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  1. #21
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    Feb. 28, 2006
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    The rocky part of KY
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboymom View Post
    . . .

    Kind compassionate people that happen to have nice things are supposed to walk around with a guilty conscience? I don't think I buy that...so to speak.
    You have to come work with my coworkers for a while to get the full effect. It's not nice to tell people all about your nice things. It's that spoiled attitude.
    Courageous Weenie Eventer Wannabe
    Incredible Invisible


    1 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by vacation1 View Post
    American professionals have few of the benefits and protections many of our colleagues in the rest of the west take for granted. We have less vacation time, no job security and live in a culture that fetishizes business so that even if you were fired from your last job by a manager utilizing a hand puppet dressed as Adolf Hitler, your only hope of getting a new job would be to claim that you and the manager parted on good terms and you really always liked working with him.
    Holy crap, preach it sistah! You got on a glorious (and astute) roll there.

    Yeah, Adolf and I were like *this*... great guy.
    Last edited by mvp; Nov. 23, 2012 at 04:26 PM.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat



  3. #23
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    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRoo View Post
    Just down the road from my office in East Lansing, they put in what I would call luxury apartments designed for college students, are furnished with nice stuff, etc. They are really nice. Each kid has their own bedroom (4), 2 baths, nice common area, and there's a gym, pool, spa, and free shuttle service to campus. The rent PER KID is more than my mortgage. And parents are happily forking over this money. They're building more, so there's demand! No milk crate/plywood "coffee tables" for these folks!
    Same thing is happening the college town where I live, Corvallis, OR.

    Not sure the kiddies' extravagant tastes are driving it. We have a 1% vacancy rate here and many of these buildings are going up. So, $600 for one bedroom in a 4 bedroom apartment. That's allotta cash. A room in a house here would be $350-500 for poorly insulated, 1970s POS houses.

    But it's hard to find a room and you borrowed a buttload to got to the local U at all, so what difference does it make if you have to spend $150 or so too much more in rent each month.

    Builders, many out of state, are delighted. The university is delighted to expand. Local businesses and even the landlords who can still rent out those POS houses are happy.

    IMO, this is being done on the backs of college students, a group with relatively little political and economic power.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat



  4. #24
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    Feb. 23, 2005
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    Spotsylvania, VA
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    FWIW I was shocked at all the stuff my kids had to have...in first grade. They were presented with a detailed list the day before school started with the things they had to have and the things that were taboo. I never figured out why each one had to have 5 marble notebooks but trapper keepers were forbidden.
    I had to resist the temptation to tell them how I walked uphill barefoot in the snow....

    It reoccurred the day I drove my daughter to freshman orientation for college.
    My parents dropped me off at the airport with a one way ticket to a place I had never been before, with $20 for cab fare to campus. The amount of stuff the students were expected to have was staggering. I suspect there are low security prisons that are better equipped and with more creature comforts than my dorm room was. OMG, the FOOD COURT! And whoever was giving the presentation said "Students have so much disposable income"

    Don't get me started on weddings....
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
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    Aug. 14, 2010
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    San Francisco, CA
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    FWIW...

    I'm 14. I'm buying an iPhone 4S with my own money because my contract was up and I found a black friday deal. Am I lucky? Yes. Do I consider myself spoiled? No, not really. I appreciate and am grateful for everything I have.
    Proud member of the COTH Junior (and Junior-at-Heart!) clique!



  6. #26
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    Feb. 6, 2003
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    NorthEast
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    Yes, many Americans are definitely spoiled. But not all. And not so much to do with ages as it with geography. The closer people live to one another/more densely they're populated...the more Instant Gratification and competitive they seem to be. In general.

    And it has a bunch of causes:

    The percentage of teens who go to college after HS has increased tremendously since the previous generations. They expect salary commensurate with either their ideal or debt. However when more and more are getting advanced degrees...the laws of supply and demand kick in as well as they economy to equal far fewer open career positions. Also for those fortunate enough for their parents to have paid for a live-in college...maturity is suspended for too long and people well into Mature Adult ages are leaving schools having actually regressed. Mom and Dad hand them entitlement in many cases and then later wonder where their kids got that from.

    More and more expect too drive new, newer and/or luxury cars. This happened when leasing came about and blasted into one of the most popular ways to obtain a car. Leasing also makes higher end vehicles with more bells and whistles more affordable. Before leasing you rarely saw luxury makes on the roads...Mercedes, BMW, etc. And those were owned by older folks as opposed to late teens/20s. Because having a down payment and making payments on a $30k-$60k car for only 5 years is a hella lot more than only needing a smaller deposit and then making payments on an amortized percentage of that car's worth. Luxury makes then catered more towards leasers than purchasers and came up with Starter Models...even more affordable models of luxury cars to increase leases/income. And young people will lease them in droves to drive a status symbol make. It's become so common that it's now considered a necessity in suburban or urban locations.

    The dumbass housing market practices is what made 20-somethings assume a starter home was 2000 sf, upgrade-galore colonials. Banks approving mortgages for 110-125% of a home's worth with low adjustable rates to get them in and "creative" approvals and assesments.

    Technology has exploded...and is also run like a mafia cartel. Large tech companies come up with the NEW BETTER ADVANCED item and declare the previous item totally obsolete. Even if the previous item is only 6 months old. Sometimes it really is technology moving that fast...but often it's not moving quite that fast and is a delayed release to dramatically increase sales with new "necessities" that can command the New Inflated Price. Think about it for a minute...newest phone out there...$600 brand new and does everything! 6 months later new phone is selling for $400. 3 months later...$200...but even Newer New Phone pops up and now does everything plus 2 more things...and it's only $600 and your 9 month old New phone is sooo yesterday! People with little marketing smarts fall for it every single time.

    And credit card companies enabling financially challenged people to pay for it all.

    So yeah...in some areas people do expect everything and they label everything as necessary so they can justify getting it.

    But head to a much more sparsely populated area...or areas where farming or hard outdoor work tends to be as or more common than desk jobs. Often these people have a stronger attachment to each dollar they make and can figure in terms of hours of labor what that New Stuff really costs. Or that refuse to live on credit. They have less New Stuff and don't seem to care about what others feel they may be lacking.
    You jump in the saddle,
    Hold onto the bridle!
    Jump in the line!
    ...Belefonte


    2 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Oct. 9, 2012
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    Washington State
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    506

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    I am an American and I am not spoiled.

    I live in a 1700 s.f. ranch box house built in the 70's with only one bathroom, I have a 2004 Saturn with a lot of miles on it, and a 2007 Ford big truck with little miles on it.

    Yes, we do have 'luxury' items like 2 laptops and a tablet. It is nice for everyone to have their own online device. My husband has a smart phone provided for him by his job, my daughter and I each have cell phones that can call and text. We buy a lot of books and have a fairly large cable package because my husband really likes sports and me and dd like BBC America. We have numerous pets and acreage.

    I will be getting a new larger refrigerator soon to replace our rattling, barely cold model that we have had for years and years. My kitchen will eventually be getting a makeover to make it more functional and we will be putting a powder room in the laundry for convenience. We will be getting a tractor and a mini excavator for farm work. In the next couple of years I will be getting a new car like a Honda Fit or a Subaru when I give dd our older Saturn.

    We are living a good life and will have our credit card debt cleared in three years. My dh works hard and we want to enjoy our lives. This does not make us spoiled.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28

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    cowboymom, I think you are the lucky one. Learning to live within ones means is difficult. Being grateful for what one has is truly peace of mind.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    Sep. 13, 2006
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    At the back of the line
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    Quote Originally Posted by PonyPeep View Post
    FWIW...

    I'm 14. I'm buying an iPhone 4S with my own money because my contract was up and I found a black friday deal. Am I lucky? Yes. Do I consider myself spoiled? No, not really. I appreciate and am grateful for everything I have.
    Spoiled with stuff doesnt mean a spoiled attitude, like some people you may know. you are blessed.

    I have a DD about your age. She has a lotta stuff (well I think so) but she is mostly greatful for what she has & knows what many people in our county live without since she did a workcamp one summer.
    “Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things.” Peter Drucker


    1 members found this post helpful.

  10. #30
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    May. 12, 2000
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    NE TN, USA
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    As a nation, we're very spoiled with a gimme, gimme, gimme, I-deserve-everything attitude simply because I can consume Oxygen and take up space.
    “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by debt.”
    John Adams


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Mar. 18, 2005
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    1,076

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    Yes, and it is because of technology. Why look something up in a book when a computer can do it for us? Why take out a piece of paper, write a letter adress it put a stamp on it and send it in the mail, when a computer can do it for us? Why go to a movie theater to see a movie, when you can watch it on line for free? Why go outside and play ball when a kid can stick a video game into a game sytem and play in the house? Yep, lazy americans.
    Yet, when I was young, I stuck my nose in books and got lost in them, I wrote letters to relatives because it cost to much to call them, I played in the yard or saddled my horse packed a lunch and was off and gone all day long.

    My daughter whom is special needs and 20, gets lost in her books and her music, rides her horse, watches tv, and gets on the computer but she isn't glued to it in winter time.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Apr. 1, 2008
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    4,558

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    Quote Originally Posted by gdolapp View Post
    Yes, and it is because of technology. Why look something up in a book when a computer can do it for us?
    books are not always available to those who live in the middle of nowhere. I bet those adults & kids are grateful for the computer.

    Why take out a piece of paper, write a letter adress it put a stamp on it and send it in the mail, when a computer can do it for us?
    sometimes we need a quick reply? And just FYI, I do write letters, nearly weekly to 3 people I love dearly.

    Why go to a movie theater to see a movie, when you can watch it on line for free?
    for me it's not about being free, but more about cwazie drivers and it not costing $18 + the $1000 deductible when someone backs into my car. I'd rather rent a movie or stream it and stay in my jammies.

    Why go outside and play ball when a kid can stick a video game into a game sytem and play in the house?
    ironic that you think this while surfing the net on a horse board.


    Yet, when I was young, I stuck my nose in books and got lost in them, I wrote letters to relatives because it cost to much to call them, I played in the yard or saddled my horse packed a lunch and was off and gone all day long.
    if my daughter took off all day on her horse (by herself), I'd be in a panic. It's just not safe to do that anymore.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    Jan. 26, 2010
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    6,389

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    I have a saying that I think is true. Those who have everything appreciate nothing. Those who have nothing appreciate everything.

    We have a LOT, and because of that, we don't appreciate it as it should.

    I am spoiled. I love in a 1,000 sf house with 2 small bedrooms and 1 small bathroom that I could afford because my father died and I inherited the down when my grandfather died. I have a 6 year old laptop and just got a cel phone. I have a '99 Honda that looks like crap and runs great and a '70 truck that pulls the 4 horse stock trailer I got for $1,000. I have three horses now and keep them in pasture and do my own shoeing and care and can afford to compete dressage and pay for a vet if I need to. I work as a teacher and have a 6% pay cut and have been on a freeze for four years, but I can pay all of my bills and can pay for my $600 a month health insurance. With time and effort, I can find cheap vacations and travel the world. I have one tv with the cheapest cable I could argue about. I shop for groceries at the 99 cent store and grocery outlet and get great deals, and love it. I shop at the flea market and thrift stores, and love it. I can buy stuff on sale at Horze.com.

    I am spoiled because I have everything I need and way more. I do appreciate it, but never enough.

    I agree that we've been SO inundated with the message we need to look a certain way or have certain things that have nothing to do with being a good person. Almost EVERY single kid at my middle school has a smart phone. Almost every single one has game systems, expensive shoes, and thinks nothing of buying a $5 Starbucks. My school is in a lower/middle class area, going lower. It's WAY worse in the wealthier areas. All of this STUFF is not making us better people.


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  14. #34
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    Mar. 11, 2007
    Location
    Montana
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    Well I do appreciate what we have. We definitely don't live in the same neighborhood as the Jones's! LOL But that's how I like it, I'm very quirky culture. I love my internet (on my 12 year old desktop) but I don't like being typical. We are very up on some things but we milk a goat and lived without electricity for three months last year and were plumb happy with it. I march to my own drummer. We don't have a fancy house, never have, I lean toward little old farmhouses and that's what we have. We live very simply on a lot of levels and we appreciate everything we have. Our lives revolve around the horses and the mountains. My daughter could be gone on her horse all day and I wouldn't worry; just as I grew up. My kids can survive in the mountains for days, they're practical kids that don't have cell phones or ipads but my son has an xbox. We're a funny mix, I guess. Don't make a lot of money but we have a great life.

    I don't feel spoiled by any means, we work our tails off for what we have including our food and our wood that heats our house.

    I feel fortunate, and blessed, and thank heavens we are safe and not hungry.

    But not spoiled. I actually take offense to that... just b/c I'm an American I am spoiled. dunno about that.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    Sep. 18, 2009
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    The Sunshine State
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    I am one of those mythical youngsters you hear so much about these days. I am a 22 year old college student. I see many of my peers living an unsustainable lifestyle on mom and dad's dime. However, we are not all the spoiled, whiney, superficial monsters that you see on MTV.

    I am a full-time college student, with sights set on grad school next year. I also work about 25-30 hrs a week as a waitress. I do not have a smart phone. I do not have cable. All of my furniture was either hand-me-down, or purchased at the thrift store. I live in a 650 sq ft, older, 1 BR apt that I share with my boyfriend and my dog. I pay my rent, my food expenses, all utilities, my phone bill, my gas bill, my c/c bill, and my car insurance.

    I am exceedingly grateful that I do not have to pay for my horse. I know that I could not possibly be able to afford to live and own him. I consider riding to be a privilege, and I do not mind letting friends (who are experienced riders from my IDA/IHSA team) come ride him. I pay for all of my showing costs.

    There are many young people today living extravagantly; thinking that it is normal. I may not be living the same way they do, but I know that I am blessed. There are many people that do not have it as good as me. I am also thankful that my family taught me to live independently, and to make a budget. I'm sure if I was in a true bind, I could get some help. However, I do not have everything handed to me on a silver platter.

    I'm not trying to toot my own horn. I have a great life! There are kids (and adults) out there that are not as lucky as I am. I'm just trying to portray an alternative to what many middle-aged and older folks see as a greedy, spoiled, and gag-worthy generation coming up.



  16. #36
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    Oct. 25, 2012
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    I think the whole constant-upgrades phenomenon with the smartphones and tablets etc. is just the latter-day version of the "fads" when I was in school. I was a little late for hula hoops, but remember Creepy Crawlers, Footsies, and everyone wearing the Dorothy Hamill haircut.

    It's what we used to call "peer pressure." If Susie has the widget, why can't I have one too? Never mind that most kids don't NEED the constant distractions of social media, texting, etc. which are actually deleterious to studying.

    I'd say PARENTS have to say "No!" Dunno 'bout you, but I used to get the "If Susie jumped off a bridge, would you have to do it too?"

    Instead, it could be a "teachable moment" about the not-so-subtle effects of marketing on impressionable minds.



  17. #37
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    Oct. 28, 2007
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    NY
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    The number of middle class Chinese = the entire U.S. population.
    Are Americans spoiled? Compared to whom, may I ask?



  18. #38
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    Apr. 17, 2002
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    between the barn and the pond
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    This feels like a highway conversation. Anyone with more stuff is an idiot and anyone with less is a moron. Just replace more/less with faster/slower.


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  19. #39
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    Mar. 18, 2005
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    Actually I live in the middle of no where and grew up in the middle of no where.
    I grew up a mile back in a field had to walka mile long lane to catch the school bus and walk that mile back home. Even in below zero weather. During school I would take advantage of the school library. In the summertime when my Mom would go to town the couple times a month she always went on a friday or sat and we went to garage sales so I was able to get books ect things to keep me busy. I was still in school (High school) when computers, vcr's came out. I didn't own one till after I got married 20 years ago. As a child I learned from my parents how to not live beyond means. I have also done the best I can to instill that in my daughter. We live a comfortable life yet we struffle too. I grow a garden to help out with groceries during the year ect. I go to town once a month for my chiro apt. councling apt and for odds and ends. The rest of the time I am at home on our farmette.



  20. #40
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    Oct. 25, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eclectic Horseman View Post

    To address your other point, we "look down" on people who live modestly because high status living is mistaken for "worth" or "wealth" in this country. Many of us value ourselves only if we buy and own high status goods. It is all part of our celebrity worshipping culture.
    Agreed!



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