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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May. 17, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gloria View Post
    Per leg: The inner thighs toward the front control shoulders; the thighs toward buttock, as well as the inner calf and heels control haunches.
    Okay, this was a lightbulb moment for me today. Could you possibly break the riding position down even more? For example, how should my core effect the horse's core?



  2. #22
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    Nov. 1, 2001
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    9,272

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    Vevet, I used to ride that way but I have found that it is much easier to get a horse straight and light by thinking and riding differently. It is not possible to develop real straightness and independent strength of each limb with out being able to control the shoulders, particularly the outside shoulder . This is done through reins. Here is a good (very basic) example of how to do it.

    You need to be pretty strong from your knees to your ribs to help a horse to collect, IMO. If you are training it, you need core strength to keep them in position when they need help (or resist). If they are trained for it already, you need core strength to stay out of their way as you ask for more engagement and balance. If you ask them to engage (rotate their pelvis) and you can't hold engagement of your own core, it isn't pretty.

    And I'll thank you not to refer to my glutes as monster ones
    See those flying monkeys? They work for me.



  3. #23
    Join Date
    Aug. 25, 2005
    Location
    Northeast
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    10,430

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    Oh dear, I've never met her but I'm sure Velvet is as devastated as I in thinking we need reins to control the shoulders.
    Last edited by merrygoround; Feb. 22, 2013 at 07:59 PM. Reason: Big OOPS!
    Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.



  4. #24
    Join Date
    Oct. 16, 2008
    Location
    Central Oklahoma
    Posts
    3,102

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlieRider View Post
    Okay, this was a lightbulb moment for me today. Could you possibly break the riding position down even more? For example, how should my core effect the horse's core?
    Umm now I'm scratching my head. If I could break down riding positions, and put them in writing in one or two paragraphs to achieve collection, I'd be raking millions of dollars, for sure

    But to make it as less convoluted as possible.... To start collection, the horse needs to start to move his inside hind toward his mid line, toward the center of his belly, which lifts his back and wither, which lifts his shoulders, neck, and head, hence an uphill appearance.

    While he is working toward collection, his base becomes narrower (remember the haunches are wider than the shoulders), and his balance then becomes more precarious, like a tight roper, or a gymnast on a balance beam. If the rider doesn't have strong enough core herself, she will be floppy on his back, causes him to lose balance, and destroy the collection.

    With a properly engaged core, the rider becomes absolutely vertical on top of the moving horse, therefore causing no hindrance in his efforts; she creates a tiny space between her seat bones and saddle, therefore inviting her horse to round up and lift his back; she is steady herself, therefore noticing anything underneath her: for example, if her horse starts to lose correct alignments, which is essential for collection, she can instantly make mini corrections, whether it to control the front ends, hind ends, or anything in between.

    Now all these are theories that you need in order to know what you are doing. The road map is much longer, and longer yet is the path. Follow the progression of the training, from intro/training/1st and so on and so forth. The exercises in those levels are your road map to collection.



  5. #25
    Join Date
    Apr. 17, 2002
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    between the barn and the pond
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    14,365

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    http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Train...ords=podhajsky

    http://www.amazon.com/Lessons-Lendon...ds=lendon+gray

    http://www.amazon.com/Jane-Savoies-D...words=dressage

    Do some reading. I don't mean to sound bitchy, but you'll never get whole, contextual, illustrated answers from a BB


    I steer with my bellybutton


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jan. 12, 2000
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    Proud owner of one Lunar acre! (Campanus Crater, The Moon)
    Posts
    14,049

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    Quote Originally Posted by nhwr View Post
    Vevet, I used to ride that way but I have found that it is much easier to get a horse straight and light by thinking and riding differently. It is not possible to develop real straightness and independent strength of each limb with out being able to control the shoulders, particularly the outside shoulder . This is done through reins. Here is a good (very basic) example of how to do it.

    You need to be pretty strong from your knees to your ribs to help a horse to collect, IMO. If you are training it, you need core strength to keep them in position when they need help (or resist). If they are trained for it already, you need core strength to stay out of their way as you ask for more engagement and balance. If you ask them to engage (rotate their pelvis) and you can't hold engagement of your own core, it isn't pretty.

    And I'll thank you not to refer to my glutes as monster ones
    Funny, I was going to say the same thing to you! I used to ride with much more thigh, but I learned to let that go a bit, while still having a strong core--but not using it as strongly. Once my horse is in a collected frame, they are in self-carriage and I'm actively watching, not holding. No need to, you just get in the way or make them numb to the more subtle weight and other aid changes.
    "Relinquish your whip!!"



  7. #27
    Join Date
    Nov. 1, 2001
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    9,272

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    Once my horse is in a collected frame, they are in self-carriage and I'm actively watching, not holding. No need to, you just get in the way or make them numb to the more subtle weight and other aid changes.
    ^ same
    See those flying monkeys? They work for me.



  8. #28
    Join Date
    Oct. 30, 2009
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    1,907

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlieRider View Post
    Yeah I am just starting to realize that... Anyone know of a owners manual?
    There's hundreds, probably thousands of "owners manuals".

    Riding can be a way to get from one point to another which only takes the ability to stay on the horse's back or it can be an art form which takes a lifetime of continuous learning and perfecting.
    "I've spent most of my life riding horses. The rest I've just wasted". - Anonymous



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