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  1. #61
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    You can buy them at Walmart for heaven's sake. Need I say more...lol



  2. #62
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    I tend to think that someone that is half a bubble off has a vision of what they want to do and that fits the vision. I agree then once the nutter decides to go ahead with the crime things like availability come into play. I don't know how much practical matters like shopping ease and function come into play when someone first decides to commit a mass murder. And seriously, I don't know. Carts and horses. The only constant I see in the scenario is the murderer.



  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by caballero View Post
    Don't project your emotions and feelings on others. You have no idea why I own one or how I feel about it when I shoot it.
    Why don't you just be honest with yourself? I know it's difficult but I bet you can do it. haha



  4. #64
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    Sep. 8, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by caballero View Post
    Don't project your emotions and feelings on others.
    You mean like you did when you lamented how those of us who choose not to own guns must feel that our lives are "cheap" and "unimportant"?
    Everyone is entitled to my opinion.



  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windsor1 View Post
    Yes, I'm aware of your law background. But you didn't mention any of these stringent tests when you responded to the OP. You merely said that the question of the citizenry's need for a particular type of weapon is "irrelevant."

    So what? I didn't mention my eye color either. The question is irrelevant to us Strict Constructionists. When necessary we answer the question but that still doesn't make it relevant.

    WHERE he teaches was never the point. The point in mentioning UCLA at all was to indicate that as a law school professor at a school other than Bum-eff U, his opinion is probably of some merit.

    Ever hear of the logical fallacy called Appeal to Authority? This one would likely be "Credentialism."

    I already acknowledged the absence of the "need" standard in the Second Amendment. But the aforementioned good professor, in the paragraph I quoted in my earlier post, states that

    “In the Heller case, the courts said a handgun ban is not constitutional because handguns are in ‘common use,’” which is a common standard in jurisprudence, Winkler said. “A shoulder-launched missile is not in common use for self-defense; a machine gun is not in common use.”

    While I realize that “common use” and “need” may not be one and the same, there is certainly a link. Certain things tend to be in “common use” because there is a real or perceived need for them. So while a "need standard" obviously doesn't determine whether you HAVE Second Amendment rights, the needs of the citizenry, it seems to me, may absolutely be considered in SCOTUS decisions regarding LIMITS to those rights, which I believe was the point of the OP's question.

    OK. Then under this analysis the AR-15 rifle with a large capacity magazine is not subject to regulation. It is in widespread use in the civilian market in the U.S. That means that it has the same protections as a handgun and thus the actions of N.Y. (and the pending action in CA) would be unconstitutional. Ditto for most other popular semi-automatic handguns.

    As important as that distinction may be in a courtroom or on a college campus, for the purposes of this discussion, it's mostly semantic nitpicking. But okay, the Second Amendment doesn't grant you the right to carry any weapon you like, and nor does it protect your right to carry any weapon you like. Of course that phrasing doesn't make sense either inasmuch as no amendment can protect a right that the Supreme Court has ruled is not a "right" at all.
    I'm pleased to see you show your true colors (totalitarian) with your casual dismissal of the concepts of Rights guaranteed under our Constitution. A totalitarian can be a tyrant, an oligarch, or democrat (big or small "d"). The "dictatorship of the proletariat" or of the "majority" is as much a dictatorship as the rule of a Castro or a Stalin or a Franco. Or a Central Committee.

    G.
    Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão


    3 members found this post helpful.

  6. #66
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    Jan. 27, 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by katarine View Post
    As for justification or explaining...I'd like to know why anyone would buy a Toyota Sequoia, they look like bloated ticks to me. I demand an explanation.
    especially the reddish brown colour--what were they thinking?!


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #67
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    Sep. 7, 2009
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    Since I doubt this Congress has the ability to enact an assault weapon (by whatever definition) ban, I'm hoping they can enact, at the very least, an across the board background check system for both weapons and ammunition.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant


    2 members found this post helpful.

  8. #68
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    First, as to why mass murderer's choose an AR-15... do they?? Are you SURE? Are you sure of your facts or are you just assuming based on the hype? Pretty sure I remember reading that until Sandy Hook, none of them (ie: Columbine) had used an AR-15... and there's a BIG question mark over whether he actually used one there (or if it was in the trunk of the car as initially reported). Can you show me the statistic that says for all the gun crimes committed (which is still a small percentage of all crimes), that the AR-15 is most often used.

    Sunridge1... I don't know what Walmart you're shopping at, but I can't buy ANY gun there, aside from paintball and air-soft. I can buy ammunition but not the guns themselves (and now Walmart is limiting ammunition sales to 3 boxes/day).

    Also, while SOME may be idiot boys with their toys, I sure am not and I would ask that you stop making such heinous generalizations. I don't feel bad-ass when shooting. I feel competent. I feel secure. I feel confident. If that's "bad-ass" to you, then so be it. Maybe it is. But certainly NOT in the context that you're portraying.
    ************
    "Of course it's hard. It's supposed to be hard. It's the Hard that makes it great."

    "Get up... Get out... Get Drunk. Repeat as needed." -- Spike


    2 members found this post helpful.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    Since I doubt this Congress has the ability to enact an assault weapon (by whatever definition) ban, I'm hoping they can enact, at the very least, an across the board background check system for both weapons and ammunition.
    Why? It still won't stop criminals from obtaining guns. It won't stop criminals from breaking the existing laws we have about who and how you can obtain a gun.
    ************
    "Of course it's hard. It's supposed to be hard. It's the Hard that makes it great."

    "Get up... Get out... Get Drunk. Repeat as needed." -- Spike


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #70
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    I'd like those arguing for gun control to explain to me how this makes sense:

    http://timpreuss.files.wordpress.com...pg?w=300&h=198

    For those who don't want to click on the picture, it's a pic of a Mossberg 500 shotgun. Actually 2 pics of the same weapon... one is modified with a pistol grip and thus would fall as illegal under a so-called assault weapons ban. They both shoot the same way, both shoot the same caliber and number of shots... yet 1 is illegal due to the costmetic/ergonomic pistol grip. Color me stupid but what crime is the lack of a pistol grip going to prevent?
    ************
    "Of course it's hard. It's supposed to be hard. It's the Hard that makes it great."

    "Get up... Get out... Get Drunk. Repeat as needed." -- Spike


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #71
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    Jun. 25, 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    Since I doubt this Congress has the ability to enact an assault weapon (by whatever definition) ban, I'm hoping they can enact, at the very least, an across the board background check system for both weapons and ammunition.
    Legal, responsible gun owners already have to go through background checks to purchase.every.weapon. In some, if not all, states to legally purchase a weapon from another gun owner both have to go to registered gun dealer to perform the background check and to register the exchange. Again in many states you can not purchase certain guns, such as hand guns, and walk out. The hand gun is delivered from the store where purchased to a gun store local to the purchaser.
    These are just a few of the steps that responsible gun owners are legally required to take.
    There are already 7000+ laws regarding gun ownership.
    The US Supreme Court upheld, once again, the 2nd Admenment.

    People, who think like you, are now attempting to enact additional steps so that people give up their weapons. You think if you make it so time consuming and expensive people will just quit.

    Have to say it isn't working and future attempts will be blocked
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim



  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by tle View Post
    I'd like those arguing for gun control to explain to me how this makes sense:

    http://timpreuss.files.wordpress.com...pg?w=300&h=198

    For those who don't want to click on the picture, it's a pic of a Mossberg 500 shotgun. Actually 2 pics of the same weapon... one is modified with a pistol grip and thus would fall as illegal under a so-called assault weapons ban. They both shoot the same way, both shoot the same caliber and number of shots... yet 1 is illegal due to the costmetic/ergonomic pistol grip. Color me stupid but what crime is the lack of a pistol grip going to prevent?
    Ah yes the devil is always in the details. Some one probably inserted bad language deliberately. I don't know.

    What would be the advantage of pistol grip on a shotgun? Honest question.



  13. #73
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    A pistol grip makes it easier for some to wield it like a rifle from the hip and many people prefer them. Other than that, you can get a dozen different opinions about what is good or bad about them.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have,
    at this moment, been thrown up from below!



  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by tle View Post
    Why? It still won't stop criminals from obtaining guns. It won't stop criminals from breaking the existing laws we have about who and how you can obtain a gun.
    How do criminals obtain guns then, if not from straw man purchasers (bill in the House about that right now) or from gun shows or private sales. Or the ones that are stolen...just another reason why a responsible gun owner keeps those babies locked up.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant



  15. #75
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    Sep. 7, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by fooler View Post
    Legal, responsible gun owners already have to go through background checks to purchase.every.weapon. In some, if not all, states to legally purchase a weapon from another gun owner both have to go to registered gun dealer to perform the background check and to register the exchange. Again in many states you can not purchase certain guns, such as hand guns, and walk out. The hand gun is delivered from the store where purchased to a gun store local to the purchaser.
    These are just a few of the steps that responsible gun owners are legally required to take.
    There are already 7000+ laws regarding gun ownership.
    The US Supreme Court upheld, once again, the 2nd Admenment.

    People, who think like you, are now attempting to enact additional steps so that people give up their weapons. You think if you make it so time consuming and expensive people will just quit.

    Have to say it isn't working and future attempts will be blocked
    That's just not true. Over 40% of the guns sold in this country are sold without a background check. There are too many loopholes. You can stick your fingers in your ears and say you're not going to believe it, but that doesn't make it any less true.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant



  16. #76
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    Mar. 10, 2007
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    Montana
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    We have a gun that we take to the mountains for bear defense (along with our pepper spray). It is a shotgun with a pistol grip and a stock-it's easier to fit in the scabbard, it's lighter, and b/c it's shorter it's more maneuverable for my short arms in case we need to grab it in a pinch. The pistol grip means if we don't have time to get the gun to our shoulder to stop a bear we still have control over the gun and decent chance of stopping the bear. We call ours the bear gun and it has no other purpose in our lives than defense.



  17. #77
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    I want a gun that shoots bears but I don't think I could conceal-carry that and fit extra bears in my pockets.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have,
    at this moment, been thrown up from below!



  18. #78
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    It would be the ultimate defense!



  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    How do criminals obtain guns then, if not from straw man purchasers (bill in the House about that right now) or from gun shows or private sales. Or the ones that are stolen...just another reason why a responsible gun owner keeps those babies locked up.
    Theft from public agencies is a real threat. The more police cars that carry heavy duty weaponry the more that weaponry is exposed to theft. I wonder how many weapons are lost annually from the National Guard, Army, Marines, etc.? I tried a quick search to find some numbers but was not very successful. I'm not surprised as this is not something that DoD would advertise. I did find instances of large scale theft in Britain and Australia. I also found some articles on "gang infiltration" of the U.S. Armed Forces, particularly the Army.

    It's only good sense to keep weapons secure against unauthorized use. That may or may not include any specific strategy.

    G.
    Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão



  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    That's just not true. Over 40% of the guns sold in this country are sold without a background check. There are too many loopholes. You can stick your fingers in your ears and say you're not going to believe it, but that doesn't make it any less true.
    I trust long-time responsible gun sellers and gun owners. Here is the link to the FBI Fact Sheet for steps FFL's have to follow with each weapon sale.
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim



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