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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan. 22, 2005
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    2,525

    Default To moderator

    Since when is announcing achievements considered advertising ?

    I see where the post was removed by Hyperion Stud for simply relaying her stallions accomplishments by leading the KWPN jumper rankings. She never tried to "sell" him or his semen.

    I post all the time about my horses or horses I've brokered for others winning this or that. Is this not the same ? My posts and that of hundreds of other posters have never been removed.

    I think we need some clarity here.


    10 members found this post helpful.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 17, 2003
    Location
    North Texas, US
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    2,112

    Default

    No brags allowed on this forum. Had Hyperion posted in the H/J forum, it probably would have been okay. Just my guess.
    www.debracysporthorses.com
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun. 21, 2010
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    Sweden
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    460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cyriz's mom View Post
    No brags allowed on this forum. Had Hyperion posted in the H/J forum, it probably would have been okay. Just my guess.
    Ok, now I understand why my thread about Glory Days was gone..didn´t know that bragging was not allowed (even if I´m only involved as a fellow swede). Sorry..



  4. #4
    Join Date
    May. 14, 2004
    Location
    North Carolina
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    1,366

    Default

    I have been red flagged a couple of times over the years when I have posted my stallion or his offspring's achievements. But if I do the "brag" thing on the dressage forum, it seems that is OK.
    I did post about my young stallion getting licensed last summer and that was yanked as advertising
    Maryanna Haymon- Marydell Farm - Home to Don Principe & Doctor Wendell MF
    www.marydellfarm.com
    2012 USDF Champion Breeder! 2007, 2011 USEF Champ Breeder
    2009,2010,2011 USDF Res Breeder of the Year!



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Location
    Barboursville, VA
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    431

    Default

    Here's the response from the Moderator


    Hi there~

    Starting a thread to list accomplishments, awards or other attributes of stallions or offspring of an active breeding program serves to promote that program, whether or not it's intentional, which is why it's a violation of the site's no-advertising policies.

    Those representing or standing stallions are welcome to provide information about them or answer questions posed about them on the site if it's in response to an existing, genuine query by another poster or related to a general discussion topic.

    You'd be welcome to report other threads or posts you see in the future that you feel may be considered advertising, by clicking the triangular post reporting button in the lower left corner of the post. Our moderation system is largely facilitated by reports from members of the community, so there may be posts in violation of our policies that are active on the site that we haven't seen, which may have led to confusion on our policies.

    The infraction system is an inherent part of the forum software we utilize to run the site. We contacted you via Private Message twice earlier about advertising (on Feb. 2 and Nov. 16 of last year), so the next step in our site moderation protocol to address a repeated problem is to issue an infraction.

    We appreciate that you are a valued advertiser with the magazine, but we try to enforce the forums' posting policies as universally as possible.

    We're currently working on bringing our main site's (and magazine subscriber/advertiser log-ins) and the forums site's user databases and log-ins together under one system. Once we have the universal log-in system in place, where we'll be able to easily link forum users with their magazine subscription/advertiser status, we hope to offer more options in terms of special forums with different posting parameters for those who already support the magazine in terms of subscriptions or advertising.

    Please feel free to contact me if you have any further questions.
    Mod 1
    Hyperion Stud, LLC.
    Europe's Finest, Made in America
    WWW.HYPERIONSTUD.com
    Standing Elite and Approved Stallions


    2 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HyperionStudLLC View Post
    Here's the response from the Moderator

    We're currently working on bringing our main site's (and magazine subscriber/advertiser log-ins) and the forums site's user databases and log-ins together under one system. Once we have the universal log-in system in place, where we'll be able to easily link forum users with their magazine subscription/advertiser status, we hope to offer more options in terms of special forums with different posting parameters for those who already support the magazine in terms of subscriptions or advertising.

    Mod 1
    WOW!



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan. 15, 2008
    Location
    Chapel Hill and Southern Pines, North Carolina
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    2,407

    Default

    While I understand the conflict a business faces that depends on advertising revenue to allow a "free" forum/service - think Google, Facebook etc - what is ironic is that there is all sorts of "advertising" that goes on through "others"on the SHB forum - had someone else posted about the father of their offspring (as in say, my thanking Hyperion for the wonderful stallion they own who sired my baby and mention said stallion's accomplishments)? Those posts stay (I don't think I have ever seen those removed) - and I suspect many such posts are encouraged (why not?) by stallion owners - In addition, I also suspect many a post asking "about" a stallion are promoted by a stallion owner.
    Thus it gets a bit "grey" as to the "who" is advertising

    Have a stallion owner who doesn't reach out to others to post for them? Bam - post gone.
    "Her life was okay. Sometimes she wished she were sleeping with the right man instead of with her dog, but she never felt she was sleeping with the wrong dog."



    www.dontlookbackfarm.com


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 3Dogs View Post
    While I understand the conflict a business faces that depends on advertising revenue to allow a "free" forum/service - think Google, Facebook etc -
    I understand it too, but I refuse to lower myself to these eroded business tactics. The next time a student asks me for a recommendation for graduate school or a job, do I ask for payment? A good recommendation takes time to write, and if one is asked by numerous individuals over multiple years, it adds up to at least the cost of a subscription. And, if I chose to not provided it, there would be no monetary consequences. But of course I would never ask for payment and neither would my colleagues, and that's because it's a "service" of my profession. And, I would argue, that providing this forum is a "service" of the magazine which brings in significant dollars in advertising and memberships.

    The embedded suggestion of the moderator that clients which provide $$$$$ to the Chronicle will receive "preferred" treatment is offensive. I suspect they already do that on occasion, but shouldn't they at least state they do in "forum rules" section?

    And, I agree 3Dogs there "is all sorts of "advertising" that goes on through "others"on the SHB forum"


    2 members found this post helpful.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul. 21, 2011
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    Co
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    4,189

    Default

    Am I correct in understanding that there is to be a separate forum for those who advertise in, and subscribe to, COTH and on THAT forum it would be OK to brag about your stallion's accomplishments?

    And by the way.. Hyperion, how are your horses doing at WEF this year?
    I love keeping up with news from the members of this forum. Even though I am not a breeder I am interested in the subject and enjoy the progress reports.

    I am happily anticipating foal watch with those who do Mare Stare, since I keep late hours..


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb. 23, 2005
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    Spotsylvania, VA
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    Default

    A few years ago I posted how happy I was to have been given Sophie's dam. I listed Beeza's other offspring, who I DID NOT own. I did mention she was in foal. That post was removed because it "promoted my breeding program"
    Not to long ago another poster, who did NOT own the stallion in question posted how she had found some neat info about a stallion she was familiar with. That post was also removed.
    I don't understand
    I wasn't always a Smurf
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    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug. 13, 2009
    Posts
    656

    Default

    I had a thread removed too. I was bragging that one of my mares was the top scoring mare for her registry for that year and I too was told by moderator that it was removed for promoting my breeding program. Neither the mare or her foal were for sale at the time. In fact the mare will never ever ever be for sale! I was just so excited that a tiny little nobody like me brought up such a nice mare.
    Check us out on Facebook at EVER AFTER FARM


    2 members found this post helpful.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec. 2, 2004
    Posts
    3,189

    Default

    .... and so many other posts - like I need to sell my "name of saddle, style and size" where should I advertise??? vs I need to 'sell my saddle.'

    Let the moderators count the PMs.
    The truth is what you can get other people to believe.

    -- Tommy Smothers


    1 members found this post helpful.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec. 13, 1999
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
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    35,487

    Default

    At one point a few years ago there were easily a dozen or so brags a day of stallions by the SOs, or of kids by their stallions, most not even very thinly veiled as advertisements. The most blatantly advertising ones were getting removed, but then those posters were pouting about others being left even when it was relatively obvious they were also ads. That's when the powers that be decided they'd just have to all go away. Just sayin'
    ______________________________
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    6 members found this post helpful.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct. 13, 2003
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    Eastern Pacific coast
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    3,573

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marydell View Post
    I have been red flagged a couple of times over the years when I have posted my stallion or his offspring's achievements. But if I do the "brag" thing on the dressage forum, it seems that is OK.
    There's a thread on the Dressage forum now with a video of a BNT trainer/coach. A few posts later, the name and place of his next clinic is posted.

    I guess that's not an ad ? Honestly I can never tell any more. Shouldn't the policy be the same for all the forums ? (just asking)
    -Amor vincit omnia-


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2004
    Posts
    7,538

    Default

    what is the point of the sport horse breeding forum if we cant talk about what sport horses are doing?

    plus, i guess you could say that most posting could be seen as advertising.... as an example, i see trainers post giving helpful training suggestions - sometimes it is pretty blatant they are trolling for clients....isn't that advertising?

    plus there are folks here whose field of business is smack dab in the middle of sport horse breeding, and yet they seem to be able to post away - even tho it could be construed as advertising based on what product they sell.

    so, i think that unless there is some hard and clear guidelines you could also say everything is advertising here.....
    Last edited by mbm; Feb. 3, 2013 at 12:30 AM.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  16. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marydell View Post
    I have been red flagged a couple of times over the years when I have posted my stallion or his offspring's achievements. But if I do the "brag" thing on the dressage forum, it seems that is OK.
    Not to split hairs, but there is a difference between Dressage and USDF Dressage Sport Horse Breeding, Eventing and USEA Future Event Horse Series and Hunter/Jumpers and Hunter Breeding. If I wanted to post a brag about an In-Hand show really, short of an In-Hand forum being created, wouldn't the Sport Horse Breeding forum really be the most appropriate?

    USDF DSHB, USEA FEH and Hunter breeding have more in common togeather than they do in their "parent" discipline sub-groups.

    I don't have a breeding program. I have a mare and a foal who I am keeping, and if you were to come out to my farm, I have nothing to sell. If I have a young foal or a yearling, who is not for sale, that I am planning on keeping and isn't old enough to even consider being a stallion for service or has been gelded. Especially if its a foal that has been talked and posted about durring its gestation, why would a Current Year Foal show brag be advertising?

    Sport Horse Breeding isn't simply a health care topic, but it is also a legitimate discipline worthy of member brags like any other discipline forum.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Oct. 30, 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,119

    Default

    The key piece from the posted Forum Rules and No-Advertising Policy, and the bottom line:
    "....... at the discretion of the moderators."


    1 members found this post helpful.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec. 14, 2007
    Location
    Wilsonville, Ontario, CANADA
    Posts
    4,329

    Default

    Indy Lou has nailed it on the proverbial head. It all boils down to "discretion" on the part of the Moderators

    Ive addressed this issue in the past with the Mods as I was unsure / unclear on a few points

    I sell a product that I bring in from the UK to prevent blanket rubs. I wasnt sure if I could actually mention this in any posts so I asked, and was told - no - I couldnt go on a thread and say "I sell this product to prevent blanket rubs - buy it" but if a thread was started by someone saying their horse had rubs, could anyone recommend a product to help, I was permitted to go on and say "Try this one" and provide a link to it

    In the same way as I couldnt start a thread or go on a thread and say "Breed to my stallion. His daughter was just Champion at XXX Show" but if someone posted that they were looking for a TB stallion, or a stallion that produced offspring that were competitive in XXX discipline and if my stallion fit within the parameters of what that poster was looking for, I was permitted to go on the thread and say so and provide a link to my website.

    It very much is a "grey" area and appears to be permitted if these rules are followed



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug. 15, 2010
    Posts
    1,589

    Default

    What about all the discussions during the Stallion Testing? With scores and details posted about stallions - that seems much more advertising related then a brag about year end performance awards? It just seems inconsistent.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Oct. 21, 1999
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    12,185

    Default

    You do realize that not every single post on every single thread on every single forum gets read, don't you? I would suspect that most posts that get caught have been reported, are on a thread that has proven to be contentious or troublesome in some other way or have a title that is, like this thread, so blatantly obvious that the mods are drawn to it. Moderating isn't a black and white game. You do the best you can, and you know, going in, that your solutions aren't going to please everyone. Everyone sees things differently. You only have to look at American politics to realize that.

    The fact is that there is a no advertising rule on these forums. The fact also is that there are people on all of the forums who skirt those rules, either unknowingly, or on purpose. This forum is harder than most because the line is not as clear. But, all of you have to realize, smart people that you are, that there are some people on here who are deliberately trying to get as close to the edge as they can in order to promote their business. I'm not naming names, I'm not saying it's anyone who has posted on this thread. It's just obvious if you read these forums on a regular basis. And, really, it's just human nature.

    It's an internet forum. You get slapped on the wrist every once in a while if you post a lot. Lots of people have had it happen to them. Most don't complain, they just file it under lesson learned and go on. You newer guys may not realize that you are lucky. These mods are pretty lenient, IMO. I know some mods who might not have been quite so lenient.
    Originally Posted by Alagirl
    We just love to shame poor people...when in reality, we are all just peasants.


    13 members found this post helpful.

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