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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec. 27, 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    40

    Default Pricing Question

    Hi All -

    I am considering selling one of my horses in the next year or two but am not entirely sure how to price him. The horse is not currently for sale, so this is not an ad, but I'll try to keep the specifics to a minimum.

    The horse is pre-teens, <16.1, pretty, TB. He has a lead change, although it's not always easy to get - you do have to set him up and ask for it. He has a big enough step - not huge but he can do the lines. He can go in all three rings and do well, kind of a jack of all trades type, not a world beater but a solid citizen. There is plenty of jump in there (I have schooled him around 4') but he seems most comfortable around 3'-3'3. He's the type that's pretty nice at schooling shows and definitely isn't embarrassing at the local As, especially in the childrens hunter type classes.

    He's easy until he's not.....he can be very quiet and easy (has done crossrails with kids before) but if he is fresh or if he's unfairly treated (spanked for a rider's mistake, for example), he can be sassy. If the rider royally screws up, like a huge miss that they gun him for, he'll buck on the backside. But overall, doesn't buck or spook or misbehave.

    At horse shows he's pretty easy. Needs a long hack to warm up and will be "bright" but nothing sassy, no disobedience, no longing, no "prep." After his long hack he's quiet the rest of the weekend. He likes showing and has placed well in the local shows in the area in both rings.

    Great personality, pretty quirky and funny.

    Here's where I get stuck on the pricing...

    He had chip surgery on both hind ankles when he came off the track at 4. Has always been sound on the ankles though, and has no cosmetic flaws other than small scars.

    He had EPM. Acute phase was treated 5-6 years ago, but he can get funky from time to time. Most people wouldn't notice, but I know him really well and do. Oddly enough, a Powerpak keeps this in check and if you keep up with the powerpak, he's fine.

    He was kicked 3.5 years ago and sustained a significant injury to the lateral patellar ligament of the left stifle. He has fully recovered, though, and is quite sound. On ultrasound it still shows a bit but clinically is sound.

    Normal maintenance for a horse his age but is not on any supplements or meds.

    Essentially, as long as he is kept in his "program," he's a pretty awesome, fun horse to have around. My main concern would be finding someone who will stick to his program. And secondly, I have no idea how to price something that has this type of history!

    Any insight would be awesome!!



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun. 8, 2010
    Posts
    330

    Default

    It's hard to put a number on this without a video or photos, also not knowing his exact age. a 12 yr old is much different than a 16 yr old, IMO.

    with the injuries and maintenance, 'jack of all trades' but not a world beater...without having seen a video I wouldn't go above 10k. It doesn't sound like he could be a reliable 'baby sitter' or confidence builder for a young rider moving up to 3', since he doesn't sound super forgiving for messing up. So that limits his viability in a specific market. But he doesn't quite sound fancy enough to command a higher dollar value for, say, an ammie on the circuit. Local show guy/pleasure ride I would say around 15k, but with his injury history and required maintenance, that drops his value. I think it also depends on your region and that market there. In Northern Va, we tend to sell horses at a higher price than an equivalent in a small market in the south or midwest.

    Just my opinion.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    May. 13, 2005
    Posts
    429

    Default

    3,500



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug. 27, 2008
    Posts
    390

    Default

    It's hard without knowing where you are as well. You said pre teens so I assume 9-12 which is also a big difference. The injuries wouldn't bother me so much as if he has healed and is going around sound that's great but it's the EPM that would put me off. He sounds like a fairly solid citizen and could be good for a good rider moving up to the 3 foot classes that maybe doesn't have a lot of money to buy. I definitely wouldn't go above $10,000. Maybe between 5 and 8. It's a lot to ask to keep a horse in a program dealing with neurological issues and on top of that doesn't sound like a packer type at all.



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr. 28, 2008
    Posts
    7,282

    Default

    Given the vet issues, especially EPM, I think you will be lucky to get much of anything for him. For this kind of horse I'd try to find a good home and take a pittance.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug. 4, 2009
    Location
    MD
    Posts
    4,075

    Default

    He is worth something to the right person who clicks and needs his ride..then you need to put a number in your mind..let them make,the offer and then move to a happy medium.and it would be in your best interest to actually have him run thru a PPE flex jog new baselines if he passes you have the tools to negotiate..and bloodwork with an EPM titer.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct. 22, 2009
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    2,826

    Default

    If you put all that info in an ad, pretty much worthless. But take out all the negative (I'm assuming you wouldn't put "doesn't tolerate mistakes, bucks, sassy, bad lead change" in an ad). Don't lie, but you can word it to emphasize the good, while minimizing the bad, and discuss the negatives before someone comes to see the horse. He sounds like a great horse, just not one for dead beginners or someone who wants to be chamion at A shows every weekend.

    So you have :
    Preteen, 16.1 attractive gelding. Solid 3'-3'3" horse with mileage in all three rings, ribbons at A rated shows. Has schooled up to 4'. Has taught cross rail lessons to beginners, minimal prep at shows. Great personality. Best suited to intermediate rider in program. Sound with minimal maintenance. Has EPM that is easily managed.

    Sounds like 10K might be a good place to start, negotiable to a good home.
    Quote Originally Posted by pinecone View Post
    I can't decide if I should saddle up the drama llama, dust off the clue bat, or get out my soapbox.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May. 6, 2007
    Location
    Napanee ON
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    3,989

    Default

    In my area? $1500....horses that are sound, young and ready to go are being offered at $3500.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb. 21, 2011
    Posts
    349

    Default

    I agree that this horse's vet issues render him not worth much money, if anything. Soundness issues aside, his show record is really what will dictate his price. You say he has placed well at local shows and wouldn't be an embarrassment at the As. Has he done any As in the children's hunters or child/adult jumpers? How did he do? What will buyers see when they look up his usef results? If they see a horse who is showing consistently and doing well in the same divisions they want to compete in, they *might* be willing to look beyond some of the soundness stuff if the price is right. You will definitely have to lower the price though. I, personally, wouldn't buy a horse with those injuries and EPM!

    I think a free lease or free to good home might be your best bet. Otherwise I say ask $3500 and see what offers you get... unless he has a decent rated show record in which case you can ask a little more (still under 10K) but be prepared to negotiate.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb. 18, 2001
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    6,850

    Default

    Everyone who's saying $3,500 either doesn't know what they're talking about or is just insulting you. I mean, "In my area? $1500....horses that are sound, young and ready to go are being offered at $3500." REALLY? The horse the OP described is quite a bit different than a sound, green youngster.

    Anyway, I think low five-figures is an appropriate starting point, at least in my area.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct. 10, 2007
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    down south
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    I have to disagree. Epm can take a chunk out of a sale price. Then other issues also. I'd have to say 5k tops for the right person. It would be a hard sale. If he was more a babysitter type then I'd say you could push for more but he sounds like he needs a rider that knows what they are doing and have to deal with that sort of horse and setting them up right. That narrows your rider pool and makes an even harder sell. She didn't say he's a big winner at A/AA shows, he just isnt embarrassing to take. Which says to me that he usually isn't in the top but does ok. You can find those around here at that 10 to 15k price that are sound and without epm.
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole


    3 members found this post helpful.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov. 13, 2009
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    4,531

    Default

    I bet he'd be worth about $10,000-$15,000 to the right person. Sounds like he could be a suitable 3' mount for someone who doesn't have the big dollars to find a true packer but still wants something safe and fun to show.



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb. 18, 2001
    Location
    New York, NY
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    6,850

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rabicon View Post
    I have to disagree. Epm can take a chunk out of a sale price. Then other issues also. I'd have to say 5k tops for the right person. It would be a hard sale. If he was more a babysitter type then I'd say you could push for more but he sounds like he needs a rider that knows what they are doing and have to deal with that sort of horse and setting them up right. That narrows your rider pool and makes an even harder sell. She didn't say he's a big winner at A/AA shows, he just isnt embarrassing to take. Which says to me that he usually isn't in the top but does ok. You can find those around here at that 10 to 15k price that are sound and without epm.
    Doesn't sound like a hard sale to me at all. $20k, fairly easily, without the EPM. The chips aren't worth concern (wouldn't even mention them, to be frank), nor is the stifle injury given that he's completely sound.

    I know a few six-figure junior hunters with EPM, but alas, it's maintained and thus, few people know. It's not THAT big of deal.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2009
    Location
    Wisconsin
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    2,665

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rabicon View Post
    I have to disagree. Epm can take a chunk out of a sale price. Then other issues also. I'd have to say 5k tops for the right person. It would be a hard sale. If he was more a babysitter type then I'd say you could push for more but he sounds like he needs a rider that knows what they are doing and have to deal with that sort of horse and setting them up right. That narrows your rider pool and makes an even harder sell. She didn't say he's a big winner at A/AA shows, he just isnt embarrassing to take. Which says to me that he usually isn't in the top but does ok. You can find those around here at that 10 to 15k price that are sound and without epm.
    Not going to speculate on this horses sale price, but can you send me a link to the horses that do OK at the A\A shows for $10-$15,000. I have some clients looking. Or I would just flip them for double that as a B show horse in our area food as and ls


    3 members found this post helpful.

  15. #15
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    Apr. 28, 2008
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    7,282

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    He has a lot more against him that six-figure junior hunters. He's a TB. That can get down the lines in the 3' but I gather from OP's description that is a "can" not a "easy." Hit or miss lead change. Not coming home with a tricolor, but not embarrassing (which describes just about any horse). Bucks if you miss, which many 3' ammies do quite often. Small (how much less than 16.1?). Chip surgery and EPM, both of which I'd feel I have to disclose. That's a lot of baggage.

    I think a lot of it depends on where you live. Prices are much lower here in the midwest than VA, and VA is lower than the NE. OP is in CA so she should take all our opinions with a grain of salt.

    It also matters what barn she is selling it out of. I used to finish C/A Jumpers and send them to a bigger barn to sell, as they could get easily double the price I could. As in, within a week or two, so it's not like they did any extra training on top.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb. 18, 2001
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    New York, NY
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    Quote Originally Posted by fordtraktor View Post
    He has a lot more against him that six-figure junior hunters. He's a TB. That can get down the lines in the 3' but I gather from OP's description that is a "can" not a "easy." Hit or miss lead change. Not coming home with a tricolor, but not embarrassing (which describes just about any horse). Bucks if you miss, which many 3' ammies do quite often. Small (how much less than 16.1?). Chip surgery and EPM, both of which I'd feel I have to disclose. That's a lot of baggage.
    I think you're exaggerating a lot of what the OP said.



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb. 3, 2012
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    248

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tha Ridge View Post
    Doesn't sound like a hard sale to me at all. $20k, fairly easily, without the EPM. The chips aren't worth concern (wouldn't even mention them, to be frank), nor is the stifle injury given that he's completely sound.

    I know a few six-figure junior hunters with EPM, but alas, it's maintained and thus, few people know. It's not THAT big of deal.
    Sorry, but 20k sounds pretty high to me for this type of horse. I certainly would not spend 20k on something that has a lead change that is only sometimes there, bucks on the backside of a fence if you get a bad distance, and has dealt with EPM before. BTW do you know how expensive it is to treat EPM? Treatment with Marquis is about $600-800 for a 4 week supply. Relapse can happen at any time. Also, she did say that he was "quite" sound, not completely sound after the stifle injury. The chips are no big deal as tons of horses end up having those removed. I would not pay more than $5000 for this horse.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct. 10, 2007
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    down south
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    Couture tb I tried to send you 5 I found in 5 minutes but your box is full
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole



  19. #19
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    Apr. 28, 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tha Ridge View Post
    I think you're exaggerating a lot of what the OP said.
    Really, which part? I went back and it's all there. "The horse is pre-teens, <16.1, pretty, TB. He has a lead change, although it's not always easy to get - you do have to set him up and ask for it. He has a big enough step - not huge but he can do the lines. He can go in all three rings and do well, kind of a jack of all trades type, not a world beater but a solid citizen. There is plenty of jump in there (I have schooled him around 4') but he seems most comfortable around 3'-3'3. He's the type that's pretty nice at schooling shows and definitely isn't embarrassing at the local As, especially in the childrens hunter type classes.

    He's easy until he's not.....he can be very quiet and easy (has done crossrails with kids before) but if he is fresh or if he's unfairly treated (spanked for a rider's mistake, for example), he can be sassy. If the rider royally screws up, like a huge miss that they gun him for, he'll buck on the backside. But overall, doesn't buck or spook or misbehave."



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2009
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    Wisconsin
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    2,665

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    Quote Originally Posted by rabicon View Post
    Couture tb I tried to send you 5 I found in 5 minutes but your box is full
    I cleared my in box. Send away!



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