[violethorse]

Why is the moderator allowing Amberhill to post a link to documents concerning legal communications that clearly have content in them from EM's attorney that is labeled confidential and privileged? Is COTH now becoming the WikiLeaks of the equestrian community in the US? COTH should not be a forum for anyone to advance their personal legal agenda. COTH should not be the place to promote a personal legal agenda against individuals or the USEF

[MHM]

2. Necropsies must be mandatory for all deaths of animals at USEF Sanctioned Competitions and paid for by the USEF. They must be performed by other than the competition veterinarian of record and by an unbiased and well known clinic.

--- so, trainer/owner injects pony while at sanctioned show - pony collapses and dies and same trainer/owner now says USEF should pay for necropsies in such instances?!?!?!?!

I'm really, really, really reluctant to post on this thread, but....

I think USEF would have to pay for required necropsies, if only to make sure there are no improprieties. I doubt murder suspects are the ones to pay for the postmortems on their alleged victims.

Any restrictive requirement about the location of a necropsy seems problematic. Plenty of horse shows happen far away from major clinics.

Plus I would imagine any time lapse for transport might have an effect on the accuracy of blood or tissue samples. Perhaps a vet could weigh in on that question?

[Go Fish]

COTH should not be the place to promote a personal legal agenda against individuals or the USEF

Oh, please, no! You'd take all our fun away!

[skydy]

Ms. Tauber, our USEF President, through Ms. Keating, our USEF In House General Counsel refuses to meet about pressing issues in relation to our sport and in relation to all USEF Members. If GR609 is not changed to be in accordance with USOC governances, USEF Members livelihoods continue to be at risk. Also, my proposal for necropsy/toxicology requirements for ALL animal deaths at USEF sanctioned competitions MUST be addressed. Out of the 16 animals that died at USEF competitions last year, only one was front and center on the internet and in the press. Please join my cause, sign my petition and do not be afraid of the upper management of the USEF any longer.

See new documents posted:

http://amberhillponies.com/Amber_Hil...nitiative.html

Hmm, I can't imagine why USEF doesn't want to sit down with you and chat about what THEY can do for you..
Honestly, get a grip on yourself [edit]

Oh, and I am not, and never have been "afraid of the upper management of the USEF" and I don't understand why you are. You were well treated, considering..

[leyla25]

Such a strong resemblance to the Armstrong case. As they say, you can't make this stuff up.

[thegirlwonder]

Ms. Tauber, our USEF President, through Ms. Keating, our USEF In House General Counsel refuses to meet about pressing issues in relation to our sport and in relation to all USEF Members. If GR609 is not changed to be in accordance with USOC governances, USEF Members livelihoods continue to be at risk. Also, my proposal for necropsy/toxicology requirements for ALL animal deaths at USEF sanctioned competitions MUST be addressed. Out of the 16 animals that died at USEF competitions last year, only one was front and center on the internet and in the press. Please join my cause, sign my petition and do not be afraid of the upper management of the USEF any longer.

See new documents posted:

http://amberhillponies.com/Amber_Hil...nitiative.html

If you actually use this link and read through the Emails between Tucker and Keating, as of 3 days ago, USEF was willing to sit down to a meeting if Tucker's client (aka Mandarino) adhered to some rules/guidelines such as: CONFIDENTIALITY! No posting on the internet or BB or chat rooms. She's just cut her nose off to spite her face AGAIN!

[FineAlready]

If you actually use this link and read through the Emails between Tucker and Keating, as of 3 days ago, USEF was willing to sit down to a meeting if Tucker's client (aka Mandarino) adhered to some rules/guidelines such as: CONFIDENTIALITY! No posting on the internet or BB or chat rooms. She's just cut her nose off to spite her face AGAIN!

I thought the e-mail thread painted a pretty clear picture of which party was the more reasonable of the two...

[jen-s]

I will donate $ (admittedly a dribble, but anything is better than nothing, right?) to the animal rescue of choice for whomever creates an Xtranormal video featuring EM and her endless COTH drama. But please don't get yourself sued in the process, ok, 'cause I'm not rich and can't bail you out. Although if there was ever a good reason for COTHers to chip in on an attorney...

[Halt Near X]

I thought the e-mail thread painted a pretty clear picture of which party was the more reasonable of the two...

Not to mention which party actually ended the meeting negotiations.

[Addison]

VIOLETHORSE It is not COTH's responsibility…her lawyers should be acting to prevent the publication of such information.

[FineAlready]

It is incredibly difficult for a lawyer to rein in a wayward client or to keep that client from publishing x, y, and z to said client's own detriment.

But I agree, it isn't COTH's responsibility either. And if someone is determined to establish a website dedicated to, among other things, publishing communications between their own attorney and other attorneys? Well...it's going to be an uphill battle to prevent it.

[Purepony]

What it different about Humbles death as opposed to all the others? His owner/ trainer fled the scene, implying guilt ( real or not) and left her daughter, her grooms and her clients at the show to deal with this unfortunate episode. Not a mature reaction and one that fueled rampant speculation in the horse community. Sad for everyone all around.

[mvp]

Why is the moderator allowing Amberhill to post a link to documents concerning legal communications that clearly have content in them from EM's attorney that is labeled confidential and privileged? Is COTH now becoming the WikiLeaks of the equestrian community in the US? COTH should not be a forum for anyone to advance their personal legal agenda. COTH should not be the place to promote a personal legal agenda against individuals or the USEF

You have it wrong.

If EM wants to violate her own confidentiality using COTH then COTH isn't to blame.

The same applies to the WikiLeaks idea.

And who gives a rat's patoot if someone wants to try their case in the COTH forums? I suppose the USEF could get embarrassed enough to ask COTH to have EM keep this stuff out of the public eye. But I think their strategy is to staunchly ignore Mandarino.

[FineAlready]

You have it wrong.

If EM wants to violate her own confidentiality using COTH then COTH isn't to blame.

The same applies to the WikiLeaks idea.

And who gives a rat's patoot if someone wants to try their case in the COTH forums? I suppose the USEF could get embarrassed enough to ask COTH to have EM keep this stuff out of the public eye. But I think their strategy is to staunchly ignore Mandarino.

Actually, I doubt USEF would be embarassed by that e-mail exchange.

Also, communications from one party's attorney to the other party's attorney are not attorney-client privileged. If EM was posting e-mails between herself and her attorney, she would be posting attorney-client privileged e-mails. But the privilege is hers, so she has the right to waive it...even if it is a bad idea. Her attorney, obviously, does NOT have the right to waive her privilege, and thus could not herself post e-mails between herself and her client.

Attorneys often DO publicly file with courts e-mail exchanges between themselves and an adverse attorney. Those communications are not privileged, but communications between attorneys working on behalf of the same client are privileged.

Privilege isn't always as clear cut as people think it is, and the person who is the beneficiary of the privilege can always waive it (intentionally, or by doing something stupid). But, generally speaking, if one attorney writes a letter (or e-mail) to another, adverse attorney, that letter is not privileged. Depending on the contents of the communication, there may be restrictions on its use as evidence...but that's a different ball game.

Nevertheless, no attorney wants to see what is happening here. It just unnecessarily complicates life. For everyone.

[fair judy]

I will donate $ (admittedly a dribble, but anything is better than nothing, right?) to the animal rescue of choice for whomever creates an Xtranormal video featuring EM and her endless COTH drama. But please don't get yourself sued in the process, ok, 'cause I'm not rich and can't bail you out. Although if there was ever a good reason for COTHers to chip in on an attorney...

this can be the opening line ""I demand you change the things that made it possible for me to kill my pony and get away with it. And name it after that dead pony" . could be said by anyone, right? the character could carry a clipboard and ask you to sign her petition...... those xtranormal things are sooooo deadpan it would be surreal.

[OAK]

this needs to be a reality show. I don't normally watch them BUT I would tune into this one .

[Instride]

MAYBE WE ALL AS USEF members should start a petition asking for her permanent suspension due to the negative nature of her presence. Since SHE has called for the masses to support her - which any SANE person wouldn't - maybe we should use her tactics on her. We shall call it the - "GET RID OF MANDARINO INITIATIVE" I bet we would get a TON of signatures for the board of directors at USEF to review. Now read this email she wrote and sent this morning to the USEF with her intent to pursue legal action. http://amberhillponies.com/Amber_Hil...o_v._USEF.html

[RAyers]

You, amber hill/Erin, [edit]. People like you have destroyed the sport and I sincerely hope that we can drum folks such as you out.

You post "red herrings" in a vain attempt to look like you are a "concerned" person. No, you killed the horse and damn near got caught. YOU, are a DISGRACE to REAL horsemen.

YOUR OWN documentation points as many fingers at YOU for being AT FAULT in the death of the horse. Just go away from the sport.

Ms. Tauber, our USEF President, through Ms. Keating, our USEF In House General Counsel refuses to meet about pressing issues in relation to our sport and in relation to all USEF Members...]

[Moderator 1]

We appreciate the emotionally charged nature of this topic, but please refrain from name calling. It's fine to provide your opinion of comments made, developments in the situation, materials posted, etc., but please do so within our posting policies.

We've edited a couple of posts.

Thanks,
Mod 1

[Janeway]

Kid having panic attacks is irrelevant.

But is very sad. I happened to see a post from the daughter on Facebook back in the fall where she left a note on a mutual aquaintances's wall that none of the other juniors would talk to her anymore and that "everyone hated her" because of what happened to Humble.

I really feel for this kid, because she is taking the fall alongside her mother and is no doubt dealing with a lot of drama and negativity. I sincerely hope she is getting some stable support from someone, [edit]