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  1. #21
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    Nov. 19, 2005
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    The problem with finding trak stallions w international jumpers is that there are few trak jumpers at that level and those that are seem to be eastern european/russian bred by those out of reach stallions (Telet 77 (??.) Other possibles not listed yet are stallions not avaliable here (heops, dur duer and his deceased sire?.) In addition, a 1.45 m horse there may have international points (showed in FEI classes) and the same horse here jumping 1.45 m-1.5 m has national points only.(SM has had two GP horses with national points as had Hailo for example)

    i really like hirtentanz myself. Coconut Grove is one that should hit soon w a GP horse and other competing thorughbred stallions in europe might fit. (favoritas sp? etc)including I think a SF xx that both Hol and trak verband approved (cant rememeber his name.)
    Here is my favorite class w Special Memories -a 1.6m world cup class that I only share for sentimental reason.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydCY98nQAkE
    Last edited by omare; Feb. 13, 2013 at 07:37 AM. Reason: trying toclarify



  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan. 2, 2006
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    Colorado
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    The only Trakehners that have produced international jumpers are Abdullah, Horales, Waitaki and Almox Prints J (Suchard and Ballisto Z are not available with frozen). The mare is competing and so, yes, ET.

    Coconut Grove has not produced International offspring, neither has Hirtentanz, Special Memories or Titulus - yet.

    Whilst I hate to disagree with Maren (dare I? LOL) both Sayyida and her full brother, the approved Semper Fidelis, are substantial horses and Horales would not be my first choice until an idea of what they produce can be seen.



  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jul. 3, 2003
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    EU
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    693

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    Quote Originally Posted by Molly Malone View Post
    The only Trakehners that have produced international jumpers are Abdullah, Horales, Waitaki and Almox Prints J (Suchard and Ballisto Z are not available with frozen). The mare is competing and so, yes, ET.
    Actually, wrong :-) IF you could Sans Souci would be a great choice, but he stands live cover in Bavaria and won't help you much. He is the sire of the international GP horse Altenbach TSF and other high level jumpers.

    That said, I don't think that the addition of "International" will make a better jumper. The mare in question is not an international show jumper herself, and her talent lies probably not in international show jumping either. The point will be to mate two fitting, highly athletic horses. And that opens the door to far more stallions, especially of Burnus AAH/Habicht background.


    Quote Originally Posted by Molly Malone View Post
    Whilst I hate to disagree with Maren (dare I? LOL) both Sayyida and her full brother, the approved Semper Fidelis, are substantial horses and Horales would not be my first choice until an idea of what they produce can be seen.
    ;-)) And I beg to differ, substantial to me is something very different. These are Trakehners after all, and hardly large or big boned. I know probably 6-8 direct maternal relatives of Xena and her dam in the flesh. And while "substantial" for their own breed, they hardly classify as such by other warmblood standards. Stallions that have worked very well with this particular Schöner Tag/Schatztruhe background were King Arthur, Herzzauber and anything with Arogno. Tag's best performing offspring were by Hockey (hence Russian), Schwedengruß (a Kunzit son, 1/4 TB) and an Arogno son. So make your pick ;-)



  4. #24
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    Sep. 29, 2006
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    424

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    Quote Originally Posted by sixpoundfarm View Post
    Just saw this photo of him posted on FB today.
    http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...27261218_n.jpg
    and this has just been posted on youtube.

    Hirtentanz



  5. #25
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    Nov. 19, 2005
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    International means has FEI points which as stated means a horse could jump 1.45 m in an FEI class of which there are many in Europe and here you have to usually go to Wellington and the Hamptons- and have very deep pockets.Hailo has a horse that regularly earned money and jumped clear in the 1.5m GPs here but they were not fEI classes but if he competed in europe he would no doubt have gotten FEI points in his travels.



  6. #26
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    Nov. 19, 2005
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    hence it is not a coincidence that Abdullah's get with FEI points were mainly located in europe as is horalas' child on the list and the others are also european based and could be jumping much lless in height than what some horses are jumping here.
    (And i noted coconut grove has not been breeding that long but he has been bred to some top mares so they will end up in the Sunday classes i would bet.)



  7. #27
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    Sep. 15, 2011
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    Florida
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    Lot's of new points being made in this thread since I last checked!

    First, for those that know me at all...you know that this mare will produce Trakehners almost exclusively. With that said...I may try breeding her to some superstar that doesn't happen to be a Trakehner, TB or Arab at some point. Like Flexible.

    We will be breeding using ET. Love all the suggestions, thanks everyone.
    http://tennantsporthorses.com/stallion-services/

    Proudly representing the outstanding stallions, Ballzauber, Sea Accounts xx, Sea Lion xx, and Tagaelen!



  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
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    Alabama
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    5,457

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    Oskar is Russian, descends from some jumping lines that Maren mentioned and was used as a jumper prior to import.
    PennyG



  9. #29
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    Nov. 19, 2005
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    Hermes d Authieux AA is the one (who I think I was confusing with Fidelio du Donjon 3/4 xx and not trak approved) he had a trakehner daughter score a 9 and seems to have "international" horses--now to just get some frozen in the US. :-)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgdyPjNFMIk (But even he seems solidly built.)

    "Hermés d’Authieux AA is a perfect example of the original breeding goal of the French Anglo-Arabian breed. His sire Ithuriel AA competed in international show jumping with Xavier Leredde/FRA and he is the sire of numerous successful offspring as well which ranks him as one of the top stallions in French performance breeding. Ithuriel’s sire, Night and Day xx, is the sire of Jus de Pomme/Ulrich Kirchhoff, the 1996 double gold winner at the Olympic Games in Atlanta/USA. Ithuriel AA’s dam’s sire, Kesbeth AA, produced Nithard AA, a sire well-known in Germany as the dam’s sire of Cappeln’s magnificent Inschallah AA. Matcho AA and Upan la Jarthe AA , both highly influential stallions in Hanoverian and Westphalian breeding, both go back to Nithard’s son, Pancho II AA. A Nithard daughter named Stella competed under Nelson Pessoa/BRA and is the dam of the influential show jumper stallions, Olisco and Quick Star.
    Hermés d’Authieux AA’s dam, Nahiade, is also the dam of the World Cup show jumper Boule de Neige Jac/Rodrigo Pessoa/BRA and Chipie de Cande who took the Horse of the Year title in the US. With Israel AA, Rantzau xx and the already mentioned Nithard AA, there are three further breeding heroes in a row in the dam line – which led to a valuable inbreeding component in Hermés d’Authieux AA’s pedigree.
    Hermés d’Authieux AA won the 2000 European Championships in St. Lô/FRA in the class for five-year old show jumpers under Fernand Leredde/FRA. Following this he collected first place ribbons under Xavier Leredde/FRA, Jérome Gachignard/FRA and Yannick Martin/FRA up to CSI*** level which earned him a very high index of 154 points. Further placings were added in Germany in 2007 in advanced level classes with Janne Friederike Meyer and the young Swedish rider, Märta Elander Wisten.
    Hermés d’Authieux AA’s offspring are also impressive: He was the sire of the best Anglo-Arabian filly and the best Anglo-Arabian colt in France in 2003. Two of his sons were licensed in France, Oiseau d’Ivraie AA and O’Pif d’Ivraie AA, and both of them competed in the Finals of the French Show Jumping Championships as five and six-year olds. Meanwhile they place in international competitions. Currently highly successful in upper level sport are the show jumpers Oria du Chanu, Niskao de Moens, Nilda Rouge and an event horse named Punch de l’Esques along with many others."



  10. #30
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    Jul. 3, 2003
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    EU
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    On the FEI discussion. FEi really doesn't matter, total height does in that case. And I've seen plenty of "Grand Prix" in the US that would never be Grand Prix (Groesser Preis) in Germany, whey they don't start under 1.50m. Eastern European nomenclature can be different, but the local S classes in Germany start at 1.45m and go on up from there, so S, S*, ** or *** is a pretty good indication.



  11. #31
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    Apr. 27, 2004
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    Deep in the Heart of TX!
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    As breeder of the mare in question here's my 2 cents if I were picking a stallion for her. First I agree w/Maren - throw the "International" part of this equation out the window. Look for an athlete w/talent in the areas you want and with pedigree and body type to compliment Xena. If semen were available for Axis (International GP Dressage horse but with Sixtus as his sire and Anduc as dam sire there's plenty of jump in this pedigree), it would be game over for me.

    While you can't argue with Abdullah's accomplishments, between him and Special Memories I'd go w/SM as it gives you the TB blood so important to refresh our breed - and Xena definitely needs some additional TB. Moreover, b/c this TB is Kluwall xx it's PROVEN to produce jumpers @ the National & International levels. Plus, as multiple sources say SM's have super temperament and Xena can be a bit hot, he'd be my #1 choice if Axis isn't available in the US.
    Owner of ATA and Verband-Approved Trakehner stallion, Tzigane *Pb*, breeder of ATA-approved Semper Fidelis

    www.twingates.com



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