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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2012
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    Phoenix/Charlotte
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    198

    Default Jumping is cruel?

    Hi all,

    What do you say to the occasional person who, with zero knowledge of the sport, says it's cruel to jump horses? Two members of DH's family have made random comments along the lines of "The poor horse! How could you make him carry a PERSON over those fences! Poor thing! How cruel!" One of them insists that it should be illegal and the people who participate in the sport should be arrested.

    Have you ever encountered this? Any polite, witty and educational ways I can basically say STFU?



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov. 14, 2008
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    175

    Default

    If horses didn't like jumping they wouldn't do it.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov. 20, 2008
    Location
    PA
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    486

    Default

    Well, I'm not witty, so others will have much funnier stuff to say. But, I am logical and most people can appreciate facts...

    Let's say the average horse is like 1200 lbs, and the average rider + tack is about 150 lbs. That horse isn't carrying very much weight. That's like a 150 lbs person carrying less than 19 lbs. Believe me, the horses aren't hurting! And they *enjoy their job* or they wouldn't be competitive in it. It's just like some people just *love* to go running, or hiking, or skiing. Is it cruel to strap a back-pack on your back and walk up a mountain if that's what you enjoy?

    No way, man. It's fun (at least, IMO)!


    2 members found this post helpful.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb. 1, 2001
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    Finally...back in civilization, more or less
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    11,438

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AllEars View Post
    Hi all,

    What do you say to the occasional person who, with zero knowledge of the sport, says it's cruel to jump horses? Two members of DH's family have made random comments along the lines of "The poor horse! How could you make him carry a PERSON over those fences! Poor thing! How cruel!" One of them insists that it should be illegal and the people who participate in the sport should be arrested.

    Have you ever encountered this? Any polite, witty and educational ways I can basically say STFU?
    The standard, time honored way to "politely" tell someone to STFU is, "Well, bless your heart!"

    It's important to deliver that in a sweet tone of voice, ideally accompanied by a big smile.
    **********
    We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
    -PaulaEdwina


    20 members found this post helpful.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May. 18, 2012
    Location
    Through the Looking Glass
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    165

    Default

    As ClassyRide pointed out, horses are significantly larger and more powerful than their riders. I find it helpful to ask the person questioning if they honestly think a 120 lb rider could "make" a 1200 lb animal do anything he did not want to do.
    "I'm not strange, weird, off, nor crazy. My reality is just different from yours."
    ~Lewis Carroll


    5 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul. 31, 2007
    Posts
    14,937

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kimball1 View Post
    If horses didn't like jumping they wouldn't do it.
    I don't think that's true.

    Horses have been selectively bred to never say no. From living in coal mines for a life time, to continuing to run after they have burst capillaries in their lungs and are drowning in their own blood, or walking in front of a plow for 10 hours a day, we have *not* bred the ones who said No.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


    17 members found this post helpful.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul. 10, 2008
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    920

    Default

    I mean...it's not really an argument worth getting into since it's all a matter of opinion (in my opinion )

    That's almost like arguing about having pets in general against those who think they should all "run free" or whatever. There are dogs that like jumping over poles in agility and some dogs like running around in a field...you get the point. I mean, you could argue that it's cruel to let wild horses starve and/or die from disease/lack of vet care.

    But like I said...usually just best to answer with a joke. I'd probably just laugh and say something like "hope my horse isn't plotting to kill me or anything."
    Quote Originally Posted by rustbreeches View Post
    [George Morris] doesn't always drink beer, but when he does, he prefers Dos Equis


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2012
    Location
    Phoenix/Charlotte
    Posts
    198

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucassb View Post
    The standard, time honored way to "politely" tell someone to STFU is, "Well, bless your heart!"

    It's important to deliver that in a sweet tone of voice, ideally accompanied by a big smile.
    Ooh, I'm from the south. I can definitely handle that.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan. 20, 2007
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
    Posts
    747

    Default

    About jumping-I have met horses that said "You want me to do what? No way!" to horses that jumped over jumps while turned loose in the arena by themselves.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun. 29, 2004
    Posts
    10,364

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AllEars View Post
    Hi all,


    Have you ever encountered this? Any polite, witty and educational ways I can basically say STFU?
    I am neither polite or witty but this attitude is frequently encountered amongst those idiot animal rights activists. If it was up to them horses wouldn't even be used for pony rides.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun. 29, 2008
    Posts
    434

    Default

    "I see you're not familiar with horses," followed by the aforementioned "Well, bless your heart."
    Last edited by Sunnyhorse; Feb. 28, 2013 at 12:53 AM.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr. 6, 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    1,620

    Default

    I agree it is cruel!

    Especially when my horse has to haul my butt over a fence that I completely buried her under or asked her to leave from China.

    Luckily she is a carrot ho and always forgives me if I stuff her face full of treats.


    13 members found this post helpful.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb. 8, 2007
    Posts
    2,779

    Default

    Depending on which member of my boyfriend's family it was, I'd probably be a complete bitch and say something like, "I think that your mere existence is an offense to humanity and all mankind, but you don't hear ME telling YOU that on a regular basis."
    "It is not necessary for you to let everyone know everything about you. In fact, it is probably wise that you don't. There are some things that you need only discuss with God."


    3 members found this post helpful.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep. 5, 2007
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    2,146

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mvp View Post
    I don't think that's true.

    Horses have been selectively bred to never say no. From living in coal mines for a life time, to continuing to run after they have burst capillaries in their lungs and are drowning in their own blood, or walking in front of a plow for 10 hours a day, we have *not* bred the ones who said No.
    I can see this to a point - but, horses do make their preferences known - it's up to us to listen.

    My trainer bred a horse specifically to be a dressage mount - he hated it - she listened - he's very happy as a hunter and quite successful in the show ring.

    Another very successful hunter horse at our barn decided, over the course of one summer, that he was just done jumping. He became a danger to himself and his rider. He was checked for physical issues - negative, got some time off - didn't help. Another boarder bought him and he's quite happy as a dressage horse. He will now, a couple of years later, occassionally go over a ground pole.
    "I am still under the impression that there is nothing alive quite so beautiful as a thoroughbred horse." -- John Galsworthy


    2 members found this post helpful.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr. 2, 2011
    Location
    Westchester, NY
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    2,496

    Default

    I say this: I spend a lot of money to keep my horse in food and board and shoes. In return, they have a very minimal part-time job which requires them to carry me on their back about 5 hours a week and may include jumping fences. I work for a living and so do they.

    If you break it down based on board and shoes and think of what you spend on them as their income, my horse basically makes $80 an hour. I'd carry someone around my back for that...
    Currently blogging for Chronicle of the Horse. Articles can be found here: http://www.chronofhorse.com/category...ryan-lefkowitz


    20 members found this post helpful.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar. 29, 2004
    Location
    Stevensville, MD, USA
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    350

    Default

    My horse much prefers to jump over doing endless 20m circles and other fun dressage work! But back to your original issue, I would just leave it at, "Well we can agree to disagree." Sometimes people just have opinions on things that we can't change even with facts.



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BAC View Post
    I am neither polite or witty but this attitude is frequently encountered amongst those idiot animal rights activists.
    I do think that the non-rider presenting such a strong, critical and ill-informed opinion to someone who does ride is disrespectful.

    I don't know whether jumping is cruel or not and I do do that with horses. But how can someone who doesn't ride be just.so.sure that it is? And why would they come tell me my business?

    On to the more general rant:

    Cultural relativism did a lot of good, but its worst result is the endorsement of everyone believing that they can have a legitimate opinion that doesn't have a well-researched basis. Drives me nuts.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


    3 members found this post helpful.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov. 20, 2010
    Location
    Upstate New York
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    4,156

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AllEars View Post
    Ooh, I'm from the south. I can definitely handle that.
    Yeah - I was wondering if we could get a Northern version, as I'm not sure it would fly up here! But could definitely see it said with a smile down there.

    We might need to include some colorful expletives!
    Being right half the time beats being half-right all the time. Malcolm Forbes


    1 members found this post helpful.

  19. #19
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by CVPeg View Post
    Yeah - I was wondering if we could get a Northern version, as I'm not sure it would fly up here! But could definitely see it said with a smile down there.
    "Thanks for your time"-- said in a deadpan way. That might be the Northern version.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat


    5 members found this post helpful.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep. 2, 2005
    Location
    Upstate NY
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    11,756

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rel6 View Post
    I say this: I spend a lot of money to keep my horse in food and board and shoes. In return, they have a very minimal part-time job which requires them to carry me on their back about 5 hours a week and may include jumping fences. I work for a living and so do they.

    If you break it down based on board and shoes and think of what you spend on them as their income, my horse basically makes $80 an hour. I'd carry someone around my back for that...
    I like this.


    1 members found this post helpful.

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