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  1. #1
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    Default Why do you compete in FEI events?

    As I'm looking at the calendar for 2013 (Happy New Year!!), I'm looking at CIC*, CCI*, CIC**, CCI** and Intermediates.

    I was surprised at the entry $$ difference between a CIC*/P and CIC**/I at the one and only FEI event in Area V. Actually, I can enter him in Int for $255 or CIC* for $505!!! Neither include stabling, btw...I double checked.

    The other events I looked at (mainly Area III), the cost was about $100 more. That I completely understand...additional TD, vet, etc.

    But then I got to thinking, if your goal isn't to compete on "the Team" or do Rolex, why bother with FEI "stuff." Passports, vet costs, higher entries, etc.

    Am I missing something? I'm thinking that I would be perfectly happy for him just to compete in National level events.

    Of course, if I lived where there were lots of CIC and CCIs available, it might be different, but from North Texas other than the one event (CIC* and CIC**), you have to haul at least 500 miles to compete in a CCI* or more. Many of the young riders haul 1000 miles multiple times/year.

    So, why do YOU compete in FEI events?
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  2. #2
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    Used to be a goal in itself... some of my proudest achievements are my completion medals for CCI* and CCI** long-format events.

    However I was contemplating the same thing today - I have only done two CICs, as they weren't necessary. Now with the new FEI qualification matrix, looks like a lot more $$ is going to be needed to get anywhere...

    There is a trickle-down effect too - due to budget constraints, as I started to plan my season this year, I've decided to try to get the horses schooled at home and ready to go Training the first time out, so I can do the bare minimum number of events needed to get them qualified. This will mean less support of local events - a vicious circle for our local circuit.

    [Edit: response to Janet's post below - the rule for Canadians is that horse AND rider must have at least 4 Training level events, 3 of which have to be CAN qualifying results.]
    Last edited by Blugal; Jan. 1, 2013 at 07:08 PM. Reason: Forgot how many CICs I'd done...
    Blugal

    You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng



  3. #3
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    Default

    Even the costs of recognized events has gotten high. I'll be searching out the highest quality unrecognized and go to them instead. I just looked at the omnibus for several events and you're at $200 before the horse even steps on the trailer.

    Times are tight and I don't see doing that very often.
    "I couldn't find my keys, so I put her in the trunk"



  4. #4
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    Default

    I have the same concerns. Probably the only reason I am planning to do FEI this year is because I want to do the FHI 2*. But the cost is ridiculous (not just the entries) with the passport, extra stabling, etc. that you have to have. You can move up the levels and do Advanced without ever doing FEI.

    The funny part is that with the new rules (DC can correct if I am wrong!), you could run 10 advanced and if you want to do a 2*, you would have to go back and do a 1* in order to qualify.

    FEI is a money pit...



  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahbaumgardner View Post

    The funny part is that with the new rules (DC can correct if I am wrong!), you could run 10 advanced and if you want to do a 2*, you would have to go back and do a 1* in order to qualify.

    FEI is a money pit...
    Yes you're correct. You MUST do FEI if you want to do upper level events like FHI or Rolex. If your ultimate goal is to run the Advanced at AECs, you need only do national events.

    Cyriz'smom, GW is probably one of the most expensive FEI events out there other than the high profile ones like Fair Hill, Galway, Jersey, or Bromont. The reason for that is that is the scarcity of entries; they have long debated dropping the FEI portion at that event, but YR and Mike have begged them to keep it to help the YR program, since it's the only FEI event in Area V. They argue that if you need it for FEI qualifications, you'll pay the entry. This is true, and the only reason GW has continued to have FEI. But when you have so few entries in those divisions, the costs of the extra judges, TDs, etc are spread among fewer competitors.

    Poplar, for instance, is much more affordable.

    So keep in mind that if you want Cy to keep moving up the levels, unless you get his FEI qualifications, you will only be able to compete in national competitions unless you invest in the qualification process now.



  6. #6
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    Yes. Competing at the FEI level is expensive and the bureaucracy of the FEI is mind numbing.

    That being said, I consider finishing a CCI as proof that my horse and I are answering all the questions for our level and are ready for more. Almost like a final exam. At least, that's what it should be. I also like having an end goal...just doing national horse trials for me isn't enough. I like having something to prepare for. I feel like an FEI event, specifically a CCI, at the end of a season, helps keep me progressing and striving to get better.

    No, you don't HAVE to do FEIs if you don't have any FEI level goals (FHI, Rolex, teams, etc). But I do think some people need them as a goal, an end point.



  7. #7
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    It was a "bucket list" thing for me to qualify for and compete in a CCI*, so the hoops had to be jumped through. I did a CIC* as well, which while not really necessary was not difficult to add on since the paperwork for the CCI* was already done, and the venue (Maui Jim) was one I always wanted to support.

    If the option existed to do a CCN* in the future (should I ever get back to that level) I would choose that over a CCI*, since I believe in voting with my checkbook and do not in any way consider myself a supporter of the FEI.

    ETA I would also preferentially do a P3D over a silly short-format CCI* 100 times out of 100. Not actually sure if CCN* is an FEI competition or not. I just know I have no interest in the short format, personally.
    Click here before you buy.



  8. #8
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    DW, I believe you could classify the P3DE as a CCN*. Basically, a nationally recognized three day event.



  9. #9
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    Well, I saw no reason to do a CCI or CIC * before moving up to Intermediate. I had run Mick at Prelim for many events and had tackled the toughest out there. So when I moved him up to Int, I chose one that I knew would be easy. If I didn't have an FEI as a goal, I would run him at Int, do some tough ones, and then do an "easy" Advanced. I see no reason to do an FEI as you are moving up the national levels. But the excitement of doing a CCI2* is more than moving up to Advanced. Maybe I finally want to have an audience! Bahaha!



  10. #10
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    CCI's *USED TO* mean something. To me, now all they are is extra income for the FEI. When a CCI was a full format 3-day event, it was an end-of-level goal. You ran Prelim for a season or 3-however long it took you and your horse to be successful at the level. The CCI* was the CULMINATION of your years preparing and competing at that level. Once completed, you knew you were ready to step it up to Intermediate, with the eventual goal to be a CCI**, etc. Now? What a crock. Who cares, unless you know you want to be on the track to Team and Rolex/Badminton, just run the Horse Trials and save your money.
    Proud and achy member of the Eventing Grannies clique.


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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blugal View Post
    There is a trickle-down effect too - due to budget constraints, as I started to plan my season this year, I've decided to try to get the horses schooled at home and ready to go Training the first time out, so I can do the bare minimum number of events needed to get them qualified. This will mean less support of local events - a vicious circle for our local circuit.
    I just want to point out that there are NO "horse" qualification requirements for Prelim.

    As long as the RIDER is qualified for Prelim, you can take the horse Prelim.

    A Prelim HT COULD, under the rules, be the horse's first ever recognized HT, not that I would recommend it.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahbaumgardner View Post
    Well, I saw no reason to do a CCI or CIC * before moving up to Intermediate. I had run Mick at Prelim for many events and had tackled the toughest out there. So when I moved him up to Int, I chose one that I knew would be easy. If I didn't have an FEI as a goal, I would run him at Int, do some tough ones, and then do an "easy" Advanced. I see no reason to do an FEI as you are moving up the national levels. But the excitement of doing a CCI2* is more than moving up to Advanced. Maybe I finally want to have an audience! Bahaha!
    I do understand that you do not NEED to do the FEI events to move up. And, if things go smashingly, ridiculously, fabulously well for me this year, I would probably do an intermediate before my one star. But that's my choice. And, back in the day, there were horses that were horse trial horses, but not three day horses for one reason or another (I think Moon Man may have been more of a horse trial/CIC horse...if I remember correctly, he had a very hard time pushing on past a certain minute mark at three days).

    As for CCIs not being anything anymore, I don't completely agree. While I am sad to see the demise of the long format, your horse STILL has to be more fit for a CCI than it does for a horse trial. I know there are plenty of people out there from back in the day who will say that their fitness work for three days has changed little to none. They are still long and tough. They should still be the hardest course you jump around at your level. Your horse should still be REALLY fit. Is it the same? Hell no...but it is also not the same as jumping around a national level horse trial.



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbritches View Post
    ...your horse STILL has to be more fit for a CCI than it does for a horse trial. I know there are plenty of people out there from back in the day who will say that their fitness work for three days has changed little to none. They are still long and tough. They should still be the hardest course you jump around at your level. Your horse should still be REALLY fit. Is it the same? Hell no...but it is also not the same as jumping around a national level horse trial.
    Yes, your horse does have to be more fit at the level for a CCI. However, I don't see how my conditioning schedule would be different for a CCI* than it would be for an Intermediate HT. Maybe I am missing something?

    I have contemplating foregoing FEI altogether. I have a friend who is doing just that, having completed multiple Intermediates with plans to move up to Advanced this year. His reasoning is that he does not see a reason to spend the money and support the FEI, when there is no long format. It is just not the same....



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbritches View Post
    DW, I believe you could classify the P3DE as a CCN*. Basically, a nationally recognized three day event.
    I thnk the FEI considers any USEF recognized Prelim HT as a "CCN*".
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janet View Post
    I just want to point out that there are NO "horse" qualification requirements for Prelim.

    As long as the RIDER is qualified for Prelim, you can take the horse Prelim.

    A Prelim HT COULD, under the rules, be the horse's first ever recognized HT, not that I would recommend it.
    The above is only correct for American competitors.

    Here is the rule for Canadians - CE Horse Trials Participation Policy
    Horse and rider (not necessarily as a combination) must have completed a minimum of 4 events at the Training level, achieving a CAN qualifying result at a minimum of 3 events.
    Blugal

    You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng



  16. #16
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    OK

    Quote Originally Posted by Blugal View Post
    The above is only correct for American competitors.

    Here is the rule for Canadians - CE Horse Trials Participation Policy
    Horse and rider (not necessarily as a combination) must have completed a minimum of 4 events at the Training level, achieving a CAN qualifying result at a minimum of 3 events.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janet View Post
    I thnk the FEI considers any USEF recognized Prelim HT as a "CCN*".
    HT are CNC
    Nat'l 3-days are CCN
    Blugal

    You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng



  18. #18
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    I just checked the 2013 FEI rules for Eventing, and neither "CCN" nor "CNC" are defined any more.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).


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  19. #19
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    IMO, there IS no reason to run FEI events UNLESS you (a) want to do the Rolex/team track or (b) you just have a personal lust to do it.

    For me, I won't give a single dime to FEI because I think they are a group of cronies headed by a bloody princess who seem set on rigging and kicking at the sport that put stars in my eyes as a kid. There is PLENTY for me to accomplish and work towards at the USEA level and I can't even afford that without help!!


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  20. #20
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    Thanks for all the responses! Some interesting points.

    For me personally, this a stallion and he's 14 this year (I cannot believe he's 14!). He loves eventing and had a few things worked out differently a few years ago, we would have probably made a run for making a team or Rolex.

    But at this point, I think we will concentrate on the National levels. Knock on wood, I think he can do Int late this spring and then we'll see where we go from there.

    There's not any Adv. in Area V either, though that will change in the fall with the AECs being in Tyler, so looking at long hauls either way (Adv or CCI** or above).

    I do agree with not having any desire to line the FEI's coffers!
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