[Isabeau Z Solace]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Years and years ago, I used to buy the orphan foals from the local kill plant. Once, after paying for some foals, I got turned around and walked through the wrong door, straight into the kill chamber. It was clean and quiet, except for the clanking of the equipment and other things. The horses standing outside, waiting, were just standing there. There wasn't any histrionics of any horse, no frenzied neighing or kicking or fighting, except when some studs were in the same pen.

I was there several times over the course of a year, not to mention a friend and other friends who bought the foals. The horses were fed up in big corrals or put on pasture to fatten up.

The only downside I saw was one guy who thought it was funny a foal was ran over by some big horses. He was there and then he was gone the next time I was there.

The owners wife actually showed QH's only she never would tell where her horses came from....?? Read between the lines there. HA!

I've seen the horrific vid from Mexico of the horse being stabbed but, from what I understand now, there are regulated slaughterhouses in Mexico, which I didn't know. The vid I saw was from one which wasn't.

Annnnnddd....lastly, where are these horses supposed to go if they can't be fed by the owners? I know I can't take on anymore and people I know are trying to give horses away. I've turned down about four in the last month.

I'll take this direct report from someone who's seen it with their own eyes! Far better to have plants in the USA. The 'ban' has just pushed the problem over the borders. There can be NO doubt that the horses suffer more for it.

[Fairfax]

As you are notorious for not posting your sources, I'll offer to post mine when you post yours.

Actually I usually do provide them...just not when you ask for the same over and over and over...wait a week and ask for it again.

I will therefore reply, as you have when I have not provided a source...you don't have any. You can not prove your statement...therefore you are telling stories out of the playground.

You have acknowledged you have not viewed a slaughter plant therefore your views are also not from first hand current experience.

It makes sense that a shorter trip, monitored numbers in vans, ongoing recording tapes set up in the slaughter chute area will result in greater profits and when that occurs, businesses usually get on board.

Those of us who volunteered to be "watchers" at Fort MacLeod did make a difference. I would suggest that others offer to do the same.

[randomequine]

Is there any proof that the captive bolt gun does not, in fact, render them completely unconscious? I haven't done the research on horses, but I know that the argument that the animals are still 'alive' after the bolt gun are completely unfounded in hogs and cattle.....

Temple Grandin has some great videos on the slaughter process....

[Bluey]

I wonder why this is the only place this is coming up?
You think such news would be all over the horse world?

Is there really a ban and is there really a bill to maintain the ban?
OP, can you give more information on this?

[Angela Freda]

I wonder why this is the only place this is coming up?
You think such news would be all over the horse world?

Is there really a ban and is there really a bill to maintain the ban?
OP, can you give more information on this?

It's not the only place it's coming up, I've been reading about it for days now.
I'm surprised that those on this forum who are so 'in the know' about these things, didn't. [know that is]

Yes there is a ban in OK.

More info.?
http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2013/0.../#.US-5cka4bB4

http://quarterhorsenews.com/index.ph...slaughter-pass

http://www.meatpoultry.com/News/News...ban.aspx?cck=1

http://farmprogress.com/story-horse-...kd-ok-25-95324

[candyappy]

It would be the first smart things the politicians have done in quite a while. Why not spend your energies making transport better.

[goneriding24]

I'll take this direct report from someone who's seen it with their own eyes! Far better to have plants in the USA. The 'ban' has just pushed the problem over the borders. There can be NO doubt that the horses suffer more for it.

"Pushed over the border", that is what I thought and figured out after I heard about the ban. That's pretty much all that has happened.

[goneriding24]

Yanno, if you don't want your horse to go to auction and possibly going to the killers, call the vet up and put them down, thereby knowing for sure where they went. If you can't afford that, I've read there is an entity in CO which will help pay to euth your horse, something like half the cost. Also, I've read there are euth clinics but I've never put eyes on them and don't know much about them.

But, if someone is to the end of their rope, against the wall and afraid of the neighbors turning them in, causing even more problems for both horse and human, the auction is the place to go. Better than being turned out to fend for themselves and hopefully not die of thirst or eaten by a cougar or chased till they go over a cliff, all possibilities in my part of the world.

[Bluey]

It's not the only place it's coming up, I've been reading about it for days now.
I'm surprised that those on this forum who are so 'in the know' about these things, didn't. [know that is]

Yes there is a ban in OK.

More info.?
http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2013/0.../#.US-5cka4bB4

http://quarterhorsenews.com/index.ph...slaughter-pass

http://www.meatpoultry.com/News/News...ban.aspx?cck=1

http://farmprogress.com/story-horse-...kd-ok-25-95324

Thank you, that is interesting.

[jenm]

I'll take this direct report from someone who's seen it with their own eyes! Far better to have plants in the USA. The 'ban' has just pushed the problem over the borders. There can be NO doubt that the horses suffer more for it.

Thousands of horses still shipped across the borders to Canada and Mexico even when we had plants processing in the U.S. Opening plants again will not stop horses being shipped across the borders for slaughter.

[Angela Freda]

Yanno, if you don't want your horse to go to auction and possibly going to the killers, call the vet up and put them down, thereby knowing for sure where they went. If you can't afford that, I've read there is an entity in CO which will help pay to euth your horse, something like half the cost. Also, I've read there are euth clinics but I've never put eyes on them and don't know much about them.

But, if someone is to the end of their rope, against the wall and afraid of the neighbors turning them in, causing even more problems for both horse and human, the auction is the place to go. Better than being turned out to fend for themselves and hopefully not die of thirst or eaten by a cougar or chased till they go over a cliff, all possibilities in my part of the world.

This is great and all, but what about the drugs Dobbin has been ingesting for years that are either not allowed EVER in meats for human consumption, or those that require a clearing time?

All those thinking that Big Corp. is gonna' want to buy the horses we slaughter 'cause they have buyers for the end product are forgetting the huge kerfuffle ongoing in Europe right now over horse meat being found in foods labeled 100% beef, AND that meat testing + for Bute.

The EU buyers of horsemeat, I would guess, are going to insist on that passport system being instituted here in the US for horses intended for the human consumption market like they have in Europe... and maybe then some more safety measures... considering the tainted meat they are presently having issues with which was supposedly from the continent [ie where there are passports and all drugs the animal has been given are logged therein]

I wouldn't eat horse myself. But I also wouldn't eat it even if it wasn't because of what it was and my person revulsion, but because of what may/may not be in it. And I certainly don't think it's A-ok to sell it under the premise that it's wild, free range, grass fed mustang.

[Lady Eboshi]

The timing on this is a bit odd. Not only do we currently have all of the EU embroiled in an undisclosed-horsemeat scandal; the law that any horse entering the EU foodchain has to have a "passport" including lifetime medication records as of July 2013 but also this "sequestration" biz may considerably reduce the numbers of meat inspectors available to monitor our major food species NOW.

If I remember correctly, the final straw that shut down the last US plants was when the government de-funded inspectors to cover them. I just don't see that initiative being RE-funded NOW.

Suspect this will die in committee.

[Bluey]

This is great and all, but what about the drugs Dobbin has been ingesting for years that are either not allowed EVER in meats for human consumption, or those that require a clearing time?

All those thinking that Big Corp. is gonna' want to buy the horses we slaughter 'cause they have buyers for the end product are forgetting the huge kerfuffle ongoing in Europe right now over horse meat being found in foods labeled 100% beef, AND that meat testing + for Bute.

The EU buyers of horsemeat, I would guess, are going to insist on that passport system being instituted here in the US for horses intended for the human consumption market like they have in Europe... and maybe then some more safety measures... considering the tainted meat they are presently having issues with which was supposedly from the continent [ie where there are passports and all drugs the animal has been given are logged therein]

I wouldn't eat horse myself. But I also wouldn't eat it even if it wasn't because of what it was and my person revulsion, but because of what may/may not be in it. And I certainly don't think it's A-ok to sell it under the premise that it's wild, free range, grass fed mustang.

Most drugs are out of the system in a few days.
Very, very few leave residues any longer.
Most horses are not "given drugs" anyway.
Seems that horses are kept in pastures or feedlots by the traders for the required time to eliminate most drugs, when they don't know if a horse had anything given recently.
There is testing for any drugs also.

The question of drugs is a management one for the slaughter plants, that's all.

With cattle, any time you sell any one animal to slaughter, you have to sign that it was not given anything illegal or if legal it was past the withholding period.
If you lie, it is at least 1 year in jail and $10,000 for each animal and up from that.
The few cattle residues a year from millions slaughtered are from dairy cattle, from mastitis treatment antibiotics and the whole dairy can be shut down from that, not a chance many are willing to take.

I know, from the ones testing the horses at the TX plant long ago, that they were testing EVERY horse, it was in their in house regulations, way above what the USDA requires.
Too expensive to send a lot all the way to it's far away destination and be positive when tested there and have it all turned back.
They were not taking any chances.

Today, there are even better testing protocols, I would not worry about that.

Now, if they sell meat under false advertising, saying it is from feral horses and it is not, I guess a court will have to decide if that is against their labeling laws.

[Angela Freda]

Most drugs are out of the system in a few days.
Very, very few leave residues any longer.
Most horses are not "given drugs" anyway.
Seems that horses are kept in pastures or feedlots by the traders for the required time to eliminate most drugs, when they don't know if a horse had anything given recently.
There is testing for any drugs also.

The question of drugs is a management one for the slaughter plants, that's all.

Tell that to the consumers.

My point is only that with the situation as it is now in Europe from supposedly clean horses [and the discovery of Bute in that meat] I would highly doubt that the demand for horsemeat will remain what it is.

Add in that the US is not terribly interested in implementing a passport system- it's too much like Big Brother!- and well, I just can't see the financial sense in investing in new plants to slaughter US non-passport holding horses.

'Audits carried out by the European Commission Food and Veterinary Office have consistently highlighted that current Canadian Food Inspection Agency standards are insufficient and do not meet EU food safety standards...

A 2010 EU regulation requires that only meat from horses with a known medicinal treatment history can be exported to the EU. However horsemeat from North American (including Canada) continues to be exported to the EU even though the FVO audits have concluded that the equine identification documents for horses originating from the U.S. are insufficient to meet the EU’s food safety regulations. '

http://www.habitatforhorses.org/hsic...b_source=pubv1

[jenm]

If I remember correctly, the final straw that shut down the last US plants was when the government de-funded inspectors to cover them. I just don't see that initiative being RE-funded NOW.

Suspect this will die in committee.

The Governor's office has been taking a poll on the issue, and when I spoke with one of her aide's he said the calls have been overwhelmingly against slaughter.

[Bluey]

Tell that to the consumers.

My point is only that with the situation as it is now in Europe from supposedly clean horses [and the discovery of Bute in that meat] I would highly doubt that the demand for horsemeat will remain what it is.

Add in that the US is not terribly interested in implementing a passport system- it's too much like Big Brother!- and well, I just can't see the financial sense in investing in new plants to slaughter US non-passport holding horses.

They found bute in a very small percentage and so small a residue as not being a safety risk.
Just because we can test for residues, you have to read past that to what that testing shows.

There is a bit of a problem for the consumer, there is going to be more and more people and less and less to eat and I expect soon even the USA won't be turning their nose up at horse meat either, when there is not enough meat to go around.
Yes, meat is important for human health, all that vegan propaganda is wrong.
While being a vegan may work for some, if they eat right and take many supplements, most humans need a varied diet to be and stay healthy and some animal proteins are an important part of that.

[MMacallister]

Thanks for the number, now I can call and let them know that I support their decision to lift the ban on slaughter. I think somebody needs to buy that secretary a box of wine or two, she gonna need it

[Sannois]

Darn, I don't even have any popcorn!

[ThisTooShallPass]

....

[sunridge1]

Who will buy USA horses for consumption? I think that ship sailed.