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  1. #81
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    As happy as returning to riding has made me during the past couple of years, this is such a reawakening as to the kinds out there, who you're rubbing shoulders with, who don't think like you do.

    GW is beautiful, OGP. So glad he is in a good place. The whole thing just turns my stomach. Horse trainers, who probably were little girls and boys who loved them, and now can't figure out how to really take care of who they have benefitted from. Apparently get numb to getting personal with their horses unless they are raised up high by them. Why, oh why, can't they simply put them down in lieu of sending them off to auction? (And why didn't your buyer honor the contract?!?) Trainers who do this are not facing who they really are when they really just send them directly to the sale. Some foolishness that maybe some little girl will find them a home? There should be pictures of kill buyers plastering the office walls of these trainers, so that they look outside in their pastures and think twice.

    There but for the grace of God, though. I do not see myself, in my current situation, being able to keep mine forever, as much as I would like to. And then where eventually?

    The "common thread" that should be in the back of most of our minds.

    What a thread.
    Last edited by CVPeg; Dec. 14, 2012 at 12:21 PM.
    Being right half the time beats being half-right all the time. Malcolm Forbes


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  2. #82
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    Oct. 15, 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGrayPony View Post
    And THIS is what he looked like when he was rehomed to Lisa. http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/11687104.jpg

    I'll let the OP decide if she wants to share any more images of him now. I want to respect her privacy, as she has done a wonderful wonderful thing.
    Wow, he is a pretty boy. It's sad that any of them wind up at auction, but downright scary when it's one that's as nice as Great Warrior. Glad for the OGP and GW that the OP was in the right place at the right time!!
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05



  3. #83
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    Dec. 2, 2009
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    Should we assume that his condition deteriorated while he was at Lisa's, so that he didn't look like much when she made the "trade"?
    This piece doesn't make any sense to me either. I got a picture from Lisa in the beginning of October that shows him looking just as amazing, with blue ribbons dangling from his bridle. I'd post it, but it includes her face, which I'd prefer not to share. It came from a professional photographer's website, and included the date of the event, so I'm fairly sure that it's legit. Now true, it's only a head/neck shot, but he tends to lose his topline very quickly, and it was the last thing to get built. It appeared that the work that he did under Lisa was making him even more valuable.

    He did WTC, lead changes, and jumped in great form. He is a little arthritic and creaky, a forward (but not crazy) ride, and had no...I mean ZERO...stop in him. He needed hock injections in his right hind, and he could get a little stifley, particularly if he wasn't turned out, but...he was one of the best, least complicated horses I've ever thrown a leg over, even when he was slightly green and I've thrown a leg over some NICE horses. I've also ridden a lot of not so nice ones over the last 10 years, and he's not one of them.

    He didn't want to be messed with, so you had to stay out of his face, and not goose him (very sensitive) but I taught my husband (a rank beginner) how to post the trot on him - he is that quiet. He's a little different out foxhunting, as a few who have met him can testify to, and needs a more confident rider in a field galloping with a ton of other horses, but he LOVES it. He is BOLD BOLD BOLD. He saved my butt when I landed on his neck after he overjumped something in the field, and the two years I had him I never came off. And that includes riding in 19 degree days on frozen footing with me being stiff as a board.

    That's why the Margo piece just doesn't make any sense. It just doesn't. This isn't a worthless horse. I didn't rehome him because he sucked, I rehomed him because I was giving up horses entirely. I'd say that it was because he didn't fit in with the other high value horses on her site, but she has one for sale for less than $5k right now posted on Facebook, so...?



  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by CVPeg View Post
    The whole thing just turns my stomach. Horse trainers, who probably were little girls and boys who loved them, and now can't figure out how to really take care of who they have benefitted from. Apparently get numb to getting personal with their horses unless they are raised up high by them. Why, oh why, can't they simply put them down in lieu of sending them off to auction? They are not facing who they really are when they really just send them directly to the sale. Some foolishness that maybe some little girl will find them a home? There should be pictures of kill buyers plastering the office walls of these trainers, so that they look outside in their pastures and think twice.
    It's the old pets vs. livestock argument regarding horses.
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05


    3 members found this post helpful.

  5. #85
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    I'd say that it does, except that this one doesn't make any financial sense. Even looking at it objectively, why throw away what you could make a bit more cash on?

    Unless there was some urgent need for money.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #86
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    Jun. 14, 2006
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    I know it's not right to judge, but my gut says Margo is a horse trading snake who doesn't give a damn about the horses or the people she hurts. It's all business. And not even good business. Because the horse world is a small place. Someone, somewhere is going to figure out who Margo is IRL, and when they do, the gossip will go wild and (hopefully?) Margo won't get away with it again.
    A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

    Might be a reason, never an excuse...


    5 members found this post helpful.

  7. #87
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    Mar. 6, 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGrayPony View Post
    That's why the Margo piece just doesn't make any sense. It just doesn't. This isn't a worthless horse. I didn't rehome him because he sucked, I rehomed him because I was giving up horses entirely. I'd say that it was because he didn't fit in with the other high value horses on her site, but she has one for sale for less than $5k right now posted on Facebook, so...?
    Maybe she hadn't done his hocks, or he was "stifley" as you mentioned, and looked off?

    I'm wondering why she didn't just contact you after her horse died and ask if you wanted to BUY him back, as you've made clear you would have done. If she was so interested in having the money to buy a new horse, I'd think that would have gotten her farther (still duped on the lame mid-5-figure horse, though) anyway.
    What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what
    lies with in us. - Emerson


    6 members found this post helpful.

  8. #88
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Because if Margo listed him for REGULAR sale, she'd have to advertise him and you might trace it back to her. She figured the auction dump was a little sneakier. That's my guess.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    3 members found this post helpful.

  9. #89
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    Nov. 13, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by vxf111 View Post
    Because if Margo listed him for REGULAR sale, she'd have to advertise him and you might trace it back to her. She figured the auction dump was a little sneakier. That's my guess.
    Agree with this. Hence why horse never made it onto Margo's facebook page.

    Sorry if I missed/forgot this, but has your trainer been in touch with Margo? Maybe she could somehow casually ask about GW? Though I could completely understand if your trainer doesn't want to get involved...
    "Choose to chance the rapids, and dare to dance the tides" - Garth Brooks
    "With your permission, dear, I'll take my fences one at a time" - Maggie Smith, Downton Abbey



  10. #90
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    I think Margo's real intention was to unload the lame horse. GW just got caught up in that effort and so she tried to get rid of him quick. Dollars to doughnuts there's some backstory on the lame horse. Margo probably broke him, or didn't have authority to sell him-- I *have* to think getting rid of HIM was the hook.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    5 members found this post helpful.

  11. #91
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    Jun. 14, 2006
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    Methinks, based on the thumbs down marks on certain posts, that perhaps Miss Margo is on the boards.
    A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

    Might be a reason, never an excuse...


    6 members found this post helpful.

  12. #92
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    Aug. 5, 2009
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    Like everyone else I have been both elated and horrified by the journey his horse has had. Luck must be his middle name.

    No matter how you personally feel about him, I think some small amount of credit should also go to Frank or whoever goes to NH and bought GW for the Camelot auction. Without that, nobody would have had the faintest idea of what had happened to the horse. Perhaps talking to Frank might shed a little more light on the sequence of events, and at the very least someone should at least thank Frank for helping to save this particular "starfish."

    I also recently relocated a horse with a few ouchies to what looks like the perfect home, so this has hit closely. I guess what it all boils down to is you try your hardest to do the right thing and hope, hope, hope that you were right.

    Sounds like at least several people plus the horse are going to have a Merry Christmas because someone made a fortuitous purchase and tried to find out more about what she bought.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  13. #93
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    Oct. 27, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGrayPony View Post
    This piece doesn't make any sense to me either. I got a picture from Lisa in the beginning of October that shows him looking just as amazing, with blue ribbons dangling from his bridle. I'd post it, but it includes her face, which I'd prefer not to share. It came from a professional photographer's website, and included the date of the event, so I'm fairly sure that it's legit. Now true, it's only a head/neck shot, but he tends to lose his topline very quickly, and it was the last thing to get built. It appeared that the work that he did under Lisa was making him even more valuable.

    He did WTC, lead changes, and jumped in great form. He is a little arthritic and creaky, a forward (but not crazy) ride, and had no...I mean ZERO...stop in him. He needed hock injections in his right hind, and he could get a little stifley, particularly if he wasn't turned out, but...he was one of the best, least complicated horses I've ever thrown a leg over, even when he was slightly green and I've thrown a leg over some NICE horses. I've also ridden a lot of not so nice ones over the last 10 years, and he's not one of them.

    He didn't want to be messed with, so you had to stay out of his face, and not goose him (very sensitive) but I taught my husband (a rank beginner) how to post the trot on him - he is that quiet. He's a little different out foxhunting, as a few who have met him can testify to, and needs a more confident rider in a field galloping with a ton of other horses, but he LOVES it. He is BOLD BOLD BOLD. He saved my butt when I landed on his neck after he overjumped something in the field, and the two years I had him I never came off. And that includes riding in 19 degree days on frozen footing with me being stiff as a board.

    That's why the Margo piece just doesn't make any sense. It just doesn't. This isn't a worthless horse. I didn't rehome him because he sucked, I rehomed him because I was giving up horses entirely. I'd say that it was because he didn't fit in with the other high value horses on her site, but she has one for sale for less than $5k right now posted on Facebook, so...?
    This whole thread just makes me sad and sick. We talk over and over here on COTH about how one of the biggest things we can do for a horse to keep them from landing in a bad place is give them useful training. Sounds like OGP's horse had the kind of training that would make him perfect for so many riders I can think of, yet he still ended up in a bad place. She took all of the steps you're supposed to take to ensure they end up in a good place and he still ended up at the auction. Obviously these skills can and do help horses land softly but you just never know. I can't help but wonder if the horse that "Lisa" ended up with would have been at the auction in GW's place had "Margo" not run across her at a vulnerable moment and I also find it so odd that she just dumped GW. He sounds like a totally marketable horse even if she couldn't sell him for the big bucks she'd prefer. Just an awful situation.

    So sorry to OGP for all you're going through in this ordeal, but so glad you know he's safe and sound. And OP - you have ended up with a gorgeous and wonderful horse! He is so lucky that you found him and I'm sure you'll have many wonderful years together.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  14. #94
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    Jun. 30, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGrayPony View Post
    I will add, though, it's much easier to be charitable when you know that the ending is good. I'm not sure how I would have felt had he shipped. Of course, I'd probably never have known.
    Did I miss part of the story? Why did she not contact you when she realized GW was not going to be a good fit for her, and why did she lie when you inquired about him?
    Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
    http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg


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  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenm View Post
    Did I miss part of the story? Why did she not contact you when she realized GW was not going to be a good fit for her, and why did she lie when you inquired about him?
    Sounded to me like GW was a good fit (or, not a bad fit), but when she lost her other horse she was just kind of distraught and made a rash (and unwise) decision. It doesn't excuse her behavior (or lying) but I can understand making bad decisions and rash decisions under those circumstances.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/


    3 members found this post helpful.

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenm View Post
    Did I miss part of the story? Why did she not contact you when she realized GW was not going to be a good fit for her, and why did she lie when you inquired about him?
    My question exactly. I'm very sorry this woman lost her horse, but that is no excuse to lie to you about the horse's whereabouts. She told you he was doing good the day he was listed on Camelot's page, which was at least 3 days after the NH auction (if I'm reading correct). I would be royally pissed, just because something bad happened to her is absolutely no excuse to not contact you before selling him, as stated in your contract, and to lie about it. Something very very fishy here with her too.

    I'm assuming you sold her the horse either very cheaply or gave him away (sorry if I missed that part). Obviously the horse was a good fit for her if she was winning ribbons on him and happy for several months. I think she saw an opportunity to "upgrade" and use your horse as barter to get a better horse. She already lied to you about him. Maybe she did think he was going to a good home, and I'm sure she could be upset about where he ended up, but it certainly doesn't make her innocent in this situation.

    I really hope more details come forward and this "Margot" character is outed. Sounds like a lot of shading dealings going on at her place and people should be aware of it. Can't imagine how many people have sold her horses in good faith only to have them pawned off at a kill auction. Glad this story had such a happy ending, but it also makes me sad for the many others who haven't.


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  17. #97
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    I don't understand why "Lisa" traded GW for a show horse, when she had already won a handful of blues on GW, and got a much less able horse in return.

    I do understand that when your heart horse dies tragically, that you want little to do with your others for a bit, but not getting rid of him. When mine died, I stayed away from the barn, I did not look for the fastest way to unload them.

    Im very happy that GW had a soft landing, I think he's handsome in both pics.

    CFF


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  18. #98
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    I think Margo's real intention was to unload the lame horse. GW just got caught up in that effort and so she tried to get rid of him quick. Dollars to doughnuts there's some backstory on the lame horse. Margo probably broke him, or didn't have authority to sell him-- I *have* to think getting rid of HIM was the hook
    vx, that's the only thing that makes any sense. I should add, that horse isn't lame, he's quite nice (as far as I can tell from pictures), he just has this old injury that means that he's not quite as valuable as he should be.

    Please keep in mind, I didn't have to hold Lisa accountable, as she is doing a very nice job of holding herself accountable right now. I know that anyone can act, but I believe that she is quite distraught about the whole situation. She did believe that he was doing well, and that she was doing the right thing by the horse. She's genuine, and I will be having more conversations with her in the future. I really don't think she understood what could happen, based on some of the questions she asked me (like, does he have his blanket).

    Why didn't she call me? I'm not sure. Why didn't her trainer talk to mine? I don't know. Those details (to me) are more of the "let's learn and move on" than the immediate, who the heck drove him to New Holland. THAT person...THAT one I'd like to talk to (and perhaps, I already did).

    It is entirely possible that he wasn't a good fit personality wise for Lisa, and perhaps after showing him he really wasn't what she wanted. The forwardness thing freaks some people out and I get that. And he is the type of horse that marches right to the fence, and that can feel a little rushy if you're used to a push and pick kind of ride. That's no criticism of her ability, I can't ride push and pick horses very well. But that's probably an issue for another thread.

    I do still think there's more to this story...it's not over yet.


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  19. #99
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    OneGrayPony - as you appear to be a MUCH better person than I in just about every sense of the phrase, I would like to offer my pugilistic services to field trip (even though it is winter and very cold) up north and punch the daylights out of this "Margo." She sounds sneaky & dishonest at the very least...and an absolutely dreadful waste of space if your spidey senses are on the money...which they probably are.

    Yay for GW!!! And thanks for setting an example to the rest of us for how we oughtta be behavin'


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  20. #100
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    OGP, look at it this way. You and the OP have thrown a gigantic monkey wrench into this whole scenario. Because GW was supposed to quietly disappear at NH. Either some anonymous person would have bought him or he would have caught that one-way truck to Canada. Now he and you and the OP have come back to haunt whoever did the dirty deed. And they are not going to be happy when the truth comes out.


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