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  1. #1
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    Default Posts about guns and gun control....

    I'm not claiming for or against gun control... But I don't think people need assault weapons in their homes...

    Here is a story I heard years ago...

    President Reagan was going to visit a town out west. Don't remember town or state. But Secret Service go in couple days early to check the town out.. Every truck driving down the street has a rifle rack in back window and a rifle or two. The Secret Service is "WE CAN'T BRING HIM HERE, IT'S TOO DANGEROUS". The mayors reply, "It's not the guns you see you need to worry about, it's the one's you don't see" Reagan appeared there and everything was fine.
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by grandprixjump View Post
    I'm not claiming for or against gun control... But I don't think people need assault weapons in their homes...

    Here is a story I heard years ago...

    President Reagan was going to visit a town out west. Don't remember town or state. But Secret Service go in couple days early to check the town out.. Every truck driving down the street has a rifle rack in back window and a rifle or two. The Secret Service is "WE CAN'T BRING HIM HERE, IT'S TOO DANGEROUS". The mayors reply, "It's not the guns you see you need to worry about, it's the one's you don't see" Reagan appeared there and everything was fine.
    The first part of your sentence directly contradicts the second part. You can't say, "I'm not for or against gun control, but law abiding citizens shouldn't be allowed to own a certain, hugely popular, class of firearms". Sorry, the second part of your original statement outed you as an anti-gun advocate.


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  3. #3
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    I'm not anti-gun. I own one. I AM anti military assault weapon owned by Joe Q. Public. Sorry, but no one outside of active military or police needs to own an assault rifle. NO ONE.
    Not all who wander are lost.

    Ralando II


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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinsella View Post
    I'm not anti-gun. I own one. I AM anti military assault weapon owned by Joe Q. Public. Sorry, but no one outside of active military or police needs to own an assault rifle. NO ONE.
    You don't seem to understand the differences that make an "assault rifle"

    Post what features make a weapon an "assault rifle"


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  5. #5
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    It must be an individual weapon with provision to fire from the shoulder (i.e. a buttstock);
    It must be capable of selective fire;
    It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard rifle or battle rifle;
    Its ammunition must be supplied from a detachable magazine rather than a feed-belt.
    And it should at least have a firing range of 300 meters (1000 feet)

    And before you ask: assault weapon features:

    Detachable magazines
    Collapsible stocks allow for a rifle to be fitted to the user without requiring having the firearm customized to the shape of the individual.
    Folding stocks
    Pistol grips reduce the angle (and thus rotational strain) of the wrist, add to control of the firearm during recoil, and are popular with physically impaired shooters who cannot hold a stock with a more traditional angle.
    Bayonet mounts are often on civilian firearms due to the same parts being used on both government and civilian rifles
    Flash suppressors shield the shooter's vision, as well as those beside or behind the user.
    Threaded barrels mount flash suppressors, compensators and muzzle brakes (both used for aiding recoil management for recoil-sensitive shooters).
    Barrel mounted grenade launcher mounts are concentric rings around the muzzle.
    A barrel shroud is a tube around the barrel designed to limit transfer of heat from the barrel to the supporting hand, or to protect from accidental contact.
    Magazines greater than 10 rounds
    Semi-automatic, functionality meaning that they can eject spent shell casings and chamber the next round without additional human action, but (as opposed to automatic firearms) only one round is fired per pull of the trigger.[4] "Semi-automatic" is often confusingly abbreviated as "automatic" or "auto" in firearm descriptions.

    I know hard core gun folks don't like the term "assault weapon", but really, why does Joe Q. Public need either of those?
    Not all who wander are lost.

    Ralando II


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  6. #6
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    OK, here's where I stand on this. We own guns, I support gun ownership, whether it is an assault style or not.

    On assault/non assault: My husband owns a semi-auto 12 gauge with a 5 round magazine. He hunts with it. It is technically an assault style shotgun, but really, what makes it any more dangerous than any other shotgun or rifle? The fact that it can hold more rounds without reloading? Maybe. But if that is the main issue/danger, well, the "bad guy" shooting up a building could just as easily carry multiple firearms, shoot one till it's empty, then drop it and pick up the next loaded one. Still firing a large amount of rounds quickly, whether it's from one gun with a magazine, or several different guns.

    On private ownership in general....I know that there are lots of varying interperatations on the 2nd ammendment, so I won't even go there, however I think it should at least be taken into consideration. But in the grand scheme of things, yeah, I think that people should be allowed to own firearms. I think that, like many other things (weed, fully auto guns, slim jims, you name it), if you outlaw guns, the "bad guys" will still get them; sure, it might make it harder, but it wont stop them. They'll continue to go through the black market, stealing, whatever, but the general Joe Blow law abiding citizen will no longer have access to them. I want to be on an equal playing field with the criminal, not at a disadvantage. If someone breaks into my house with a gun, I want to be able to defend myself, not have to say "Oh, hold on Mister, I don't have a gun, so let me call the cops so they can come save me".

    I also feel that even if guns were taken away, that doesn't take the evil out of the world. The psychopaths will still kill, no matter what weapon they use. Do we also outlaw knives, axes, cables, chains, chemicals, etc that could be used as mass weapons?

    I am heartbroken for all the victims and families from the shootings, please don't think that I am minimizing the horror of those situations. I just don't think that taking our guns away is the right answer.
    Last edited by talkofthetown; Dec. 17, 2012 at 01:53 PM.
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  7. #7
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    Like the above poster, my XH has an "assault shotgun". It was a normal shotgun for many years -- never killed a single person. XH purchased a different stock for it and now it's an assault shotgun -- and STILL hasn't killed anyone. XH is a paramedic/firefighter and former military.

    XBIL is a gun collector (though just starting really). He did 2 tours in the sandbox and was recently discharged from active duty, though still in the reserves. He has an AR-15 (civilian equivalent of an M-16) and it's a BLAST to shoot!! (no pun intended) It too has never killed a single person.

    I only have 2 guns at my house right now, neither are "assault" weapons, though the 9mm handgun can fire semi-automatic. Neither have killed a single human being (though both have done in pests and predators around the farm... and even helped end suffering).

    The weapons themselves are NOT the problem... or even one of the problems. 22 kids in China last week ended up in the hospital, many in critical condition, after an armed assailant attacked them IN SCHOOL with a knife. I do not know if any have since died, but this attack comes AFTER China passed some sales restrictions on large knives following several attacks in 2010. Knives... guns... rocks.... if a mentally ill person is intent on doing harm they'll find a way. Taking guns away from law abiding citizens does nothing to take away the guns from criminals.

    Start teaching children the value of hard work... the value of friendship and community... the value of life (not in a "pro-life" kind of way but in general). Start diminishing the value of 15 Minutes of Fame and instead build up not only the value of being independent and self-sufficient, but the value of knowing when you NEED help and how to get it .... then maybe society will actually get somewhere.
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  8. #8
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    Kinsella ... your internet search skills are good. Understand, Every feature you've listed could apply to very ordinary rifles ... Except one .."It must be capable of selective fire;"

    Weapons with this feature are NOT available to any "Joe Q. Public"

    To the rest of this forum.. a selective fire weapon means a full automatic weapon. ie a machine gun. a weapon that will fire continuously when the trigger is applied. A M-16 issued to our soldiers is a true Assault rifle. The cartridge it fires has less power and range than most deer rifles.

    Assault rifle properly describes only this type of weapon. Assault STYLE means it LOOKS similar. In the public discussions the word Assault is used to confuse and misdirect negative opinion to any weapon.

    I object to your use of "assault rifle" to conflate the issue of legal weapons and machine guns.


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  9. #9
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    To simplify, a fully automatic weapon continues to fire as long as you hold your finger on the trigger. A semi-automatic weapon fires once for each trigger pull, therefore you must pull the trigger for each discharge. I believe that fully automatic weapons are banned, but unfortunately, I am sure parts can be obtained to convert a semi-auto into a fully auto.

    If we need a ban it should be on Ninja/warrior type games and movies that these kids are playing and watching that glorify death and killing. What are we telling these children, people? FWIW, I have my CCDW and have been considering getting a personal handgun. After this senseless tragedy, I am even more compelled to do so and become proficient in it's use. My husband is retired law enforcement and we periodically go to the range. If the Principal (God rest her and a true hero) had had a handgun and was trained to use it perhaps some of those dear children would still be here for Christmas.
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  10. #10
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    There is already a ban on assault weapons.


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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maude View Post
    If the Principal (God rest her and a true hero) had had a handgun and was trained to use it perhaps some of those dear children would still be here for Christmas.
    I always have similar thoughts, like teachers in schools, the people in the theater at the "batman" shooting, etc. But guns aren't allowed in schools. And they were not allowed in that theater. How much of an outrage would it cause for the more anti-gun crowd, if we suggested allowing teachers to possess guns at school?
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maude View Post
    To simplify, a fully automatic weapon continues to fire as long as you hold your finger on the trigger. A semi-automatic weapon fires once for each trigger pull, therefore you must pull the trigger for each discharge. I believe that fully automatic weapons are banned, but unfortunately, I am sure parts can be obtained to convert a semi-auto into a fully auto.
    Parts to convert a semi-auto to full auto fire are illegal. Current assault style rifles can't be converted to full auto without a machine shop. The parts don't drop in. Of course, with a proper machine shop almost any weapon can be made... including a battle tank with cannon


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  13. #13
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    Hoss, My husband and I have had discussions on semi vs. full auto weapons. I understood him to indicate that parts could be machined to make a semi into a full as you indicated. Thanks for clarifying this.
    "You post all your drama on Facebook and get mad when people judge you? You're a special kind of stupid, aren't you?"



  14. #14
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    Talkofthetown, You are right. The anti-firearm folks would be upset if guns were allowed in schools. I wonder though how many would be voicing that viewpoint if lives had been saved last Friday. Just wondering, that's all. Of course I am only saying that only the trained and qualified would be permitted to carry.
    "You post all your drama on Facebook and get mad when people judge you? You're a special kind of stupid, aren't you?"


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  15. #15
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    And in our crazy world, if the principal had a firearm in the school and had killed the shooter, you know that now she would be facing charges.


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  16. #16
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    You can get any law passed that you want right now, and it won't matter to amount to anything in changing things. No law will be passed that makes people turn in guns they already have, or not grandfather others that might have some future sales banned. There are already more guns than people. The last "assault weapon" ban served little purpose other than to appease the ignorant.

    We own AR-15s, and it's the gun I recommend a lot of time to single women who live alone on a farm. Yes, it looks badass, but in reality it's no more of a badass than guns you can go to Walmart and buy or order. It is easier to handle and fire. Simply looking badass will send the bad guys the other way more often than stand and shoot. AR-15s are not selective fire without some (mostly) illegal tampering with.

    I would bet that sales of 30 and 50 rounds clips bit some sort of high this past weekend because some idiots thought that they might not get to buy them again some time in the future.

    I'm all for making buying one more strict, including getting rid of the show loophole, but I'm perfectly comfortable knowing that all the people I know who own AR-15s have them.

    If you live in the country where a 911 call might get a response, if you are lucky, in 45 minutes, 911 better be a part of your gun safe combination if you need to dial 911. And yes, we have confronted armed people coming here looking for trouble. They found it.


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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by talkofthetown View Post
    I always have similar thoughts, like teachers in schools, the people in the theater at the "batman" shooting, etc. But guns aren't allowed in schools. And they were not allowed in that theater. How much of an outrage would it cause for the more anti-gun crowd, if we suggested allowing teachers to possess guns at school?
    There is a school in texas who has done just that. Their law enforecement branch is 22 minutes away.
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  18. #18
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    There are quite a few documented cases where armed legal citizens have stopped crimes before they started or ended them before they got any worse. http://radio.woai.com/cc-common/main...ticle=10644119
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom King View Post
    ...

    I would bet that sales of 30 and 50 rounds clips bit some sort of high this past weekend because some idiots thought that they might not get to buy them again some time in the future.
    Tom .. thank for your post... I disagree with your idiot characterization of folks buying high capacity magazines though. They have been vindicated in history. 1994 comes to mind.


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  20. #20
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    My personal favorite: 12yo GIRL uses family gun to stop home invaders. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_1992381.html
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