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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,514

    Default What obvious traits did the dam pass along to some of the wb stallions?

    We all know how important the dam is -- sooo - I was wondering what some of the great wb stallions' dams influence was that is maybe still evident in their produce down the line today? We all know the sire lines of these stallions, but I don't recall as much about their dams being discussed on this board --

    Such as:
    Weltmeyer
    Donnerhall
    Sandro Hit
    Cor de la Bryere
    Calypso
    Ulft
    Jazz
    Cocktail
    Ramiro
    Chagall
    Master
    Mahagoni
    Michelangelo
    Flaneur
    Habicht

    Fill in where you wish -- just thougth I'd throw out a few to get it started for a variety of registries.
    PennyG



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
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    5,514

    Default

    Hmmmm! Very interesting -- almost 100 views and no opinions or feedback on the dams that produced these famous stallions. I would have thought with all the lauding of the mares someone might have a comment and discussion. So these guys dams have not been looked at or considered by breeders for their contribution? Baffling!
    PennyG



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct. 2, 2007
    Location
    Mirabel, QC
    Posts
    2,656

    Default

    Maybe change the title? I am baffled as well that not one of our resident experts can say anything about these stallions' dams!

    I am no expert.
    www.EquusMagnificus.ca
    Breeding & Sales - Currently: Eventing & Derby prospects
    Facebook | YouTube |Twitter | LinkedIn



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov. 5, 2000
    Posts
    9,758

    Default

    I would wager that very few people on this forum have ever seen the dams of these stallions, so hard to say what traits they possessed that were passed on to their sons. Perhaps Kareen or Alexandra or Fannie Mae have seen a few and can provide their insights. Or the Holsteiner gurus like Tim or Reece, who travel to Germany fairly regularly and study damlines a lot.



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun. 24, 2005
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    3,247

    Default

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	anka 20 years.jpg 
Views:	57 
Size:	30.9 KB 
ID:	37392 Here is a photo that I found of Anka - Weltmeyer's dam. She is apparently 20 in this image.
    She is by Absatz and there are boatloads of articles about him as well and his influence on the Hanoverians. Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Absatz confor.jpg 
Views:	29 
Size:	21.4 KB 
ID:	37393

    I know its not exactly what you asked for...but it is very, very difficult to get damline info IMO. There was/is a VHS video about Weltmeyer and there is a significant amount of discussion with his breeder and the choices of stallions for Anka and then her daughter(s).

    My mom's close friend was in the same stable as Donnerwetter in Germany before he sold to Suzanne Erikson (sp?) and had some insights into possible traits (riding, behavior, personality quirks) that might come down to his descendants...but again, not the damline info you are seeking.

    ETA: I don't have my copy of the new Warmblood Breeding book by Christoph Hector handy (loaned it to a friend and am terrified I'll never see it again!!) but there may be more info about the mares in there...I can't remember as it's been about a year since I browsed through it.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,514

    Default

    Thanks, Tasker -- I appreciate your response. I know how valuable our mares are and their influence. I just wondered if the dams of these famous guys had ever been researched or credited for what they brought to the line. Seemed like an interesting discussion or something for research since these stallions still offer alot of influence.
    Cheers!
    PennyG



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default

    Flexible's dam Flex has to be one if the outstanding mares of Ireland. 3 foals and 3 international competitors. http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?0=d...session=OuDtBZ
    Kildalton Countess produced 5 top stallions in Ireland to 2 different stallions http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=728869
    Her dam Enniskeane Countess produced 2 top stallions in addition to producing one of the great dams of Ireland.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep. 29, 2006
    Posts
    424

    Default

    Jazz's damline is an interesting one as there are three shared sires with Moorlands Totilas, the Holstein Blood of Nimmerdor through Farn and Amor and the TB of Pericles.

    Lominka

    Charmante



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Farn's dam Dorette

    Kind of cheating here as I love the topic but it is hard to find dam info especially with pictures so as I find them on Sport Horse data base I am posting them...they will like be older dams and NOT modern type though but I like them best anyway.
    Farn and Roman's dam Dorette
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=40044



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Heartbreaker...Constant...Contender...Ramiro...

    *Heartbreaker's dam Bacarole
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=196688
    *Constant's dam Ella(also dam of Le Sauvage)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=375459
    interestingly, I have looked only at a small handful and already I have relation...Ella is a daughter of Dorett(dam of Farn)
    *Contender's dam Gofine(also dam of Cornetto)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=314294
    and *Gofine's dam Cita
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=8521
    *Ramiro's dam Valine
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10288166



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Cor de la Bryere...Caletto I...Landgraf I...Flemmingh...

    *Cor de la Bryere's dam Quenotte
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=282988
    *Caletto I's dam Deka(and dam of Caletto II, Caletto III, and others)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=151303
    *Landgraf I's dam Warthburg
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=178225
    *Flemmingh's dam Texas(also dam of other stallions)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=148862



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Alexandro P...Argentan I...Galoubet A...Cornet Obolensky...Benetton Dream

    *Alexandro P's dam Itilde(she is a WOW!)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10536560
    *Argentan I's dam Worms...wish Argentinius' dam were listen w/picture
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10536560
    *Galoubet A's dam Viti
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=589704
    *Cornet Obolensky's dam Rabanna van het Costersveld
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10413144
    *Benetton Dreams'dam Rotkappchen
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10520900



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Weltmeyer...Rubinstein I...Florestan I...Caretino...Contendro I

    *Weltmeyer's dam Anka
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=433433
    *Rubinstein I's dam Antine
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=203674
    *Florestan I's dam Raute
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=407537
    *Caretino's dam Isidor
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=453719
    *Contendro I's dam Bravo(and of Caretano Z and Contendro II)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=266805



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun. 16, 2007
    Posts
    1,900

    Default Lavall I...Donnerhall...Diamond Hit(and Sandro Hit and Royal Hit)...Diarado...Coriano

    *Lavall I's dam Madam(and Lavall II and Lavall III)http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=583851
    *Donnerhall's dam Ninette
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=458956
    *Diamond Hit's dam Loretta(and Royal Hit and Sandro Hit)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=731954
    *Diarado's dam Roxette I
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10450562
    *Coriano's dam Option (also to Roxette I)
    http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=79544



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov. 28, 2012
    Posts
    19

    Default

    I'm just learning about bloodlines and appreciate the information on these mares. Looking at my filly's pedigree, I notice mares with Vb. Pr. St., St. Pr., and Elite. I don't know what these predicates (if this is what they are called) indicate. I'm just curious if they reflect foal quality and/or performance.



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