfully shy, so it's very anxiety-inducing for me to post.

    Best Regards,
    Amber


    12 members found this post helpful.

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    636

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    Quote Originally Posted by BabyGreen View Post
    A poster with relatively few posts who is the hero of her own, very unlikely, story. I call BS.
    From my experience in the horse industry, I find Arab_Mare's story to be absolutely plausible, so common as to be almost unremarkable. Try being a groom at the big shows for a few years; you'll see stuff like this All The Time.

    Also: Do we have a houseguest among us?

    Best Regards,
    Amber


    6 members found this post helpful.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Nov. 2, 2001
    Location
    Packing my bags
    Posts
    30,899

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    Quote Originally Posted by californianinkansas View Post

    My number of posts is low, too. I'm horribly painfully shy, so it's very anxiety-inducing for me to post.

    Best Regards,
    Amber
    Have some box wine. It helps overcome shyness
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozart View Post
    Personally, I think the moderate use of shock collars in training humans should be allowed.


    10 members found this post helpful.

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    40,097

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    Quote Originally Posted by ReSomething View Post
    Side reins and draw reins at the same time, well no, but I've seen something recently that made me take a step back. I think that what you are used to can dull your sensitivity to a particular method, the long speeches I got many years ago about the Right Way and the Things we Don't Use have made me very unlikely to use draw reins. But other people I know have never gotten those speeches.
    In Europe, I spent some years as an assistant instructor in a BNT riding center to eventually become an instructor.
    There, one lesson was about draw reins, what they did, with a horse model, attached different ways.
    We were using draw reins as a second rein, regular reins on the snaffle, the draw reins a thinner, smaller size, so your hand could feel which was which.
    Each one of us got a ride with them to get a feel for what they did and they didn't.

    We had a big lecture that made an impression in all of us, about how dangerous a tool they were, "like a razor in a monkey's hands", they were so powerful and at the same time so apt to get a horse falling into the biggest sin of training, behind the bit.

    In all those years, I never saw anyone ever using any draw reins but once, when a jumping, very talented but troubled Trakehner mare came to be retrained, that had been bolting and running of and injured several trainers.

    Our BNT checked her over well and some of what he tried was draw reins, with all of us watching, for about ten minutes two or three rides and then no more, once he had her understanding a giving hand meant search for contact.

    Scroll forward several years, I come to the West and what do I see?
    Practically all cutting trainers "loping" circles on their colts they have been starting and are now some months into training with nothing else but draw reins on board, some times those were a mere nylon string, not even leather.
    Yeah, horses were BTV big time, but that is the way so many western horses go.

    I also learned that BTV and no contact or made mouth on a horse doesn't has to mean they are on the forehand or discombobulated, if they are trained like that and to stay in self carriage.

    Still, I think it is scary to not have any at all on the other end of your reins, on a colt, but some string attached as draw reins.
    I rather have a that string around the neck and no bridle than that kind of false contact draw reins produce by themselves.

    I still say, riding with side reins attached and even more so attached very tight, as the OP described, is a bad wreck waiting to happen.
    That one is beyond scary.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Jan. 28, 2013
    Location
    Southeastern US
    Posts
    1,249

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    Good for you!



  8. #48
    Join Date
    May. 20, 2005
    Location
    Desert Southwest
    Posts
    6,254

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    Babygreen, YOUR post count's not all that high, either. What is it? Nobody has credibility till they reach a post count of 500? 600? 1000?

    I have little problem believing the OP's story, and congratulate her for acting in the horse's best interests.


    11 members found this post helpful.

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Nov. 2, 2001
    Location
    Packing my bags
    Posts
    30,899

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThreeFigs View Post
    Babygreen, YOUR post count's not all that high, either. What is it? Nobody has credibility till they reach a post count of 500? 600? 1000?

    I have little problem believing the OP's story, and congratulate her for acting in the horse's best interests.
    25k...

    no, wait... that's SLC...
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozart View Post
    Personally, I think the moderate use of shock collars in training humans should be allowed.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #50
    Join Date
    May. 13, 2012
    Posts
    196

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    Quote Originally Posted by BabyGreen View Post
    A poster with relatively few posts who is the hero of her own, very unlikely, story. I call BS.

    I WISH I was lying..it's something I NEVER, EVER, EVER, want to see or hear about again. Thank god the horse is okay. (and yes, the vet was stopping by the barns in the area anyway, and I'm not sure how the chiro was contacted, I'll have to ask for details later.)

    For those perturbed at my anger towards the teen..: Although I was/am pissed and angered at the teenager, I can understand how it wasn't completely her fault. Unfortunately some people find this okay, and whoever taught her this was okay, or allowed her to ride like this, is the one truly at fault. At this point I am letting the horse's owner deal with everything, I can only be level-headed so long!


    28 members found this post helpful.

  11. #51
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    636

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alagirl View Post
    Have some box wine. It helps overcome shyness
    That's a good idea. I'm getting a little to old for Boone's Farm.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  12. #52
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
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    636

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arab_Mare View Post
    I WISH I was lying..it's something I NEVER, EVER, EVER, want to see or hear about again. Thank god the horse is okay. (and yes, the vet was stopping by the barns in the area anyway, and I'm not sure how the chiro was contacted, I'll have to ask for details later.)

    For those perturbed at my anger towards the teen..: Although I was/am pissed and angered at the teenager, I can understand how it wasn't completely her fault. Unfortunately some people find this okay, and whoever taught her this was okay, or allowed her to ride like this, is the one truly at fault. At this point I am letting the horse's owner deal with everything, I can only be level-headed so long!
    I'm really curious to know how the girl's parents reacted?

    My mom would have beat my fanny right there in the arena if I'd pulled a stunt like that, sixteen years old or not. And I would have had to write a letter of apology to all parties involved.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  13. #53
    Join Date
    Sep. 29, 2009
    Posts
    2,576

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    Just reading your post OP.

    Good for you.



  14. #54
    Join Date
    May. 13, 2012
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    196

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    Quote Originally Posted by californianinkansas View Post
    I'm really curious to know how the girl's parents reacted?

    My mom would have beat my fanny right there in the arena if I'd pulled a stunt like that, sixteen years old or not. And I would have had to write a letter of apology to all parties involved.
    Too be honest, I am curious too. I'll contact the owner and ask. I have a feeling they aren't horse people and just let the girl do what she wants, unfortunately.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #55
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
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    Kansas
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    636

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    That horse is a saint. I'm glad that you saved him.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  16. #56
    Join Date
    Jun. 25, 2006
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    129

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    Kudos to you for taking charge of a BAD situation! I'm glad the horse is okay and the owner found out the truth. So many times people just close their eyes to what is going on around them.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  17. #57
    Join Date
    May. 13, 2012
    Posts
    196

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    Brief update:

    Apparently the teen has been riding with a trainer who trains "Dressage" (In quotations because it really can't be called dressage..) and uses these gadgets. The trainer knew the lady who was leasing the horse (Not anymore.), and suggested this teen for when the lady was out of town.

    The teen's parents work all day 5 days a week, and aren't horsey. They apparently didn't understand why draw reins + side reins were bad, and they aren't involved with the teen's instruction.

    The trainer instructed the teen to use what she had been taught and "teach him to be rounder while working" (Good gawd.) Thus this situation evolved. Apparently the horses the teen rides are so dead and over-bent they don't fight the restraints, yet this horse proved to be a challenge hence the temper tantrum I witnessed.

    More updates on the horse are coming.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  18. #58
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    636

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    Thank you for the update. The fact that the teen was told to do this by her professional trainer makes this whole situation seem even worse.

    Humans are an invasive species. Hopefully dolphins will evolve thumbs soon and take over the planet.

    You deserve a medal for handling this so perfectly. Are you okay? What you saw was pretty horrible.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  19. #59
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    May. 13, 2012
    Posts
    196

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    Quote Originally Posted by californianinkansas View Post
    Thank you for the update. The fact that the teen was told to do this by her professional trainer makes this whole situation seem even worse.

    Humans are an invasive species. Hopefully dolphins will evolve thumbs soon and take over the planet.

    You deserve a medal for handling this so perfectly. Are you okay? What you saw was pretty horrible.

    I think I am okay due to the fact the horse is okay so far. (Supposedly a ride either took place today or tomorrow, I'll find that out.) The horse is a complete saint - levelheaded and takes perfect care of everyone. Unfortunately that also means he handles complete crap. (Where are the evil mares when you need them??!?)

    And some drinks help.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  20. #60
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2012
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    636

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    Good.
    Please let us know how Mr. Saintly Warmblood is doing. Poor guy.


    1 members found this post helpful.

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