[yellowbritches]

I lost tolerance when I read that her other horse had "well deserved" spur marks. Sigh.

WHAT?!

Oh, geez.....

[Bogie]

I went back and found the exact quote about her other horse in this thread: http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...14#post6620914

has even earned himself a couple of spur marks from trying to get him to lift his back and keep it up instead of cheating

Of course this is also the horse she rides in a twisted wire snaffle. Hmm, spur marks PLUS a strong bit.

That was before I read about the kitty and dog problems.

[Meadow36]

Instead of coming back and appreciating that, you proceeded to explain why everyone was wrong and you weren't going to take any of that advice, but please keep the ideas coming.

This. Every time you got a suggestion, you shot it down. You clearly seem to think you know what's best, so why post for advice at all?

Training horses requires being open minded. You didn't want to do that.

And yes, using a lip chain even once on the lunge could have caused a variety of accidents - horse could have flipped over backwards, horse could have cut his gums up, horse could have elevated the temper tantrum, gotten loose and had a bigger accident.

I'm sorry you don't see the seriousness of that.

There were other ways your trainer (and you) could have handled a wild horse on the lunge.

[stargzng386]

I really hope the owners of the horses she and her trainer are working with know about this. I would be livid if such rough tactics were used on my horse instead of actually being patient and training them.

I went back and found the exact quote about her other horse in this thread: http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...14#post6620914



Of course this is also the horse she rides in a twisted wire snaffle. Hmm, spur marks PLUS a strong bit.

That was before I read about the kitty and dog problems.

[Sticky Situation]

He can get a bit strong on XC...in fact, I literally had to put him on his a$$ halfway through our course at a schooling show Sunday to remind him that yes, *I* was the brains of the operation, and NO, we're not going Prelim speed...but in his defense, it was chilly and he was feeling very "up" all day. When Trainer and I were discussing this whole scenario, her response was "Easy fix. bit him up."

It seems this isn't the trainer's first offense, either.

[wcporter]

OP. I don't know you. I have't been privy to your prior threads.

What I do know is that, despite a very limited few (who really don't last long on this board anyway), the advice you're getting is 100% for the benefit of the horse and based on years of experience and trial and error.

Sometimes the tone of *some* posts can get a bit touchy, but that's only because they derive from a place of great concern for the well-being of the animal involved.

And what these concerned posters hate most of all is their well-intended and though-out advice falling on dead ears or being met by a bunch of "ya-buts..." That's what gets the fur flying and the attack mode engaging.

If you read through ALL past threads that have turned the way this one has, 99.9% of the time it is because the OP comes on here asking for "advice," but really only looking for concurrence of what they already believe to be true.

[Appsolute]

has even earned himself a couple of spur marks from trying to get him to lift his back and keep it up instead of cheating

Because.. you know, horses just love to CHEAT and aren’t honest – a horse couldn’t be dropping its back from lack of strength (conditioning on HILLs is a great way to build top lines).

OP – I am going to get all judgey pants. It is attitudes like this that lead to the ugly that is all too prevalent in the horse show world. THIS is the sort of attitude that I encountered from clients during my years as a working student for BNT that turned me off of the “industry”.

That a horse is just being an ass, that it is trying to cheat, that it deserves spur marks, lip chain and other harsh handling when they do not respond well to mismanagement. How can you treat your friend like this? Instead of looking for a powder to pour on his feed, seriously take a look at how he is being managed, and how content he could be in this situation. In my experience, a HAPPY horse is a cooperative horse. Meet his needs, and perhaps he will be able to comply with your demands.

Take a serious look at how your animals are living, and how far it is from their natural ideal. Then take a look at what you are asking them to do for you, and what is in it for them. Empathy and compassion go a long way in horse training. Honestly your horse’s set up sounds fairly miserable. 5 days a week in a stall, only exercise is controlled and involves circles in an arena. When exuberance is shown, because the horse is not getting enough exercise or free time, it is refuted with pain.

[oliverreed]

Appsolute, I wish I could thumbs up your post a thousand times.

[runNjump86]

It seems this isn't the trainer's first offense, either.

Ok this one I cannot let go. oliverreed's personal attacks...whatever. But THIS just plain pisses me off.

In regards to the "Easy fix, bit him up" comment, if you would actually READ that thread, it was in regards to a TWELVE YEAR OLD taking my horse, who is QUITE STRONG and BULLHEADED, out on XC, and us wanting everyone, ESPECIALLY THE TWELVE YEAR OLD, to be safe.

[Kadenz]

Ok this one I cannot let go. oliverreed's personal attacks...whatever. But THIS just plain pisses me off.

In regards to the "Easy fix, bit him up" comment, if you would actually READ that thread, it was in regards to a TWELVE YEAR OLD taking my horse, who is QUITE STRONG and BULLHEADED, out on XC, and us wanting everyone, ESPECIALLY THE TWELVE YEAR OLD, to be safe.

The fact that you can't see that your explanation isn't any better, is kind of the whole problem, OP.

Why would you put a 12-year-old kid on a xc course on a strong, bullheaded (never gets turnout, rarely ridden outside of the ring) horse? Even if you do "bit him up", the entire situation (as relayed by you) is...let's just say "not well thought through."

It's obvious that you think your trainer's great, and the methods are fine. But some of us have been around the block. More than once. More than one block, even. And we can see that your trainer's methods aren't exactly stellar. Sorry that you can't see that yet.

[runNjump86]

The fact that you can't see that your explanation isn't any better, is kind of the whole problem, OP.

Why would you put a 12-year-old kid on a xc course on a strong, bullheaded (never gets turnout, rarely ridden outside of the ring) horse? Even if you do "bit him up", the entire situation (as relayed by you) is...let's just say "not well thought through."

It's obvious that you think your trainer's great, and the methods are fine. But some of us have been around the block. More than once. More than one block, even. And we can see that your trainer's methods aren't exactly stellar. Sorry that you can't see that yet.

We would put her on him, who is a different horse that the one in this thread, because he is a total saint, takes care of her, bails her out over every single fence, and is a perfect match for her. The only time he gets strong and bullheaded is on XC, but when he goes in a Kimberwicke, there are no issues. THAT'S why.

[Kadenz]

Nah, you're right. Your trainer is great and you're doing EVERYTHING right.

Feed him some B12 or whatever and see if it helps.


To (mis)quote Bar.ka: we see u at Rolex in no time.