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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan. 28, 2003
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    Hollywood, but not the one where they have the Oscars!
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    7,639

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    Quote Originally Posted by rodawn View Post
    Well, this is going to be a very unpopular post, but I have to admit, being Canadian, I'm a bit frustrated and I descended from American roots just 1 generation removed. The definition of INSANITY is continuing the same behaviour and expecting a different outcome. There have been 61 mass shootings in the USA since 1989. All with assault weapons, most of which were obtained legally.

    I get that a person might need a hand gun for personal protection and I'm okay with that. I get that you might need a hunting rifle to hunt food and use for protection I definitely get that. But no person in their right minds needs multiple assault rifles with the capability of shooting hundreds of rounds in a matter of minutes. Don't get me wrong. I grew up in a hunting family. I also grew up in and still have an active military family. We have guns for hunting. But seriously, assault rifles?? Come on. The only people who need those are military and police. You ask any military or police officer - a person getting assault rifles is getting one for the specific purpose of using it to kill another human being, whether it's deemed "self-defense" or not. When does the value of human life take precedence over the mere right to bear arms? Where is your right to bear arms protecting people in shopping malls and schools? Really what's needed is more police services and stricter regulations when it comes to who can get these guns because be assured you don't want a mentally unstable person getting a gun and yet the unstable do have plenty of access, don't they? And greater, much greater, mental health services.

    FWIW - a hand gun quite efficiently does the trick when it comes to personal protection. Get yourself trained in how to use one inside-out and backwards and upside down. Learn how to keep said gun from forcibly being removed from your grasp by an assailant (because many stats show that many times a shooting victim's own gun was used against them). It only takes 1 well-placed bullet to protect yourself. I know this because I'm trained...and I don't miss. All of us kids were trained. You don't need to send out a hail of a hundred bullets from a gun whose clip holds a 100 rounds and takes literally 2 seconds to change said clip to a fresh one. A gun capable of shooting 100 rounds a minute is for mass destruction. It's purpose to send a flail of bullets to mow down as many people at once as possible. And if the need for war takes place, you can be assured, your military has more than enough weapons to outfit all who choose to participate in protection of Home and Country and the means for fast-track training of civilians in the use of same. Good grief, even Canada has that means available, so surely a military as advanced as the USA must!

    This...exactly!!!!!!!!!
    "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
    carolprudm


    5 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Aug. 24, 2000
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    959

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    Well gosh, the people who already own ALL the rifles are selling theirs:

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1222722

    Seems that the California Teachers Association became irritated that their pensions were invested in not only the guns but the very bullets that pierced the first graders. They may not have understood that the arms manufacturing conglomerate assembled by their fund manager Cerberus, and so aptly named the Freedom Group, was not child-safe.
    And interestingly it seems that the father of the founder Cerberus Capital Management lives in Newtown. Bet he's the most popular guy on his block today.



  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jul. 2, 1999
    Posts
    17,599

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    Quote Originally Posted by nutmeg View Post
    And interestingly it seems that the father of the founder Cerberus Capital Management lives in Newtown. Bet he's the most popular guy on his block today.
    Another awkward weapons connection being that Kahr Arms owns and manufactures the classic "Tommy Gun". That is effectively an arm of The Unification Church (aka the late Rev. Sun Myung Moon) ... religion and weapons.



  4. #24
    Join Date
    Nov. 2, 2001
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    Packing my bags
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    33,609

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glimmerglass View Post
    Another awkward weapons connection being that Kahr Arms owns and manufactures the classic "Tommy Gun". That is effectively an arm of The Unification Church (aka the late Rev. Sun Myung Moon) ... religion and weapons.

    why not?
    Missionizing via sword has always been a popular means....
    Quote Originally Posted by Bristol Bay View Post
    Try setting your broomstick to fly at a lower altitude.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
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    43,107

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    Quote Originally Posted by rodawn View Post
    Well, this is going to be a very unpopular post, but I have to admit, being Canadian, I'm a bit frustrated and I descended from American roots just 1 generation removed. The definition of INSANITY is continuing the same behaviour and expecting a different outcome. There have been 61 mass shootings in the USA since 1989. All with assault weapons, most of which were obtained legally.

    I get that a person might need a hand gun for personal protection and I'm okay with that. I get that you might need a hunting rifle to hunt food and use for protection I definitely get that. But no person in their right minds needs multiple assault rifles with the capability of shooting hundreds of rounds in a matter of minutes. Don't get me wrong. I grew up in a hunting family. I also grew up in and still have an active military family. We have guns for hunting. But seriously, assault rifles?? Come on. The only people who need those are military and police. You ask any military or police officer - a person getting assault rifles is getting one for the specific purpose of using it to kill another human being, whether it's deemed "self-defense" or not. When does the value of human life take precedence over the mere right to bear arms? Where is your right to bear arms protecting people in shopping malls and schools? Really what's needed is more police services and stricter regulations when it comes to who can get these guns because be assured you don't want a mentally unstable person getting a gun and yet the unstable do have plenty of access, don't they? And greater, much greater, mental health services.

    FWIW - a hand gun quite efficiently does the trick when it comes to personal protection. Get yourself trained in how to use one inside-out and backwards and upside down. Learn how to keep said gun from forcibly being removed from your grasp by an assailant (because many stats show that many times a shooting victim's own gun was used against them). It only takes 1 well-placed bullet to protect yourself. I know this because I'm trained...and I don't miss. All of us kids were trained. You don't need to send out a hail of a hundred bullets from a gun whose clip holds a 100 rounds and takes literally 2 seconds to change said clip to a fresh one. A gun capable of shooting 100 rounds a minute is for mass destruction. It's purpose to send a flail of bullets to mow down as many people at once as possible. And if the need for war takes place, you can be assured, your military has more than enough weapons to outfit all who choose to participate in protection of Home and Country and the means for fast-track training of civilians in the use of same. Good grief, even Canada has that means available, so surely a military as advanced as the USA must!
    As long as all you see, as intended by the propaganda out there, those very good varmint guns as "horrible assault weapons!", you will continue not understanding the issues, just knee jerk responding as the anti gun groups want you to think.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    May. 9, 2005
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    Chattanooga, Tennessee
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    3,604

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    Well said bluey. I am a shooter. I shoot competively and recreationally, I own multiple handguns, rifles (from bolt guns to semi automatic rifles) and carbines. I do not hunt. I enjoy shooting as a sport. And I also will protect my family if necessary. As one who HAS had a gun to my head, and been involved in several armed robberies, I carry religiously. My daughter shoots. She also knows how to use a knife for protection.

    Stricter regulations merely keep things from the hands of those who ABIDE regulations. It will never stop those who wish to commit a heinous crime. We can protect our money from robbers with weapons, but we can't protect our children and families with the same tools? When a person decides to commit the most heinous crime, the taking of another's life in hate, anger or in any way, they will acquire whatthey want to do it. Be it a knife, a firearm, a bomb, a vehicle. It won't change that.


    12 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Mar. 14, 2010
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    Earlysville, Virginia
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    3,268

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    I didnt go out and buy one, but my father owns a few. My ex's grandfather (retired CIA weapons expert) owns quite a few. All are stored safely and locked up. They are only brought out for target shooting, and I find them the most fun to shoot. (I shoot one round at a time).

    Dicks sporting goods pulled all of their assault rifles AND the paintball guns that look like them. I think it's ridiculous. I enjoy my guns, and I also have them for hunting and self defense. I absolutely deserve the right to defend myself with any of my guns should someone threaten my life.
    Charlie Brown (1994 bay TB X gelding)
    White Star (2004 grey TB gelding)

    Mystical Moment, 1977-2010.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Sep. 4, 2006
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    Somewhere in the Southwest
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    Quote Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post
    Resale value and to be frank, there are a lot of people who do go into gun shops, buy guns at discount or they buy as many as legally allowed within the laws and buying period if applicable, and resell them to anyone with cash. I know people who make significant amounts of money doing that on the side and it's all cash and untraceable.
    Then you should repor them to the ATF (loathe as I am to suggest that). It's a felony to buy with the intent to resell for profit without an FFL.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    Apr. 25, 2011
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    856

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    Nope, I'm secure.
    Last edited by happymom; Dec. 18, 2012 at 09:43 PM.



  10. #30
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    Hollowed out volcano in the South Pacific.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dressurpferd01 View Post
    Then you should repor them to the ATF (loathe as I am to suggest that). It's a felony to buy with the intent to resell for profit without an FFL.
    Here in VA private sales between VA citizens are legal and off-the-record - with exceptions - though it is recommended - well asked is more like it - by the state government that all firearms sales be done through an FFL dealer, though many people don't and won't on principle. Any sales to non-VA citizens, by law, have to go through the dealers. Almost any VA citizen - within the boundaries of the law and code - can sell a few guns a week or month for cash and not meet the legal requirements for getting the ATF to probe their anus or to get any minding from state and local law enforcement. If they are knowingly selling to criminals or those who are forbidden by law to purchase and own - which is difficult to prove in court without specific and very conclusive evidence and why the licensed dealers are recommended for private sales - then they would be in trouble, but there has to be concrete proof of that before ATF will ever get involved, which means local law enforcement has to be interested to begin with and they pretty much want the same thing before tackling anything relating to gun sellers in VA with the politics here being what they are. It's easier for them to just go after the gangs who they know are doing it to begin with and can be arrested on any number of charges than to chase down private citizens doing shady deals.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!


    3 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    I get a bad rating for stating the law and how it works? Really? Shame on you!
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!


    6 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Feb. 6, 2007
    Posts
    3,252

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    nope, boyfriend already has an AK, a legal one read SEMI AUTOMATIC. Not capable of shooting hundred of bullets in a minute. Which are already ILLEGAL for the average citizen to own in this country, the USA.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    Jun. 7, 2009
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    189

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    Yes, actually, I did. I bought a 9mm carbine and an AR 15 this morning. And 9 boxes of ammo for each. We are going to the range on Thursday.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Sep. 4, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post
    Here in VA private sales between VA citizens are legal and off-the-record - with exceptions - though it is recommended - well asked is more like it - by the state government that all firearms sales be done through an FFL dealer, though many people don't and won't on principle. Any sales to non-VA citizens, by law, have to go through the dealers. Almost any VA citizen - within the boundaries of the law and code - can sell a few guns a week or month for cash and not meet the legal requirements for getting the ATF to probe their anus or to get any minding from state and local law enforcement. If they are knowingly selling to criminals or those who are forbidden by law to purchase and own - which is difficult to prove in court without specific and very conclusive evidence and why the licensed dealers are recommended for private sales - then they would be in trouble, but there has to be concrete proof of that before ATF will ever get involved, which means local law enforcement has to be interested to begin with and they pretty much want the same thing before tackling anything relating to gun sellers in VA with the politics here being what they are. It's easier for them to just go after the gangs who they know are doing it to begin with and can be arrested on any number of charges than to chase down private citizens doing shady deals.
    That's great, and you're right on almost all counts, but you're first post referred to people buying and then reselling for profit which IS a federal felony...dealing without a license.

    ETA: I did not downvote your post.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by dressurpferd01 View Post
    That's great, and you're right on almost all counts, but you're first post referred to people buying and then reselling for profit which IS a federal felony...dealing without a license.

    ETA: I did not downvote your post.
    I know you didn't downvote my post. However, the "occasional" clause in the federal code - which also exists at the state level - is what keeps private resales going and you have to reach a certain - though undefined by code as anything other than wholesale - number of firearms sales on a regular basis, be dealing in illegal or illegally modified weapons, or you have to be dealing directly to known criminals to meet the ATF criteria for "unlicensed dealer" and "selling for profit" that puts one on their radar. The people I'm talking about who do engage in those sales will usually buy a gun or two from the local dealers or preferably whatever they can get from another private seller in VA who might be clearing out their collection or an estate sale or pawn shop or whatever other avenues are open to them, hold on to it for a bit and maybe fix it up if needed, and then resell it to another VA citizen - probably a first-time owner or a collector - for some profit , which is how many gun owners do their business here. All more or less legal by law, regardless of "intent" or "profitability", and the ATF won't get involved. I personally do not like it and have never bought anything from a private seller, but I do know that many locals have no issue with it and buy as they please.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!



  16. #36
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    Sep. 7, 2009
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    Lexington, KY
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glimmerglass View Post
    Well I couldn't buy one even if I wanted to do so.

    Chicago has the strictest ban on gun possession in the US. We're not talking concealed handguns - let alone assault weapons (banned since 1992) - but just the process of seeking a formal, legal and authorized purchase of a gun.

    So with all of this control over the legal sale, possession and use you'd think this city is safe. We're on track to have over 500 deaths this year from guns. Every weekend - every one! - there are at least a half dozen people shot.

    Very simple examples just for the City of Chicago in the last four months:

    Dec 3, 2012: "8 Killed, At Least 30 Wounded In Weekend Violence"

    Sep 17, 2012: "At Least 6 Killed, 23 Wounded In Weekend Gun Violence"

    Aug 31, 2012: At Least 6 Killed, 23 Wounded In Weekend Gun Violece "

    Aug 20, 2012: "6 Dead, 36 Wounded In Weekend Gun Violence"

    The point being that gun control is meaningless when illegal weapons are everywhere. At least in Chicago folks aren't being shot by the $600 Walther PPKs bought legally a gun shop by registered owner.
    And Chicago has secure borders so no one can bring one in from outside Chicago right?
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant


    2 members found this post helpful.

  17. #37
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    They have those really cool tunnels under the city. I'm pretty sure one could use those for some smuggling or hiding stuff.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have, at this moment, been thrown up from below!



  18. #38
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    Sep. 4, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post
    I know you didn't downvote my post. However, the "occasional" clause in the federal code - which also exists at the state level - is what keeps private resales going and you have to reach a certain - though undefined by code as anything other than wholesale - number of firearms sales on a regular basis, be dealing in illegal or illegally modified weapons, or you have to be dealing directly to known criminals to meet the ATF criteria for "unlicensed dealer" and "selling for profit" that puts one on their radar. The people I'm talking about who do engage in those sales will usually buy a gun or two from the local dealers or preferably whatever they can get from another private seller in VA who might be clearing out their collection or an estate sale or pawn shop or whatever other avenues are open to them, hold on to it for a bit and maybe fix it up if needed, and then resell it to another VA citizen - probably a first-time owner or a collector - for some profit , which is how many gun owners do their business here. All more or less legal by law, regardless of "intent" or "profitability", and the ATF won't get involved. I personally do not like it and have never bought anything from a private seller, but I do know that many locals have no issue with it and buy as they please.
    Fair enough, and completely legit points. Still not an area I'd be comfortable playing in, but that's just me. I also don't have a habit of selling guns that I've bought.



  19. #39
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    The sheriff here is my closest neighbor, lives 3 1/2 miles away.
    He is the one that insisted I get a CHL, he taught me how to handle and shoot it, I went thru his classes, he is the one that certifies people after the classes.
    The gun I used for that is a gun he found for me.
    He always said that educated, armed citizens helps so much more than any problems such may bring.
    He is the one I asked what to use on our newly invading feral hogs and he recommended an AR 15 as the best gun for me to control them.
    I didn't know their histories or any controversy about those guns.
    He didn't call it an assault rifle, but a very good varmint, hog rifle.
    That is why I bought and use one, it is a tool for a job.
    Others have other uses for them, legal, responsible uses, millions for what I hear.
    Compare that with the very rare, few times someone used those for mass killings.

    Do anyone think that LEOs would not be the first ones interested in getting guns out of circulation, if that made sense, not encouraging people to learn about them and be armed?

    That criminals illegally use guns for crime, that crazy individuals occasionally use guns for whatever crazy idea they got and to say "if we ban guns, that would not happen" is a cop-out.

    We know criminals will keep doing illegal things, guns or not and mostly still with guns.
    The same with crazy people, they will find somewhere, something to kill people and probably that will be guns too, ban or not.

    The way I see it, to find better ways to control illegal gun use is where we should go, not ban guns.

    The cry of the anti gun agenda, no matter how much they want to say they "only" want to protect people, "some" guns are ok, their actions are showing us they are pushing a ban all guns eventually agenda.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Jul. 29, 2004
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    Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by mroades View Post
    that you did not run out and buy an assault rifle right after this shooting????? If you did....seriously???????
    And what if I did tell you I did, what then?? Or, if I told you I didn't because I already have what I want. And you are right; I don't need one but I want one because they are fun to shoot. None of mine (if I have any) have magazines that hold more than 30 rounds but reloading is not that difficult.

    Yup, poking the bear....


    4 members found this post helpful.

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