[mp]

You say that like it's a bad thing.

It isn't ... except when the jacks start pontificating about trades they've mostly read about, as opposed to actually performing regularly at even the most basic level.

[Bristol Bay]

That is hysterical! How did I miss it? And why in the world did they get in trouble? If all they did was bump the topics, that shouldn't be a major issue.

I wish I'd seen that.

I can't remember the poster's name, but it seemed like a drink and post situation, because it happened overnight and all the threads were unbumped by 9 am.

So funny. Then someone began a thread about why MM was on a thread bender.

ETA found it! And the postal poster was not, in fact, banned.

http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...ng-on-them-all!

[Velvet]

Wish I could have seen some of the comments, too!

That was a very funny idea! And original!

[nasalberry]

That looks like a fun thing to do but just because it's performed in an area with letters doesn't make it dressage!

Indeed!
Why the hell was the western forum created, if people don't use it? I truly cannot understand why people must PUSH. Can we not keep the western riding in the western forum?? People bitched and whined until it was created; and some still insist on not using it.
So what the fruitbat's the problem here?!?

[Foxtrot's]

All those emoticoms don't really make the post hilariously funny. Methinks somebody has a weird sense of humour...mostly by being negative.

[NoSuchPerson]

Indeed!
Why the hell was the western forum created, if people don't use it? I truly cannot understand why people must PUSH. Can we not keep the western riding in the western forum?? People bitched and whined until it was created; and some still insist on not using it.
So what the fruitbat's the problem here?!?

Hey, I'd love it if all western dressage discussions stayed in the western forum. My impression is that most people would. Why take flack over here when it can be discussed in a more supportive environment over there? I think your suggestion should be addressed to just a couple of specific individuals instead of using the broad brush "you people" approach.

[nasalberry]

Hey, I'd love it if all western dressage discussions stayed in the western forum. My impression is that most people would. Why take flack over here when it can be discussed in a more supportive environment over there? I think your suggestion should be addressed to just a couple of specific individuals instead of using the broad brush "you people" approach.

I felt I was pretty sure 'everyone' here knew "who I am referring to", when I wrote *... if people don't use it?* and *... why people must PUSH* and *Can we not keep ...* and *People bitched and whined ...* and *... some still insist ...*

I am sorry NSP, that you felt I was directing it at you, personally.

To CLARIFY: if the shoe fits, then it's yours.

[IndysMom]

People do use the western forum. I was there a minute ago, but heard about the ruckus over here so had to come and look!

BTW, I'm a former dressage rider who started in the h/j world. I'm now riding western and working my way towards western riding (a pattern class involving lead changes done is a specific pattern). We've worked our way up through wp, horsemanship and trail. My QH has enough lateral movement to make the in-house dressage/event person drool.

So, even though you are dissing WD, I KNOW that there's plenty of really nice western riders and horses out there doing as much or MORE dressage than your average DQ. Even if she is riding a pooty horse.

[paulaedwina]

To each his own. I love having the WD discussion here in the Dressage forum because I am more likely to encounter people who've ridden dressage and can benefit from their input and experience with regards to things like gaits, impulsion, etc. On the Western forum, since WD is new to us, we do not have the benefit of such experience.

So, for example, instead of saying on the Dressage forum, "please come to the Western forum to help us understand the difference between working and collected gaits" or "please come to the Western forum to help us know what we're looking it in an interesting piece of video from someone's first time out to competition", it gets posted here where all the dressage people are.

So that is my hope when I post here. Unfortunately too often we just get people who come into the discussion to cast aspersions. Without fail so far we always get a few posters come by to make sure we know they're contemptuous of WD. We get posters who wonder out loud why the heck people think they should post about WD here in the land of real dressage.

It really is too bad because my motive for posting here is relatively pure, and I am going to assume the same for the motivation of others. Fortunately we do get well-intended participants who help us understand what we're asking, what we're seeing, etc. They clarify misapprehensions (like that no TD judges will judge WD), they critique videos so you begin to learn what sucked back looks like, etc. So I hold out hope that those people will prevail, and the trouble makers will eventually show their contempt by ignoring the discussion.


Paula

[Lady Eboshi]

There's a road about a mile from here that runs alongside a farm/menagerie. They've got an overgrown pig that I swear is the size of a Volkswagen. He roots and grunts and sometimes even makes the earth shake.

Wicked-good place to school Passage!

[Kenike]

My micro students are reading their first bacteria metabolism tests.

Paula

You aren't my prof, are you? Because at this exact moment....I hate my prof!

[paulaedwina]

AWW, you don't hate your prof Here's what I tell my newies; micro lab techniques are like French cooking - some days you get Soufflé, some days you get a warm ramekin full of flat egg!

Paula

[NoSuchPerson]

nasalberry, I know your comments weren't directed at me, but look at it from the other direction. If I had made a negative comment about "you dressage people," I suspect at least a few of "you dressage people" would have responded as I did.

Paulaedwina, you are selling the western folks short. There are lots of people in the western world who have the knowledge and experience to address questions like the difference between working and collected gaits or know what "sucked back" looks like. Some are like IndysMom and have a dressage background and some are just good, experienced horsemen.

If you do want input from dressage folks, perhaps it would be a better approach to make a post in the dressage forum saying that you've started a discussion over in the western forum about, for example, the differences in working and collected gaits, and that you would be thrilled to have input and suggestions from any dressage folks who are willing to help out. That way, you wouldn't be pushing it on people who think WD is an abomination to the dressage world.

But of course, no one made me Queen of COTH. Yet. So I guess I'm really just telling you what I would do, not trying to tell you what you should do.

[Kyzteke]

No one is denying this.

The point MOST of us are trying to make is that whatever was on that video Mike posted has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with either the actual FEI sport of dressage OR the classical training principles presented by ODGs from the Renaissance on forward.

THAT is the point. Regarding the video posted, what is taking place there is no more "dressage" than WP is "dressage". I'm not saying what is shown on the video is just like WP, but it's as much like WP as it is dressage...which is not a bit.

So if we take the word "dressage" out of the equation and titled the video something else, most of us would say, "yea, look at that. But why is it on the "Dressage" board?"

Please tell me that is clear...

And just out of curiosity: what part of the video actually looks like D/dressage to your eyes? Seriously.

And the worst way to learn about dressage (or any horse sport, actually) is to TALK about it. You want to learn about dressage? Take some dressage lessons!! That doesn't mean you have to cross over to the dark side, but surely there are some dressage instructors in your area where you could take a handful of lessons?

Bring your horse for some of them (assuming it's being used for WD) and then ride a traditionally trained dressage horse. In less time than it took me to type this, you will have ALL your questions answered!!

If that is not possible, look at some of the billions of videos out there. Go to some dressage shows in your area. Develop your eye for what is actual dressage as defined by most of the equestrian world (FEI, USDF, USEF, etc). Obviously this is a free country, so people can call something whatever they want to, but that doesn't mean it is correct.

And I am totally not trying to be rude, but if the Mike video (as it will forever be tagged ) riding looks anything like...let me see what I can find...

Well, then your eye really DOES need fine tuning.

Since I know COTHers, I will repeat again -- I have nothing against the activity which was shown on Mike's video. The horse looked relaxed, fairly treated and not too stressed out. Since I don't know the actual rules of the event, I cannot say if the pair were doing well or not.

All I can say FOR SURE is that there is nothing shown that could be called "dressage"; at least the word "dressage" as defined by all the groups I listed above.

[IdahoRider]

Some of us like to focus on one thing some of us like to focus on many things. It's all good -there's room enough for all of us.

This is true! However, speaking as someone who is interested in different riding disciplines, I am not interested in doing them all at the same time and I certainly am not demanding that my "Everything But The Kitchen Sink" discipline be recognized by the various organizations that oversee the different disciplines I am interested in.

Is there an equally vocal group banging on the door at the NRHA, wanting the right to ride in recognized classes in dressage saddles? Are those beer bellied men being called divas for not allowing it?

I have gotten to the point where I don't give a flying flip anymore. People can stick every letter of the alphabet up in a parking lot and "lope" their shopping cart from one letter to the next all they want. Shoot, do it naked and call it Bare Back Parking Lot Dressage for all I care. Knock yourself out.

It won't change what I do (one discipline at a time) and it won't make the organizations I belong to any more likely to recognize it. I have decided to keep calm and carry on.
Sheilah

[nasalberry]

nasalberry ... If you do want input from dressage folks, perhaps it would be a better approach to make a post in the dressage forum saying that you've started a discussion over in the western forum about, for example, the differences in working and collected gaits, and that you would be thrilled to have input and suggestions from any dressage folks who are willing to help out. That way, you wouldn't be pushing it on people ... .

EXCELLENT!! I have trouble putting my thoughts into the correct words. You did. Thank you.

(BTW, I still even own a western saddle; can't ride in it anymore due to hip & lower back issues. Can't really ride in my cheapie Wintec dressage saddle much, for the same issues )

[mp]

Is there an equally vocal group banging on the door at the NRHA, wanting the right to ride in recognized classes in dressage saddles? Are those beer bellied men being called divas for not allowing it?

Good point.

And I DO NOT want to see those guys wearing white breeches, either.

It's probably just as well Mikey didn't post this in the western forum. The rider splits the reins in his left hand when his horse starts to wander around coming up center line. You get DQ'd for that in western classes. It's called "cheating."

[Kyzteke]

Call it "Advanced Ranch Riding"!!! Require all the movements which would be required of a working ranch horse, but take out the cow! Use the physical props which would be present on the ranch/range -- stuff like ground poles (logs), gates, etc. Make the movement requirements very precise, almost stylized (which is basically what dressage is: stylized battle movements).

And now that I think about it, I think there already IS a school of "western dressage" practiced by the Portuguese "cowboys", only in the end they put back the cow (bull). In this "Sport" (at least the way I understand it), the bull/rider & horse all "compete" but the bull is not killed and (hopefully) no harm comes to the horse.

THIS is as close to actual "Western Dressage" as anything I've ever seen with my own eyes. It's just done VERY quickly.

[Velvet]

All those emoticoms don't really make the post hilariously funny. Methinks somebody has a weird sense of humour...mostly by being negative.

I think you need a lesson in internet emoticon usage. Emoticons are used to display the poster's feelings at the moment when writing the post. They are not to show you how you, the reader, should feel.

You, of course, can feel free to have your own emotions, thoughts and post negative replies. It's a free country...for the moment.

[paulaedwina]

RE: ...That way, you wouldn't be pushing it on people who think WD is an abomination to the dressage world.

Somehow I don't feel any particular need to make changes to make snobs happy. So if the snobs think WD is an abomination that is their right, but I'll not accommodate their prejudice by knowing my place.

Thank goodness I don't need their permission to post here.

Paula