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  1. #21
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    May. 4, 2003
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    It's a shame to throw out all the good with the bathwater - trial separation? With some fellows they need a good old kick in the pants before they smarten up.
    How many let the unemployment run out before being forced to job hunt - they just rely on the handout.
    Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique


    1 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
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    Apr. 15, 2010
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    Im sure there are a lot of rock stars that had jobs while pursuing their dream. I think even Lady Gaga was waiting tables.

    Something has to change, and doesn't look like it's going to be him. I'm not a big fan of ultimatums. If he doesn't change and you still don't do anything, then he really thinks he's got you. Pick a day and if nothing's changed after you've already asked him, begged, pleaded, etc, you have your answer.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #23
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    Jan. 1, 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2ndyrgal View Post
    Your response when he says "your boss doesn't pay you enough"

    "Yes dear, I know, neither does yours".


    Translation: "if you were paid properly, I would be able to pursue whatever my little heart desires no matter what it pays while you take care of all the bills."

    While there's nothing wrong with one spouse being the primary bread-winner, the ability to manage your financial obligations and plan for the future is non-negotiable.

    I'd have a hard time having any respect for a spouse who didn't pull their weight, had no desire to pull their weight, or refused to pull their weight. In your case, it doesn't sound like he's even trying.

    Tough decision...good luck.
    Fan of the Swedish Chef


    3 members found this post helpful.

  4. #24
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    Apr. 15, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alterbecause View Post
    THAT is priceless.
    Eventually they run out of steam and turn to your way of thinking. hehehe

    I don't think you need to leave per se. I mean, like divorce. Give him a good scare first (packing up and moving to your mom's) and see what happens.

    I call this 'CTJ meeting for DH'.

    Actually there are a lot of horse training stuff you can use on hubbies, but I'm sure you guys already know that.



  5. #25
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    I completely agree, BuddyRoo.

    My problem is that I'll slog on in an abhorrent situation for far too long. And I'll do it without ever truly voicing my dissent. I let it build up, and I take on more and more, until I'm so resentful I just have to get out. I've done that before, with a job.

    However, I won't fall into poverty and debt-collection and live the rest of my life like that. I watched my parents live like that and I've worked VERY hard to keep it from being my life. No matter how much I love him - if he says "I understand that we'll be poor, but I just won't get a job" I will leave.

    I need to tell him that this is how I feel (which is so very hard for me to do). And then I need to follow up on it. He pretty much shuts down once things get emotional; and I tend to bottle things up for so long that when I DO broach the subject, I get very emotional.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
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    Dec. 30, 2003
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRoo View Post
    Maybe I'm totally naive...but I just think that once you're married, there are going to be challenges and that until you kind of throw away the key and decide that you're in it for the long haul, it's kind of easy to want an out when the going gets tough. (not that the OP hasn't tried, just saying in general)

    I've had a pretty hard time and I've only been married for a year and a half.

    I think that we get so hung up on "happy" that we forget that even if we were alone, things aren't going to be rockstar all the time. It's work. Life is work. Now I'm not saying the OP or anyone else should stay miserable. Oh no. But we have so many tools now! I am a fan of tools.

    I'm the type that unless I feel like I've done everything I can, I can't give up.
    Er, she says it has been 11 years...you've been married 1.5.

    I would say she has certainly put up with/supported him for longer than most of us would.


    20 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Jul. 28, 2004
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    Texas
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    Got rid of my live in BF of 5 years for the same reason. His work ethic got smaller and smaller. It was too easy for him to live off my income. He did cooking and shopping, but still griped about it. He was an extremely talented musician as well as artist, but simply did not have the self discipline to get things done.

    Was not even as thrifty as I am, for example, wanted to eat out at restaurants, have expensive TV service, smoked cigarettes etc. I started thinking of him as a liability. He did not have health insurance, nor was I going to buy it for him. Got rid of him before I ended up having to take care of him. Glad I did.

    To me, work ethic and self discipline are basic values. I need someone else to have those traits before I can respect them. It goes pretty deep with me.
    friend of bar.ka


    10 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Go Fish View Post


    Translation: "if you were paid properly, I would be able to pursue whatever my little heart desires no matter what it pays while you take care of all the bills."

    While there's nothing wrong with one spouse being the primary bread-winner, the ability to manage your financial obligations and plan for the future is non-negotiable.

    I'd have a hard time having any respect for a spouse who didn't pull their weight, had no desire to pull their weight, or refused to pull their weight. In your case, it doesn't sound like he's even trying.

    Tough decision...good luck.
    Aw hell, when you lay it out like that, it doesn't even sound like a tough decision TO ME! LOL

    But....it is. He's a good guy. We get along very well, we're each other's best friend, we like the same movies and agree on pet-owning philosophies, etc. I mean, we've been living together in a monogamous relationship for ELEVEN YEARS, *something* about it must be right.

    This is why I've given him SO much time and room over this issue. But I feel like it's time for him to grow up a little or I'm done.



  9. #29
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    Jun. 14, 2006
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    VA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alice View Post
    Er, she says it has been 11 years...you've been married 1.5.

    I would say she has certainly put up with/supported him for longer than most of us would.
    I understand. That's why I put in my caveat with regards to not having been married long.

    I don't think anyone should put themselves in a bad situation for a long time. But I do get the feeling that communication hasn't exactly been good here. And if the OP feels like she can do better on communication, maybe there is still some hope?
    A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

    Might be a reason, never an excuse...


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #30
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    Aug. 12, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by pal-o-mino View Post
    Pack up and leave. It does wonders for encouraging a former sponge to get up and get a j-o-b. As long as you keep supporting him, he's going to keep doing what he's doing, why not? No ultimatums, no threats. Just say, I've had it, and go. Like magic, he'll be a CEO within a week. (ok, maybe not a CEO, but he'll have a real job.) Then you can decide what to do from there.

    Think of it as the 'tough love' parenting thing. You know parents that enable their kids, they just never get up and leave the nest. Same thing here. Let him figure it out and grow up.
    Yep. OP, I was in your exact same situation 18 years ago. Musician husband, with occasional day jobs that didn't last, etc...

    I got sick of pulling all the financial weight, packed up and left. Best thing I ever did, for HIM, let alone me. Not long after I left, he got a real, full-time, job, with benefits and kept it. He went back to college, earned a degree, then went to grad school. He has a really great job now and has for a long time. He's done well enough to buy himself a house and remarry a nice woman. I'm thoroughly convinced that none of that would have happened if I'd stayed...my steady job and benefits meant that he could continue to play "starving artist". He is still a musician, he didn't give it up, but it's no longer living under the illusion that it can be his main source of income.

    I'm also remarried, to a guy who pulls his weight financially and doesn't need to be nagged about it. Win/win for everyone, painful as it was all those years ago.


    18 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRoo View Post
    But I do get the feeling that communication hasn't exactly been good here. And if the OP feels like she can do better on communication, maybe there is still some hope?
    You're spot-on, Buddy. We're both kind of awful at communicating. I know I need to tell him just how frustrated I am and that it HAS to change or I will be gone because I won't live like this.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Nov. 8, 2005
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    NC
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    Couple of things. One is that before you do anything, you need to have a discussion and share information. Two ways. As you noted, you have a communication problem.

    Another is that this is 2012, four years in to the worst recession since the 70's, with no prospect that things are going to improve any time soon. Getting a job is not trivial nowadays, at any level of skill or qualification. And it is demoralizing to have so much trouble getting work that feels like, or is, underemployment. It may not just be that the reality of musical success prospects is in play, though no doubt it is. If I were in his spot, I'd be feeling pretty depressed right now.

    Finally, If you split up, how is your quality of life to improve? You will still be working full time. There will be nobody attending to the household tasks so you will have to do them, and there will be 20% less income. It doesn't cost all that much more for two people to live than one, though the circumstances you portray are not sustainable in the long run. And if indeed he has no viable employment options, putting him into a pressure cooker, financial and emotional, isn't going to increase his options. It likely will make you feel very uncomfortable.

    Most men reject the idea of counseling out of hand, reflexively. It's the norm, though unfortunately so. As long as your benefits allow you to get counseling, given how frustrated you are, you need to take advantage of that, and part of your communication with him should be that he does, too, or at least that he go to a couple sessions with you to help break your domestic communication logjam.
    If I knew what I were doing, why would I take lessons?

    "Things should be as simple as possible,
    but no simpler." - Einstein


    2 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    Dec. 19, 2008
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    I recently left my long term BF. I suggested counseling which he did not want to do but he went to one session then refused to go anymore. I stayed on and tried but it got to the point where I really felt that I did everything I could and anything more that I did was at my own detriment.

    I finally walked away from it and honestly, I feel so much better about myself for doing it. I don't have any regrets because I know I did everything I could to make it work but I couldn't do it without his help and he just wasn't willing to step up to the plate and work on it.

    In the several weeks since, I realize that I was in love with the man I'd hoped he'd become instead of the man he is today. He had these moments of grandeur where he'd be the perfect man and I'd cling to those and it would blind me to the total douche he was 99% of the time. I'd call him out on the crap he'd do and how disrespectful and unfair it was to me and he'd stop for a little while but he'd go right back to doing what he wanted after things cooled down. It was a never ending cycle with him and I'm so glad to be off that roller coaster.

    It's up to you to determine what your limits are and what you can and can't live with. You can't be the only one to effect change. He either needs to get with the program or it will stay the same. Clearly you're not happy with the status quo so I think it is time for a solid CTJ for your man. If that means you leaving, whether temporary or permanent, then so be it. Just remember, for the most part, men don't do subtle.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Nov. 23, 1999
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    South Coast Plaza
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    Not everyone can be Eddie van Halen.
    EDDIE WOULD GO


    8 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    Aug. 17, 2012
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    Alterb- here is my advice.

    First of all, are you in a position to be able to be on your own financially? Let me tell you, it's really awful coming to the decision that you want a divorce and can't afford it. Get your financials in order, get your sucks in a row. It's a good position to be in regardless of what choice you make. When financials aren't playing a part, its easier to decide.

    If you decide to stay, then your financials are in order and its that much easier to make changes and adjustments.

    If you decide to go, well then everything is in order for you to make an exit.


    On another note, what have you done to address the problem with your husband so far?



  16. #36
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    Apr. 20, 2011
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    if you get too emotional during discussions, try writing him a letter, outlining much of what you have said here. make a counseling appt, tell him when/where it is and go to it with or without him. if he won't go, knowing how close to the end of your rope you are, well, that will speak volumes to you.

    if he wants to keep you, this will be his wake up call. good luck.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  17. #37
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by DancingArabian View Post
    Alterb- here is my advice.

    First of all, are you in a position to be able to be on your own financially? Let me tell you, it's really awful coming to the decision that you want a divorce and can't afford it. Get your financials in order, get your sucks in a row. It's a good position to be in regardless of what choice you make. When financials aren't playing a part, its easier to decide.

    If you decide to stay, then your financials are in order and its that much easier to make changes and adjustments.

    If you decide to go, well then everything is in order for you to make an exit.


    On another note, what have you done to address the problem with your husband so far?
    I guess I'm not sure what financials I need to have in order. We're basically flat-a$$ broke most of the time now as it is. Aside from my monthly payday, at which point I pay bills, we generally have less than $100 to our names at any given time. I have a 401K through work, but aside from that, no savings, no IRA, etc. We have one car loan under both our names. We don't own a home or land.

    And I guess I do think I can provide for myself on my salary alone. I am a professional with a graduate degree, albeit in a poorly-paid, grant-funded, non-profit sector. I make a living wage - if we were both making what I make, we'd be perfectly fine financially.

    I have certainly felt like it was pretty darn obvious that we do not have enough money. I mean, we both CONSTANTLY complain/pine about the things we'd like to do or have but can't. I've tried to make it clear to him that I can't make more than I am right now; he, on the other hand, could greatly contribute just by getting a part-time job at a gas station. Anything, at this point, really would help.



  18. #38
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    Mar. 21, 2011
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    Is he willing to give more music lessons? Is he willing to put in the effort to drum up more business? (no pun intended) If yes perhaps the book "Guerilla Marketing" by Jay Conrad Levinson would be useful. If building a business is something he would like to do then I would reach an agreement on how long he has to get it rolling and bringing in a decent income. Set a firm date and then he either has a business, he gets a regular job or you walk.


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  19. #39
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    Dec. 28, 2012
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    I think maybe the letter idea is best. The more "serious" the discussion, the worse it goes for us, or so it seems. He clams up, I get either sad or angry, and then cry, then he walks away.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  20. #40
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    May. 21, 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanM View Post
    You might consult an attorney, and find out the implications if you divorce him. How much property will he get? Does he have a claim to your pension? I know the pension one seems silly, but years from now, if you were married a certain amount of time, and he gets a huge chunk of your pension you won't be happy.
    This.

    Talk to an attorney because it is VERY likely that you could wind up paying him spousal support if you have been supporting him. Get your ducks in a row before making any decision. I can't blame you one bit for wanting to kick him to the curb!


    5 members found this post helpful.

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