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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by madamlb View Post
    I think the main thing to take from all of this is that it is an indictment of your appalling health system in the States, saying that as someone who has been through my own accident where I received excellent medical care and didn't pay a cent. People should risk losing everything they have all because they get hurt or get sick. That's absolutely barbaric.
    I have no dog in this fight - just home sick and needing to entertain myself, so following this thread.

    However, in all fairness, I think that your comment should be noted as an opinion - your ideological difference with that of another country's hotly divided approach to privatized or nationalized healthcare really has no bearing on this thread. That topic has zero to do with the topic of the thread, and honestly your opinion has no bearing on the direction the US healthcare system goes (since you appear to not even be a citizen). It should go without saying that a huge portion citizens in this country don't want distributed wealth in any form, to include nationalized healthcare.

    Just sayin'.

    *goes back to the silent section*
    My boy, "Mr. Nice Guy"

    Ask me about Final Furlong, Inc. - promoting "Responsible retirement for thoroughbred racehorses through the racing industry".


    15 members found this post helpful.

  2. #82
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    Jun. 20, 2009
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    Hunterdon County NJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvp View Post

    Note to self: Don't blog about anything negative in your professional life.
    http://www.ted.com/talks/brene_brown...erability.html

    Well.... maybe not. We very quickly went from the 'information age' to the 'reality show' age. I mean, how many reality show/ competitions are there?

    'Competitions' for chefs, models, clothing designers, drag queens, survivors, home decorators, preppers, and God knows what else.

    Personal story/exposes of Gypsys, bad acting brides, housewives, polygamists, 'quiver full' families, Kardashians, Whitney Houstons surviving family, American Pickers, Pawn Stars, Hardcore Pawn, Oddities and I'm am scared to realize how many others I could list (A fun OffTopic Day project for us all next time around!)

    And sometimes, people's careers take off like a rocket after all this painful personal exposure. It is the age of 'being vulnerable' and that appeals to a LOT of people. The hard ass age of George Morris is over folks. "Touch me, feel me, see my pain. And then I'm gonna go bust my ass and roll that into some serious bank."

    Go check out Bethenny.com if you wanna see one of these role models in action!

    Hate the injured girl all you want. But she's got clients. She's got her own little publicity machine rolling. And she's on target with the modern culture.

    Sure, she's got stuff to learn. The smartest folks always admit that they are still learning. But in addition, she's braver than all hell both in the tack and with her internet presence. And I bet that's how a lot of her followers see her also.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #83
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    Aug. 12, 2002
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    Calera, AL
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    I don't know either her or meup but if you're going to have a public blog, expect people to have an opinion. As someone said to me recently... "just sayin..."
    "Dogs are man's best friend. Cats are man's adorable little serial killer." -- theoatmeal.com


    11 members found this post helpful.

  4. #84
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    Mar. 14, 2002
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    The horse country of VA
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    Quote Originally Posted by alabama View Post
    I don't know either her or meup but if you're going to have a public blog, expect people to have an opinion..."
    This.
    Equus Keepus Brokus


    2 members found this post helpful.

  5. #85
    Join Date
    Feb. 9, 2011
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    IE SoCal
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    I'm not saying I'd send a horse to this girl, but she doesn't seem that bad. Seems like she thinks she knows more than she does, but a grade above my local equivalent. I was expecting much, much worse after reading through 4 pages of this thread before I found the link to the blog.

    She probably should have called it a day and not gotten back on the horse, but she's hardly the first person to make a bad call about when to quit with a horse.

    I don't see how her insurance status is any of my business.
    ______________________________________________
    My Blog -horses & photography


    6 members found this post helpful.

  6. #86
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    Sep. 8, 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isabeau Z Solace View Post

    Hate the injured girl all you want. But she's got clients. She's got her own little publicity machine rolling. And she's on target with the modern culture.

    Sure, she's got stuff to learn. The smartest folks always admit that they are still learning. But in addition, she's braver than all hell both in the tack and with her internet presence. And I bet that's how a lot of her followers see her also.
    Yeah, but it's a heck of a way to build your readership base, doncha think? That little exercise could have easily been a one way trip to quadrapeligia versus a broken leg. And why be simply inflammatory when she could be, you know, EFFECTIVE. The horse is sore and doesn't understand the snaffle bit. Lose the bit, lose the giant saddlepad that is pressing on her withers and spend a few weeks on the ground before attempting the saddle. Then she can be cool AND do something good for the horse.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  7. #87
    Join Date
    Oct. 3, 2009
    Location
    Victoria, Australia
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    228

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fractious Fox View Post

    However, in all fairness, I think that your comment should be noted as an opinion - your ideological difference with that of another country's hotly divided approach to privatized or nationalized healthcare really has no bearing on this thread. That topic has zero to do with the topic of the thread, and honestly your opinion has no bearing on the direction the US healthcare system goes (since you appear to not even be a citizen). It should go without saying that a huge portion citizens in this country don't want distributed wealth in any form, to include nationalized healthcare.

    Just sayin'.
    I'm sorry. I didn't realise that I have to be American in order to have opinion. Oh wait. I don't. I have just as much right to say what I think about the US health system as you do. I'll let my politics professor know next class when I'm asked a question though, seems a good way to get out of homework ...

    It was relevant because people are accusing Dom of 'foolishness' because she couldn't afford insurance, my point was that in most other countries you don't risk becoming destitute because you get hurt because we have a system that provides for people who can't afford medical assistance. That's just my opinion, never said it wasn't, but with what I know of the situation, that's the conclusion I have come to.


    18 members found this post helpful.

  8. #88
    Join Date
    Sep. 16, 2004
    Location
    Christiansburg, VA
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    94

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    I a co-director of Paso Fino Urgent Rescue. This is Willow's album. https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...0239670&type=1 She was saved from Camelot before we figured out what Camelot and AC4H really were. We no longer help save horses from Camelot or AC4H but we do keep track of our PFUR saves and are willing to help Toni find a new home for Willow if that is what she decides. We do have a DISCLAIMER: "This group is not responsible for any of the Paso Finos that are placed. We do not know why they ended up where they were, what problems they may have, whether they are sick or not, we only know what the seller has told us. We are not buying the Paso Finos ourselves either. We are simply a social media outlet that helps to get the word out about Paso Finos in dire need and help buyers who may not be able to afford to purchase them."

    I do not know this trainer that has Willow, but in looking at the videos, there were MANY warning signs and she should have NEVER gotten on this horse. Then, once on the horse, there were MANY warning signs and she kept pushing. She even admits several times that she should have stopped. Sadly, we do not know the past of this horse. There is no telling what her issues are. She seemed to do fine with her owner, from what the owner had posted. So I have no idea.

    Anybody is welcome to join PFUR if they want to help paso finos in need. We do have posting rules. Please make sure and read these two files once you join.

    The Way We Work
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/Paso...5344278872195/

    PFUR rules and How To Post On PFUR
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/Paso...6084535464835/


    10 members found this post helpful.

  9. #89
    Join Date
    Sep. 16, 2004
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    Christiansburg, VA
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    94

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    I completely agree 200% with this.

    Quote Originally Posted by BarbaricYawp View Post
    The rearing is a symptom. And rearing in and of itself need not be a dealbreaker. But this horse is beyond this trainers skills. There are a number of very reputable Paso Fino trainers around the New Jersey area. Heck one of the past trainers of the year is in Massachusetts. This particular horse needs a trainer of that caliber who can evaluate her underlying issues and determine if she is salvageable.



  10. #90
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    Sep. 16, 2004
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    Christiansburg, VA
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    She was going to go to a rescue in Maine. TD was going to transport and quarantine for us, but once she got her home, she fell in love with her. So the blogger is completely incorrect where she stated that TD was guilted into taking her. I have put a comment on there about that too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    That blog stated:

    "When Willow came through the auction, TD went out to see her. Later that day she commented on her auction photo, saying, "She is still available. I went to see her today. She isn't a good fit for me I am sad to say. I feel terrible. She was understandably nervous. No papers. She is taller than 13.3 and very long. Maybe 14H. Super kind eye. I already have one project and can't handle 2 right now. Shoes in front. I hope this helps someone decide. She is more beautiful in person."

    TD did not want Willow, but the auction rescue people pushed and guilted and told her how 'you can't leave a Paso in the kill pen!' Eventually, TD caved, against her better judgement, and bought the horse."


    Okay, so I went and looked up the Camelot auction listing for this mare from last July. From the comments, the Paso rescue (PFUR) stated the horse was going directly from Camelot to "a rescue in Maine". I also saw some discrepancies between what the blog stated and the actual comments on the auction pic.

    https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...type=3&theater

    And, yeah, as someone else mentioned, that mare wasn't anywhere NEAR ready for a rider considering all the issues that were so obvious, and then, certainly not in a huge indoor, made worse by indoor arena acoustics that might frighten a horse not used to them. I also think that trainer needs to learn how to praise in a quieter manner when dealing with a fractious or otherwise nervous horse.

    Tons more groundwork and time, then starting SLOWLY under saddle in a smaller, enclosed area, preferably outside in sight of some calm, quiet horses.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #91
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    Sep. 16, 2004
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    Christiansburg, VA
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    94

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    One correction here. Peruvian Pasos are prone to DSLD, not Paso Finos. That's two different breeds.

    Quote Originally Posted by sdlbredfan View Post
    I am glad I was able to read the blog. I agree, extremely bad judgment on the part of this (blog says 25 yrs old) youngster, and of course her injury was exacerbated in the hospital by some idiot grabbing her by the broken leg to 'help' get her on a gurney. I hope she sues the hospital for that unnecessary iatrogenic complication.

    Am I the only one who noticed how far under her body Willow has her hind legs. Pasos are notoriously prone to DSLD or whatever the name du jour is of that disorder. One of the symptoms is hind legs camped way under because of the suspensory issues. Any trainer who actually knows what they are doing would first have had a Vet do a thorough workup, not rush into riding. Any horse that is severely girthy (agreeing with other poster) definitely should be checked for ulcers and any horse so extremely nervous should be presumed to need some supplemental magnesium too. This is a very sad story, all the more so because skill and common sense, had they been in use, would have prevented the injury to the rider.
    Sigh...


    2 members found this post helpful.

  12. #92
    Join Date
    Sep. 11, 2010
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    The Sunny South
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    387

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    Madambl, I never said you couldn't have an opinion. I actually said that that opinion, contrary to your statement, wasn't the take-away message of the sad tale regarding this rider/trainer duo, nor was it relevant to US politics (sorry, my opinion on Canadian or UK healthcare isn't relevant to their system, either).
    My boy, "Mr. Nice Guy"

    Ask me about Final Furlong, Inc. - promoting "Responsible retirement for thoroughbred racehorses through the racing industry".


    5 members found this post helpful.

  13. #93
    Join Date
    Jan. 9, 2006
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    GA
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    2,366

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    Quote Originally Posted by quietann View Post
    I've been following this blogger for years and she just has SUCH a good head for horses and is thoughtful about what she does. We started out badly (long story) but she quite graciously came back to me and apologized. It's very sad that this happened, especially when her training business was really getting going.

    I think her point about "two kinds of horses" at Camelot and other low-end auctions is worth repeating. I know of a couple of fancy show Morgans who came through New Holland -- including some with outstanding recent show records -- who have turned out to be absolutely crazy and dangerous. Of course, a skinny beat up horse might have behavioral problems... but the fat shiny ones have to make you pause and ask WHY they are at auction.
    An adage that I have found to be very true is " a poor horse has no where to go but up and a fat slick horse has no where to go but down." Applies exactly to what you said.
    http://community.webshots.com/album/548368465RfewoU[/url]

    She may not have changed the stars from their courses, but she loved a good man, and she rode good horses….author unknown


    1 members found this post helpful.

  14. #94
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    Jun. 20, 2009
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    Hunterdon County NJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbaricYawp View Post
    Yeah, but it's a heck of a way to build your readership base, doncha think? That little exercise could have easily been a one way trip to quadrapeligia versus a broken leg. And why be simply inflammatory when she could be, you know, EFFECTIVE. The horse is sore and doesn't understand the snaffle bit. Lose the bit, lose the giant saddlepad that is pressing on her withers and spend a few weeks on the ground before attempting the saddle. Then she can be cool AND do something good for the horse.
    I don't know how you and Meup managed to spring to life on this planet with perfect horsemanship preprogrammed into you, but Congratulations!! It must be totally fabulous to be perfect!!

    All this little lady is doing is sharing her mistakes. If the critics here are human, then y'all have made your share of wicked errors also. I mean, even George Morris didn't know anything at one time.

    For some reason, I am still alive despite a respectable list of 'judgement errors' in the past. I mean, how many unsupervised kids with horses don't commit an impressive list of sins?

    BUT, you know, you can't talk about that stuff. You've gotta, somehow, project this image that you ALWAYS knew how to do this stuff. Somehow the skill is worth more if it is innate than if it is hard won through sweat and hard work???

    Which, by the way.... is going to involve making a LOT of errors along the way also.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by paintedhorizon View Post
    One correction here. Peruvian Pasos are prone to DSLD, not Paso Finos. That's two different breeds.
    And one of those breeds has to change their name cuz' it's just too darned confusing. Worse than the paint/pinto designation contortions. The American Warmblood Registry vs Society. How many freakin' Fresian registries are there now? I mean, I think horse folks TRY to make this stuff more complicated.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  16. #96
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    Sep. 16, 2004
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    Christiansburg, VA
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    Boy I can't agree with you more! LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by Isabeau Z Solace View Post
    And one of those breeds has to change their name cuz' it's just too darned confusing. Worse than the paint/pinto designation contortions. The American Warmblood Registry vs Society. How many freakin' Fresian registries are there now? I mean, I think horse folks TRY to make this stuff more complicated.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  17. #97
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    Oct. 10, 2007
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    down south
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    I hope she recovers quickly and glad she is ok. Do not follow her blog nor knew of her before this blog. I will state my opinion on the matter. I think the horse was terrified, be it pain or something else. I do believe she gave many warning signs that she was not ready. I have a feeling, since in her blog she said she thought 60 days would be enough, that she didn't know what she was getting into at all and needs years more experience working with a problem horse pro before taking these types on. I've had a spooky bolter here before that I tried to help. Months and months of ground work and handling before we even thought of getting on his back. Needless to say it was to ingrained in him after 13 years of doing it and being green as grass. He went back to my friend that I was trying to help. I knew I was no pro at it, and don't claim to be and was not paid for trying to help. Yet, I also knew that the horse was not anywhere near ready after a few days and he was less nervous then this horse. Hope the horse lands well after all this. Maybe a companion horse for someone.
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole


    4 members found this post helpful.

  18. #98
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    Oct. 10, 2007
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    down south
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    Oh and btw on the insurance thing.
    We do have help for hospital emergency in this country. It's funny how many people don't realize this. If you do not make over a certain amount a year then the hospitals have their own insurance and will greatly reduce the money owed or wipe it clean depending on the situation. We are not allowed to turn atone away from an emergency room for any reason. Yet, in a none emergency like a broken leg that needs surgery they will sometimes dr you up and send you to an ortho dr for the surgery. At that point you have to work that out with the dr but if they do the surgery at the hospital there ate some coverages already in place. I've always had insurance through work so I'm lucky. I do know a few people that do not or have not a onetime that had to get help through the hospital.
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole


    1 members found this post helpful.

  19. #99
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    Apr. 2, 2009
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    North Carolina
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    I think everyone has made a bad judgement call at least once -- I freely admit multiple times, both here and on my blog, I made a big one under a freak set of circumstances that ended in a career-ending injury for my horse and my own previously mentioned torn up knee and resulting two years of medical bills. Heavy consequences for a split second decision under pressure that I never would have dreamed ended the way it did. And I am left to clean it up on my own.

    I'm still paying for it and will have the injury forever. I consider myself lucky that my wonderful horse is still rideable and can still do his job at lower levels and I can still ride the way I want to, even if I need a few more painkillers now. I don't think it makes me a poor horseman, it just makes me a human who picked the wrong door in a moment of uncertainty. I strive to always put my horses first and do what is best by them.

    Dom openly analyzes (perhaps a bit melodramatically, but it is a storytelling blog) where she went wrong and that she was overfaced by the horse -- none of us with even half a conscience would not regret such a decision and wish we could go back and fix it. The insurance issue was brought up simply because it was brought up in the blog; it is also an important and relevant topic for all horse people, especially those in their own employ, as these instances are part of why my (and your) premiums continue to go up and my coverage continues to decrease over time, to make up for uninsured accidents.

    No one WANTS to be injured. Insurance can seem expensive and I did not have any throughout grad school until I got my current job. An older, wiser me looks back and shakes my head, knowing what I know now, that paying that premium is far better than coming home to a $30,000 bill after an accident.

    Beyond that, well it is not for me to judge. I only hope she is able to heal and not be eviscerated by the cruelty of our health care system. I can sympathize with that part, very much. It's simply the way it is for now.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  20. #100
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    Jul. 21, 2011
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    Co
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    Most everyone here has made a stupid decision when dealing with a horse at some point in time.

    My only concern, and I mean this kindly, is that when we are still learning, it is best not to "teach".

    When I was a child, I would have known NOT to get on a horse that was shaking with fear.

    I had lessons from the age of 7yrs, (and an obnoxious pony of my own at 8) however taking lessons was not what would have stopped me from getting on that horse.
    If you spend time with horses,on the ground as well as riding, for any reasonable period of time, you really should know better.

    I was an enthusiastic "no fear" 10 yr old but after only 3 years riding (and being bucked off pony for the first month I had him) I would have known better than to get on that horse.

    That said, we all make mistakes.

    I think the worry many of us have with this situation is that such a (big) mistake was made by someone who is teaching/training.

    I wish you (the young lady) a speedy recovery. If you are reading this, take heart, the only positive to being injured is the spare time in which to contemplate what you did wrong!

    I speak from experience..


    8 members found this post helpful.

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