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  1. #1
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    Default Pit Bull Horse Mauling Ruling Expected Today

    Photo of the horse at the link (not graphic).

    http://www.yumasun.com/news/spud-835...nzie-horse.htm

    Excerpt:

    The fate of a dog tied to the mauling death of a horse should be decided Wednesday.

    If Mackenzie the pit bull is declared vicious, as her companion Pano was, she could be sent away to a rescue organization. If the rescue option does not pan out, the dog could be euthanized.


    Judge Yolanda Torok wrapped up Mackenzie's vicious dog hearing Tuesday in Yuma Justice Court with the conclusion that Pano be destroyed and that she would have a ruling on Mackenzie today.

    Mackenzie and Pano are the two dogs seized after a quarter horse named Spud was attacked in his pen earlier this month at his Foothills home. The dogs, who belong to neighbors, had gotten out of their yard and squeezed through the bars of Spud's stall. Charles Knowlton, one of Spud's caretakers, found the horse on the ground, Pano gnawing on its flesh and Mackenzie hovering nearby. The elderly horse suffered such extensive injuries that a veterinarian euthanized him that night.
    "No matter how well you perform there's always somebody of intelligent opinion who thinks it's lousy." - Laurence Olivier



  2. #2
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    Oct. 15, 2011
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    I saw a news article that said the horse that died was not even the first horse these dogs went after, it was the second. So sad for the horse and its owners.
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05


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  3. #3
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    I find it amazing that the dog owners themselves could not be bothered to do the right thing.....
    simply amazing!


    7 members found this post helpful.

  4. #4
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    Aug. 22, 2012
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    I couldn't imagine...how horrible.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #5
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    Jun. 7, 2002
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    Seems like the dog owner could have saved himself a lot of public humiliation by putting the dogs down himself right away and paying the horse's vet bill. Hope he faces charges.
    \"Non-violence never solved anything.\" C. Montgomery Burns



    7 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6
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    why do they punish the dogs for the owner's misdeeds?
    how hard is to keep the dogs properly fenced in? not that hard.
    to socialize dogs to livestock like horses so they don't mistake them for prey? a little harder than keeping the dogs fenced, but not that hard.



  7. #7
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    Wendy I'm sorry but this argument over don't punish the dogs for the owners mistakes is right up there w/ guns don't kill people, people do. yes, the owners are at fault for having unruly, vicious dogs who's attack(s) have injured and caused the death of prey animals i.e. horse(s) I'm sick of this argument. You have plenty of other dumb dog owners who own other breeds of dogs. go ask a judge how many dog bite trials have they presided over and overwhelmingly the breed is a pit bull. I see no reason why either of those dogs should not suffer the same fate as their victim. Would you have the same sentiment if those dogs attacked and maimed a poor kid?


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  8. #8
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    Mar. 7, 2012
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    I hope the dog are going to find a fitting rescue, and I hope the owner is punished. Poor horse



  9. #9
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    Feb. 16, 2012
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    I want pictures of the dogs and a DNA test of their actual breeding....


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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    why do they punish the dogs for the owner's misdeeds?
    how hard is to keep the dogs properly fenced in? not that hard.
    to socialize dogs to livestock like horses so they don't mistake them for prey? a little harder than keeping the dogs fenced, but not that hard.
    Ok, so how many mistakes are allowed? Whoops, dogs got out killed horse. Whoops got out again, killed a goat. Whoops, owner forgot to shut gate, killed something else...

    These particular dogs are dangerous. Plenty of dogs run free but don't kill livestock, and rescues are already overfilled with unwanted dogs that aren't dangerous. So what do you suggest should happen to these dogs, in order not to "punish" them? Find them better owners? How, since again, plenty of dogs already in shelters needing a forever home? Make the current owners fence them in? Ok, but what if they don't and another horse dies, how would you feel if it was yours?

    Euth isn't a "punishment", it's an effective method of managing these problem animals.


    21 members found this post helpful.

  11. #11
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    Most of the time I would agree yes, the owner should be ran over the coals and the dogs excused. Yes, this was not the owner of the year - dangerous dogs getting out at least twice per the news - but one of the articles on this story also said that as the dogs were being chased off the property by the owner of the horse that died, one grabbed a small dog owned by the horse owner and hurt the dog. The small dog's back was injured. I think these two dogs will be dangerous to other animals no matter where they are and (unfortunately) need to be put down.
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05


    8 members found this post helpful.

  12. #12
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    I really am against sending them to a rescue. These are dogs that should never be trusted again, and the rescue is going to spend time, money, and resources possibly rehabbing them, and putting them out in society? The best thing for the dogs and the public is to euth.


    20 members found this post helpful.

  13. #13
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    Mar. 31, 2012
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    There are valid arguments for both sides. It is sad that irresponsible owners have allowed this to happen by not properly monitoring/containing their dogs. That being said, if the dogs are that aggressive, they should be put down irregardless of their breed.

    Gottagrey, I am a judge and have seen just as many cases where labs and cocker spaniels have been aggressive/dangerous as have pit bulls. We recently had a child killed in out area by a mixed breed that was not any "bully breed." The dog was the family pet.

    I own a pit bull, who is an absolute darling; however, I also recognize the power and stength of this breed. She has been well socialized and there is not an aggressive bone in her body. On the flip side, I have euthanized one of our pit rescues that starting getting too aggressive. We could not take the risk that anyone on anything would be injured by her.

    I am so sorry for the horse owners as well as the dogs


    16 members found this post helpful.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by wendy View Post
    why do they punish the dogs for the owner's misdeeds?
    how hard is to keep the dogs properly fenced in? not that hard.
    to socialize dogs to livestock like horses so they don't mistake them for prey? a little harder than keeping the dogs fenced, but not that hard.
    I love dogs. I don't have anything against all pits either, but these two? They need to be euthed, I'd say the same thing if they were goldens or huskies or cattle dogs. The owners have proven they can't contain them and the dogs themselves have proven they aren't trustworthy. Why send them to a sanctuary? Just euth them.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by threedogpack View Post
    I love dogs. I don't have anything against all pits either, but these two? They need to be euthed, I'd say the same thing if they were goldens or huskies or cattle dogs. The owners have proven they can't contain them and the dogs themselves have proven they aren't trustworthy. Why send them to a sanctuary? Just euth them.
    Agreed. I don't have anything against pits either; I worked for a no-kill for awhile and some of my favorite dogs to work with were our pits. Regardless of what breed these two are, they have proven they are a danger to other pets and thus should be put down.
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05


    5 members found this post helpful.

  16. #16
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    So the ruling is that both are vicious, but the female will have 15 days to find a rescue willing to take her. Which is a bit odd to me - if a dog is vicious, just euth it (the male was ordered euthed, no rescue option).

    I think there's a danger with the "OMG if no one takes her she will be killed OMG" rescue types, and this dog might eventually wind up somewhere inappropriate because of this.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  17. #17
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    If I remember the story correctly, the male was actively beating up on the horse when they were discovered and the female was just standing guard. Maybe they figure she's not the primary aggressor and will be better behaved without his influence? But I do agree she needs to be put down as well, even if she isn't as bad without the male how could you fully trust her again, she's learned how to kill animals from this incident.
    *Wendy* 4.17.73 - 12.20.05


    5 members found this post helpful.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coanteen View Post
    So the ruling is that both are vicious, but the female will have 15 days to find a rescue willing to take her. Which is a bit odd to me - if a dog is vicious, just euth it (the male was ordered euthed, no rescue option).

    I think there's a danger with the "OMG if no one takes her she will be killed OMG" rescue types, and this dog might eventually wind up somewhere inappropriate because of this.
    Likely.
    Sad but true.

    A spoiled dog will now take a place of a good one. Yipee...

    Yes, spoiled as in ruined by incompetent handling.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  19. #19
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    Dogs are predators, and their natural behavior is to attack and kill prey animals- predation is not aggression, and killing a horse is not an act of "viciousness", it's an act of "getting supper". Attacking and killing a horse is what a "normal" dog does- do you accuse the deer-hunter who went out and shot his deer to eat for supper of being "vicious"? of course not. He was just hunting. Do you accuse the fox-hounds who ran down and caught and killed their fox of being "vicious"? no, they were doing their job. Do you accuse the wolves who run down and eat a deer of being "vicious"? no, they were just hungry. Normal dogs hunt and kill and often eat their prey if given the opportunity.

    What the responsible OWNER does is recognize that dogs are predators, and then they make sure the dog's predatory instincts are controlled/ directed. If you live anywhere near horses, the responsible dog owner makes sure the puppy is exposed to horses such that the puppy learns horses are not prey animals; and even if the dog is socialized to horses, the responsible owner also keeps the dog under control so the dog doesn't have the opportunity to go out and hunt and kill livestock, or even wildlife.

    These two dogs aren't abnormal in any way- they are perfectly normal dogs who just happen to be owned by an extremely irresponsible person. If they are taken away from their owner and placed with a responsible owner, they won't be involved in attacks on animals ever again. It is true that since there is a shortage of good homes a suitable home may not be found for these dogs, in which case euthanization is the best option.

    Their breed is totally irrelevant, and in fact, I'd be shocked to find out their breed had even been identified correctly. Most likely they are just big chunky mutts with short hair. Any large dog with intact hunting instincts- which is most- is capable or even likely to go out and attack horses if given the opportunity.

    Attacking humans is very different from attacking prey animals- most bites delivered to humans by dogs are not done so as part of predation. Most dog-to-human bites are efforts by the dog to defend itself from the human- self-defense fear-motivated bites. Dogs with high prey drive are no more likely than dogs with low prey drive to bite people; in fact, many of the breeds with extremely high prey drive and records of successfully killing prey animals (hounds) are among those who are least likely to bite people. Dogs who bite people need to be judged on a case-by-case basis; some of these dogs could easily be rehomed with no risk of another bite, but some definitely should be euth'd for the safety of all. Depends on what happened and why.

    Dogs attacking other dogs is also different from biting people or predation- sometimes when a small dog is killed swiftly by a large dog it is predation, but most dog-dog attacks are actually acts of aggression. Dogs who are aggressive to other dogs can sometimes be safely managed or retrained, but owners should certainly consider euthanization as a valid option for truly dog aggressive dogs, for the safety of others.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Matson View Post
    If Mackenzie the pit bull is declared vicious, as her companion Pano was, she could be sent away to a rescue organization. If the rescue option does not pan out, the dog could be euthanized.
    If a rescue takes this dog, it will just reinforce my opinion that rescues are run by stupid people and should not be patronized.

    Besides that, what kind of idiot adopts a viscious dog? One with a death wish? Reminds me of when my sister bought her MR/DD cat - a friend noted "there a plenty of normal ones, why buy a defective one?" (and the cat is still around, but don't know if I'd say she's living a happy life as the Helen Keller of the cat world; she's generally pretty grumpy)


    10 members found this post helpful.

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