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  1. #21
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    If the question of whO has a legal right to the records were in doubt (I.e. the identity of the owner or client) then if i were the vet, there's no way I would release records without a court order for fear that I'd expose myself to liability from the other party to the suit who didnt want the records released. Seems better to let the court sort it out and then release with the protection of the court order.


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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by NCRider View Post
    If the question of whO has a legal right to the records were in doubt (I.e. the identity of the owner or client) then if i were the vet, there's no way I would release records without a court order for fear that I'd expose myself to liability from the other party to the suit who didnt want the records released. Seems better to let the court sort it out and then release with the protection of the court order.
    Those were my thoughts also
    I wasn't always a Smurf
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  3. #23
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    Depending on the state, it depends who the client is. Is it the owner or the trainer?
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant



  4. #24
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    I think it's amazing if people continue to do any kind of business with Parra. Many have argued both ways regarding his abilities as a trainer and rider. But he is undeniably out only for his own best personal interests so far as the almighty $ is concerned. He doesn't appear to have any moral compass whatsoever. It looks like his own greed have finally caught up with him.

    There are some individuals that are willing to send their horse to someone who has an iffy reputation on the treatment of their horses, so long as the horses win in the ring. But the second they think you're just waiting for a good opportunity to screw them over for tons of money, that's just a bridge too far.


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  5. #25
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    This is the same guy on the other thread? The one that likes to intimidate others on horseback? Maybe he should have a blind date with Ms. Mandarino over there in the hunter forum ... CoTH Noir.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
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    Whoever posted that he had the No. 666 at one of the shows .... priceless.


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  7. #27
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    I don't understand why he won't give them the records. They clearly proved they are the owners of these horses. At least thats how it reads to me. Very puzzling situation.
    "All top hat and no canter". *Graureiter*



  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gestalt View Post
    I don't understand why he won't give them the records. They clearly proved they are the owners of these horses. At least thats how it reads to me. Very puzzling situation.
    All that is is a copy of the plaintiff's complaint. It is not a judgement. I am sure the vet has legal council that is dictating his actions and waiting for a final decision from the courts regarding ownership. Yes, the owners have copies of a BOS (as shown in the documents) but in a case like this (with HUGE amounts of $$) i am sure the vet wants the COURTS to give the "yes" to those documents.

    All vets, including myself, carry PLIT (prof liability insurance) which supply legal council in situations like this.
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaroquePony View Post
    This is the same guy on the other thread? The one that likes to intimidate others on horseback? Maybe he should have a blind date with Ms. Mandarino over there in the hunter forum ... CoTH Noir.
    "Drawing on my fine command of the English language, I said nothing" - Robert Benchley
    Cotton would fight.
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gestalt View Post
    I don't understand why he won't give them the records. They clearly proved they are the owners of these horses. At least thats how it reads to me. Very puzzling situation.
    There is a difference between client and owner. Nothing in the complaint indicated that they were clients of the vet. Who authorized and paid for the vet services? That is the only person who can release the documents, not the vet and not the owner.


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  11. #31
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    When a PPE is done the owner does not have the rights to the records only the client. Read the NJ confidentiality law posted previously. It only states the client's rights not the owner's rights to vet records.


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  12. #32
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    and "client" is defined as "the person who asked for the vet's services and paid the vet"?



  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    When a PPE is done the owner does not have the rights to the records only the client. Read the NJ confidentiality law posted previously. It only states the client's rights not the owner's rights to vet records.
    How did a PPE enter into this? True, the prospective buyer owns the PPE records. Regarding this case, doesn't the following apply:

    N.J.A.C. 13:44-4.9 requires licensees to maintain patient records and sets forth the information that must be contained in patient records. Licensees must provide copies of records to the animal's owner, a representative of the owner or another veterinarian. The rule also sets forth procedures for the dissemination of patient records when a veterinary facility closes. The Board proposes to amend subsection (a) of this rule to require that the name of a veterinary facility appear on every [page=1134] page of a record. The rule is also proposed for amendment to combine provisions in paragraphs (a)1 and (a)10, which require identification of the treating licensee and the individual making entries into the record, and to recodify these combined provisions as new paragraph (a)2.


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  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by skykingismybaby1 View Post
    There is a difference between client and owner. Nothing in the complaint indicated that they were clients of the vet. Who authorized and paid for the vet services? That is the only person who can release the documents, not the vet and not the owner.
    which brings up a question: if trainer orders vet work, pays vet, then bills owner for vet invoice - who is client? trainer/owner/both?
    Nothing says "I love you" like a tractor. (Clydejumper)

    The reports states, “Elizabeth reported that she accidently put down this pony, ........, at the show.”


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  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGray View Post
    which brings up a question: if trainer orders vet work, pays vet, then bills owner for vet invoice - who is client? trainer/owner/both?
    Not an attorney, so just my personal opinion. I think in this case the client is the trainer insofar as the vet is concerned. However, the NJ rules says that the records must be turned over to the Owner. Therefore, I don't see how it matters who the client of the vet was.



  16. #36
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    I was told, from someone who probably knows, that Greg Staller was Parra's vet for X-rays etc/PPE (pre purchase exam) on this horse and legally can NOT release any records until the matter of ownership-of-horse and other legalities are settled by court decision.

    Isn't it also true that the subpena was withdrawn?


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  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToN Farm View Post
    Not an attorney, so just my personal opinion. I think in this case the client is the trainer insofar as the vet is concerned. However, the NJ rules says that the records must be turned over to the Owner. Therefore, I don't see how it matters who the client of the vet was.
    I think there is just enough uncertainty in the situation to make it wise to wait until the court determines who should have the records.
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.


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  18. #38
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    When dealing with privileged/protected information, lawyers actually use the phrase "letting the cat out of the bag." If there's any question at all, you don't. Period. Let the courts sort it out.


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  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaroquePony View Post
    This is the same guy on the other thread? The one that likes to intimidate others on horseback? Maybe he should have a blind date with Ms. Mandarino over there in the hunter forum ... CoTH Noir.
    You made me snort Diet Coke up my nose.


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  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by dudleyc View Post
    I was told, from someone who probably knows, that Greg Staller was Parra's vet for X-rays etc/PPE (pre purchase exam) on this horse and legally can NOT release any records until the matter of ownership-of-horse and other legalities are settled by court decision.

    Isn't it also true that the subpena was withdrawn?
    A sort of confusing situation here, but dudley's post seems to be a logical explanation of why records are w/held. Given how clear the rules seem to be, its hard to imagine that a vet would put themselves at risk for no reason.
    We don't get less brave; we get a bigger sense of self-preservation........



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