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  1. #401
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    Actually Bluey, I disagree. I think that is exactly what is in the Bible and what the prophets say, but there are people who don't think of it that way, because of poor teaching.

    As I am becoming more open to understanding what is really in there, I'm pretty blown away by how badly I had misunderstood, because of misconceptions that I learned because I both had bad teachers, but also didn't understand what others were saying.

    Totally blown away!


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  2. #402
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    Feb. 28, 2001
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGrayPony View Post
    So I just want to thank LMH, in particular, for sharing what she shared.
    You are so incredibly welcome.

    Truly.

    I am just thrilled that you found the links useful.

    You really have just made my day.

    I also want to thank you for putting a perspective on the 'offensive' perspective.

    EqT-thank you for you apology. I really am not trying to be a party pooper...and it was not being dramatic. Some of your comments were really starting to freak me out. But you know that now.

    I appreciate everyone's input and glad the thread is continuing to be civil and move forward.

    Peace.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #403
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    Oct. 9, 2000
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    California
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    According to many, many of them, you would be one more heathen out there.
    Yes, I often call myself that! Although, it has not been my experience on this thread that anybody else expects me to conform to their way of thinking.

    As many others have said, religion and/or faith is a deeply personal experience. I don't believe in a God that is defined by religion. I can't say that there isn't a God, and if there is, in my mind, it is one that is accepting of all, regardless of religion, regardless of sexual orientation, regardless of race, regardless of economic class. Well, child molesters, animal abusers, rapists and murderers....not sure where those creeps fit in - I do hope they spend eternity in a dark wasteland, but I suppose that's not for me to decide.
    My Mustang Adventures - Mac, my mustang | Annwylid D'Lite - my Cob filly

    "A horse's face always conveys clearly whether it is loved by its owner or simply used." - Anja Beran


    4 members found this post helpful.

  4. #404
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    Sep. 11, 2011
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    Agree pocket pony.



  5. #405
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    Feb. 28, 2001
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    Something just occurred to me.

    Since I have been going on and on about NP, I would like to extend an open invitation to anyone interested.

    If anyone is in the north Atlanta areas (living or visiting) and is interested in seeing 'the action' live, I would be more than happy to meet you and 'escort you.'

    North Point is HUGE and can be a little intimidating if you are not used to a few thousand people gathering at once to go to church.

    A friend brought be the first time and looking back I was glad I was not navigating the waters alone.

    Heck I may just include brunch at my favorite restaurant as bait!

    Offer even extended to "heathens."

    The music and food alone should make it worthwhile even if you leave thinking Jesus followers are even scarier than you thought.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #406
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    Oct. 9, 2000
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    California
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    LMH, if I were in the area, I would take you up on your offer - alas, that is a bit too far for me to travel for an interesting church experience!
    My Mustang Adventures - Mac, my mustang | Annwylid D'Lite - my Cob filly

    "A horse's face always conveys clearly whether it is loved by its owner or simply used." - Anja Beran


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #407
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    Jan. 26, 2010
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    5,643

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    [QUOTE=OneGrayPony;6744284]
    But in listening to LMH's linked podcasts, I listened to one on prayer and realized that I've always believed in *something* which I used to call energy or "the Universe" and while contemplating how I interact with this, I realized that that is exactly the God of the Bible. Big, unknowable, omnipresent, love...

    OK, I tried just quoting a bit,and it didn't work. The quote mark plus thing gave me the whole text. Sigh.

    Anyway, I think this is it. I have listened to one of the lectures LMH gave, and except fr the accepting Jesus thing at the end, it's good sense to me. I don't believe in a God or Jesus as some supernatural being, but I am all for what you describe. I think The Force (as in Star Wars) would be more along the lines of what I'm thinking, though. Like I've said, all of this stuff is just in me, telling me all of the time I need to be a better person, try harder, do something to make a difference.



  8. #408

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pocket Pony View Post
    As someone who isn't religious, but throws out the word "God," I can give you my perspective. When I say "God" I don't start in my head with an idea of a person sitting on the clouds with a white robe and a checklist of all the people in the world who have done good deeds and bad deeds (like Santa, I guess! ).

    I use "God" interchangeably with "Universe" or "Creator" or "Cosmos" - something that is greater than anything definable but needs a name so that others know what I mean. Like I've said of my husband's horse, "God put his legs on crooked." Or when I've had an amazing meditation experience and received thoughts or messages that have helped me on my own journey, I've said "The Universe told me..." or whatever.

    To me, it is a way to define something that I feel is bigger than me that really has no explanation. It transcends religion and humanity. It is available to everyone. It is science, it is nature, it is the unexplainable, it is the explainable, it is an energy, it is an essence, it is everything and it is nothing.

    How's that for confusing?
    I don't think that is confusing at all Mostly because a lot of that is on par with my beliefs with the exception of Tao substituting for God!

    Thank you for your thoughts.

    One other thing - I believe no one has to be saved, and that no one is truly bad - we're all just learning...
    “We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be.”
    Kurt Vonnegut, Mother Night



  9. #409
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    Feb. 5, 2010
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    I think we can all agree that there are good and bad people in every organized religion, as well as good and bad people that are not religious or not a member of an organized religion. Being a member of a certain religion doesn't make you a good person, just as not being a member of that religion does not mean you are a bad person (or need to be "saved").

    I think it's interesting that people feel that so many people are prejudiced, judgmental towards them because they're Christians--you're in the majority (???). Unless you're in a more secular area, I guess, but personally I have never seen anyone judged for being a Christian. Being a Muslim, yes, absolutely. I'm not saying I don't believe you, it's just hard to wrap your head around considering Christians are in the majority (and most of the people in our government are Christian, or so they say in order to get elected).

    Like I've said before, I think religion is such a deeply personal thing. I believe every person should be free to choose any of the many religions out there, or make up their own, or not believe in any higher power. You can be a good and moral person without believing in any god. That's why religion and government should be separate--nobody's individual religious beliefs should be imposed on others, and we can make good sound moral decisions without doing so.


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  10. #410
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frizzle View Post
    I think we can all agree that there are good and bad people in every organized religion, as well as good and bad people that are not religious or not a member of an organized religion. Being a member of a certain religion doesn't make you a good person, just as not being a member of that religion does not mean you are a bad person (or need to be "saved").

    I think it's interesting that people feel that so many people are prejudiced, judgmental towards them because they're Christians--you're in the majority (???). Unless you're in a more secular area, I guess, but personally I have never seen anyone judged for being a Christian. Being a Muslim, yes, absolutely. I'm not saying I don't believe you, it's just hard to wrap your head around considering Christians are in the majority (and most of the people in our government are Christian, or so they say in order to get elected).

    Like I've said before, I think religion is such a deeply personal thing. I believe every person should be free to choose any of the many religions out there, or make up their own, or not believe in any higher power. You can be a good and moral person without believing in any god. That's why religion and government should be separate--nobody's individual religious beliefs should be imposed on others, and we can make good sound moral decisions without doing so.
    Yes, there are good and bad people in all ways we want to classify people.
    I think it is obvious that, at least the christian people I hear speak on TV, those I know in person and some right here, they reflect time and again, their clearly felt sentiment, that religious people are good and others can't possibly be if they are not religious.

    They may say they know good people are found every place, but they still show distrust on principle of anyone not declaring to be of the faithful.

    You do know how separation of church and state came to be?
    Because the first states/counties had different sects governing and they would not permit others preaching in their turf and had fights over that.
    If one, say, Baptist came thru the territory of, say, Lutherans and stopped to preach in public, there were laws against it and he was put in jail for preaching a different religion.

    Eventually, the idea of trying for a secular government was implemented, trying to curb all that fighting between sects.



  11. #411
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    Apr. 3, 2006
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    Spooner, WI
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    How about living your entire philosophical life in a closet? My dearest friends don't even know I'm atheist. I'm talking 30+ year friendships here, childhood. It would cause more trouble than it's worth. I am not a liar by nature. However, in my tiny world being an atheist can rank right up there with criminal behavior. So do you really wanna talk about persecution of Christians in THIS country?


    4 members found this post helpful.

  12. #412
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    Sep. 7, 2009
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    Exactly sunridge1, if you live in the south...well you'd better not tell your friends and neighbors if you are an atheist...actually anything BUT a Christian.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant


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  13. #413
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    Aug. 30, 2001
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    Tennessee
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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    Exactly sunridge1, if you live in the south...well you'd better not tell your friends and neighbors if you are an atheist...actually anything BUT a Christian.
    Huh? I live in the south - Nashville - and have a few friends that are atheists and everyone in our circle of friends knows this. No one cares.



  14. #414
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by onthebit View Post
    Huh? I live in the south - Nashville - and have a few friends that are atheists and everyone in our circle of friends knows this. No one cares.
    I don't think that is the South some of us live in.



  15. #415
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    Oct. 12, 2005
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    Va
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Yes, there are good and bad people in all ways we want to classify people.
    I think it is obvious that, at least the christian people I hear speak on TV, those I know in person and some right here, they reflect time and again, their clearly felt sentiment, that religious people are good and others can't possibly be if they are not religious.

    They may say they know good people are found every place, but they still show distrust

    on principle of anyone not declaring to be of the faithful.

    You do know how separation of church and state came to be?
    Because the first states/counties had different sects governing and they would not permit others preaching in their turf and had fights over that.
    If one, say, Baptist came thru the territory of, say, Lutherans and stopped to preach in public, there were laws against it and he was put in jail for preaching a different religion.

    Eventually, the idea of trying for a secular government was implemented, trying to curb all that fighting between sects.

    Half a century or so ago, we were taught in history class that it was due to the church of England, which was why so many English people crossed the ocean so they could freely practice their religion in America.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  16. #416
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by minnie View Post
    Half a century or so ago, we were taught in history class that it was due to the church of England, which was why so many English people crossed the ocean so they could freely practice their religion in America.

    Where I grew up, born right after WWII, history books stopped at WWI.

    You can read the debates between, I think Jefferson and Madison, about separation of church and state.
    It is all there.



  17. #417
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    Apr. 3, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by onthebit View Post
    Huh? I live in the south - Nashville - and have a few friends that are atheists and everyone in our circle of friends knows this. No one cares.
    City versus rural. Vast difference.



  18. #418
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    Feb. 28, 2001
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    A fun little diversion...2 years ago the North Point 'iBand' did a Christmas Song series that went 'viral.'

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9XNfWNooz4

    They did all the music on borrowed iPhones and iPads.

    It was simply brilliant!


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  19. #419
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    Aug. 30, 2001
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunridge1 View Post
    City versus rural. Vast difference.
    Actually my farm is a little over an hour south of Nashville in a very rural area - Giles County - but I didn't think anyone would know where that was so I used Nashville.



  20. #420
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    Sep. 7, 2009
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    Lexington, KY
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    Quote Originally Posted by onthebit View Post
    Huh? I live in the south - Nashville - and have a few friends that are atheists and everyone in our circle of friends knows this. No one cares.
    Let me rephrase that, in the south and not in a city.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant



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