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  1. #1

    Default Need help determining value of mid-level dressage horse

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    Last edited by alterbroken; Feb. 26, 2014 at 05:47 PM.



  2. #2
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    $10k absolute max IMHO. The market is still absolute crap for the most part.



  3. #3
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    deleted post
    Last edited by alterbroken; Feb. 26, 2014 at 05:47 PM.



  4. #4
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    I don't know about that. He has a work ethic. Not always come-by. He can be expected to work again at his upper limit with the maintenance suggested.

    IMO, a horse like that around my trainer's barn would be put back to work so that his strength and muscling was brought back to optimum. If he has a work ethic, which I define as being a hard worker at learning what you are trying to teach him, then the holes in his training cold be filled. If he held up for that level of work WITH the maintenance you suggest, he would probably be leased by one of my trainers mid level students. She would probably keep him because of his maintenance issues, and very possibly a student could purchase him under her tutelege (sorry, spelling) and probably if he could be used another 5 to 7 years at this mid level IF he was brought back now and maintained well. That 2000 figure is about twice the cost of regular shoeing or trimming per year anyway; not exorbitant to me.And he could teach some of the upper level movements? If my trainer had the money, my guess would be that she would buy him for 10 to 15k; my guess is that he would stay very sound under her program, and would be worth 10 to 20k to one of her students if they wanted a horse trained at that level. The reason he might not be worth more is becase he probably could not go beyond his current skill set, which is a very tidy skill set.

    But that's just my personal observation.
    Trainer's website - photos of my horse Airborne under About and Francesca Edwards also in media page 1

    http://www.patricianorciadressage.com/



  5. #5
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    Fancy imported WB Gelding, mid teens (so 15ish) PSG schoolmaster, ready to show 2nd level with "strong" rider and wil not pass the vet. In my neck of the woods, this horse would likely be retired or a free lease to a good home.


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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by alterbroken View Post
    1. Will not pass a flexion test.
    Exactly what does that mean? Would a positive '1' be considered a fail? A "1.5"? I would expect a slight positive on hind flexions on an older higher trained dressage horse. Now front leg flexions would be more serious to me, but then it would depend on the reason for the positive flexion.

    Old injury requires maintenance that will cost est. $2,000 annually (supplements, shoeing, injections).
    That is humorous to me because every 5 weeks I pay $325 for four shoes. I think 2k a year for any kind of maintenance is nothing. Just for 'preventative' maintenance (adequan, supplements, etc.) my costs are quite high.

    Currently "sound" as far as work but who knows how long?
    LOL. Yeah, who knows how long any horse will stay sound. Perfect today, limping tomorrow.
    There are many different opinions
    For sure, and on this board the vast majority think all horses should cost 10k or less and that there are many wonderful fei horse bargains out there. That's why they all have one.
    ...there are so many crappy horses for sale that some consider him even with his "special needs" typical for a mid-teen schoolmaster type.
    What's that tell you? He might be the best of the crap that's for sale?
    On the other hand, aren't there tons of horses like this that people give away or are sold very cheap ($5K range)?
    Well, it seems that DudleyC thinks so. I honestly don't know, but I tend to doubt it. The few times I've looked at the 'giveaway' forum on this board, you'd have to pay me to take any of them. Go and look on the various horse sale sites at the horses for sale for 10k and less and see what you find that is better than this horse. If this horse showed 4th a year ago, then I don't see why he couldn't show 3rd now (in a double), unless he was laid up for a year and unfit. If he showed FEI in Europe, even with bad training he must have some talent. I can't give a price on his worth without knowing specifically what his soundness issues are and how difficult he is to ride. We are getting just your opinion of the horse, and other people might judge him differently, thus the many different opinons.

    I have seen a lot of older (like 17-18) horses for sale that are advertised as PSG schoolmasters for 30k or more that have show records at PSG scoring in the 50's. Whether they sell or not for that price, I don't know. I highly doubt many 18 year old horses have perfect flexion tests and are maintenance free.


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  7. #7
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    deleted post
    Last edited by alterbroken; Feb. 26, 2014 at 05:48 PM.



  8. #8
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    I've seen sound versions (pass vet, no maint) of what you describe that sold for $3k
    Retraining others mistakes takes TIME, and there's no guarantee his brain can be rewired.
    www.destinationconsensusequus.com
    chaque pas est fait ensemble



  9. #9
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    Value can be such a subjective thing... as we all know, horses are worth what someone will pay for them in that moment.

    A horse like this might not have a huge pool of potential buyers, but that doesn't mean this horse would have no market and needs to be given away, unless perhaps the owner is in some sort of distress and needs a fast resolution.

    A horse like this one would appeal to me, for instance. I am new to dressage, but have been riding for decades. Strong/forward doesn't bother me a bit (in fact, generally I prefer that type of ride.) I have a trainer and a program that is known for being able to get and keep horses sound (and I agree with the poster above who thinks $2K in maintenance/shoes would be NBD.)

    If the horse was able to show successfully at the stated levels as recently as a year ago, I would perhaps assume that the horse has had the proper foundation and training in the past, and simply needs a reboot to address the recent deficiencies in the program he's been in. Since I am nowhere near riding or showing at 4th currently, sticking to that reschooling effort at 1st/2nd would suit me just fine, and I'd imagine that by the time *I* was ready to move up, the horse's topline and general fitness would be more than adequate for the job.
    **********
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by alterbroken View Post
    Grade 2 lame after flexion tests. I would be very surprised a person actually buying a horse (not adopting or getting dirt cheap) would pursue a horse like this. But this is why I am trying to get viewpoints. Horse could not be shown correctly currently at 3rd even in a double...key word is correctly. However, anyone can slap a double on today and waterski around the ring and score in the low 50's I guess.
    So with some maintenence and an attitude of "I want to go show and do some tricks and maybe wina ribbon, and don't really care if every stride is classically correct" this horse would be a good choice. Not everyone is a perfectionist. And not everyone cares about "correct". I'm not saying this is good, but it happens.

    It sounds like you think the horse is worthless because there are holes in its training and it's not quite sound and someone is trying to sell it for a lot more money than you think they should.



  11. #11
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    Lower rideability, strong forward, low muscling, an old injury and the use of a double to force a frame and collection that results in incorrect work suggests that the horse may have a physical issue that makes work above 2nd or even at 2nd level not possible. With the right maintenance and a little pain free retraining he could become a nice 1st level horse for some ammy. His work ethic may be what has gotten him into trouble.
    "The mighty oak is a nut who stood its ground"

    "...you'll never win Olympic gold by shaking a carrot stick at a warmblood..." see u at x



  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stacie View Post
    Lower rideability, strong forward, low muscling, an old injury and the use of a double to force a frame and collection that results in incorrect work suggests that the horse may have a physical issue that makes work above 2nd or even at 2nd level not possible. With the right maintenance and a little pain free retraining he could become a nice 1st level horse for some ammy. His work ethic may be what has gotten him into trouble.
    This.
    Mid teens & he hasn't worked correctly in 3 years & he's sore & has training issues - I'd start by giving him several months off, then slowly bringing him back to fitness & then even more slowly retraining ... so no, would't pay much for this horse.

    And if he needs injections, that alone would run 2K per annum in my area ...

    The horse he is right now, not alot of value, if you can sell the potential horse, there are obviously a few posters that are willing to buy that ...



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