[horsepoor]

Hmm..can I get some for myself???

That's a thought! Hmm...

[mswillie]

This thread just helped me make my decision to put my horse on pentosan. He went lame in July and x-rays showed a chip in the ankle and some ring bone as well.

The chip was removed about 9 weeks ago and he's on the last part of his recovery which is a month of regular turn out and "go be a horse" therapy. The surgeon is optimistic about his recovery but did say that we might need to do some joint maintenance/injections periodically.

From what I've read here it sounds like the risk vs the benefit comes out mostly on the benefit side. I have a bottle that I got just a day before his surgery so I didn't start him on it. I'm going to start the loading dose this weekend. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed.

[RAyers]

There have been 14 reported cases of bleeding since 2007. However, that is where the manufacturer has warnings as the risk of bleeding is directly associated with the dosage. Additionally, they do not recommend it for horses with bleeding issues.The company researchers stipulated that given the drug will cause increased risk in bleeding, it should not be administered within 24-48 hours of strenuous exercise where the horse is at risk for injury. After 48 hours, the anti-clotting effect wears off.

Details were at Biopharm Australia (the drug maker) but it is no longer available.

Vets are lukewarm because PPS is basically the same as Adequan in its function. Since it is not approved in the US for what you all intend, it can lead to liability and malpractice issues.

We don't get the risk information in the US as the compounding pharmacies don't actually have to do anything to prove efficacy or safety. Biopharm's work is based on studies done in Australia and Europe over the past 5 years.

[Carried Away]

That was my vet's concern with it, the compounding issue. He is a well respected lameness/sport horse vet but is not a fan of Pentosan. I'd like to try it but am hesitant. Are you guys using PentAussie or just "pentosan"?

Is this similar to the MAP5 vs. Adequan issue?

[TBRedHead]

I use PentAussie specifically.

[Lucassb]

Several horses in my current barn are on Pentosan and seem to be doing really well on it. I would not hesitate to use it on a horse having issues with stiffness, difficulty warming up, and that sort of thing.

There is an FDA approved human version, called Elmiron. It's been around for years, although for an entirely different application.

[Serigraph]

I have given it to two of my horses in the neck and both horses necks swelled up and got sore. Vet advised me to give it in the peck muscles or lower down on the neck near the junction of the shoulder. They didn't swell there. I did see improvement in one of my horses two with a known old fracture.

[deltawave]

I never give injections > 1-2 cc in the neck..

[flyracing]

I never give injections > 1-2 cc in the neck..

Why? Is there something written on this? Vets regularly give and advise to give doses of 20-30ccs in the neck with redirection every 5ccs or so. Removing the two sides of the neck when rotating daily medication such as a series of penicillin would seem to be be unfair to the horse and make them more sore in the remaining injection sites.

[deltawave]

It is my own personal preference, that's all. God gave the horse vast tracts of muscle (hamstring, pectoral) that are not as touchy and prone to making them stiff and sore. So I avail myself of that real estate, reserving the neck for vaccines and the like. Obviously I would use the neck if there were no remaining options, but IME neck injections seem to be disproportionately likely to make them sore and uncomfortable as opposed to similar-sized injections in the larger muscles. Maybe it's because the neck muscles are in use non-stop (whereas a horse can "rest" a hind leg) or the muscle sheets are thinner and touchier in the neck. In any case, I stated what I stated with no authority whatsoever other than my own personal way of doing it.

[LuvMyRide]

This thread certainly helped convince me to give it a try on my 13 year old with pretty awful arthritis too.

Do you guys buy a vial and give it yourself each month? How much do you give each month? How much does it cost? I think I saw someone once say it's only $10 a month, but that doesn't seem right?

[Laurierace]

It is given once a week for four doses then as needed. I pay roughly $26 per dose with shipping and give it myself.

[deltawave]

I pay $160 for a 50 cc vial, which is enough for 8 doses for my big girl (6cc per dose). If I'm using it on one of my smaller ones it's only 5cc/dose so I get 10 per vial. So the cost is $16-20 per dose, and I know people can get it much cheaper (I've heard prices from $100-140 for the same size vial) but I have a standing Rx and so it's just easy for me to get it from the same place when I need it.

Yes, I give it myself but am extremely careful about cleaning the bottle top each time and since it's a multi-use vial I also clean the skin fastidiously before I inject and inspect the drug as I draw it up for any cloudiness or signs that it's contaminated.

[LuvMyRide]

One of my best friends is a bet, when she gets home I'm going to have her check to see how much she can get it for (and then I'll give it myself). Horse is a little over 1000lbs, so I think I'll need the 6cc.

[vxf111]

Just because a vet may not have heard of something or may not prefer a specific therapy doesn't mean that vet's all in it for the money of hock injections. Some vets just don't prefer Pentosan. Adequan is approved, bombards the vets with information, and vets are used to it/have good experiences. Doesn't make them just out to make a buck.

[Watermark Farm]

Pentosan is related to heparin (an anticoagulant) chemically and can have weak effects on the clotting system, so a horse could theoretically be more prone to bleeding from some sort of cut or injury that might not bleed much otherwise in the day or two following a Pentosan injection.

I started two horses on it (a 22 year old and a 4 year old, both recovering from injuries) several weeks ago and both are feeling pretty good!

Just FYI, the older horse is due for joint injections and vet said to make sure he does not get Pentosan within 48 hours either side of the joint injections due to the slight anticoagulant effect of the drug.

I asked my vet about the differences between Pentosan, Adequan and Legend. He said they each work a bit differently and that one reason why one works for one horse and not another has to do with the type of inflammation. He likes Pentosan but said he thinks the best one-two punch comes with giving both Adequan and Legend together. Which is pretty expensive...

[Watermark Farm]

Laurierace & Deltawave, where are you ordering your Pentosan from? My vet told me to stick with Pentaussie and not get the compounded kind from Wedgewood. Cheapest per 6cc dose I've found so far is $40/dose from HorsePreRace. Thanks!

[deltawave]

Abba Vet. It is the Wedgewood product, however. I'm comfortable with it, and have weighed the risks and benefits.

[Watermark Farm]

Abba Vet. It is the Wedgewood product, however. I'm comfortable with it, and have weighed the risks and benefits.

Thanks! I was thinking I'd order it from a compounding pharmacy but my vet said he is nervous about injectables coming from a compounding pharmacy. The cost from Abba is much lower than buying Pentaussie though, which sure makes it tempting.

[Laurierace]

If my vet would write a script I would go to Wedgewood directly but he doesn't so I get it from Abba who gets it from Wedgewood. FYI Abba has been my vet for 20 years which is why he won't write a script to go elsewhere but I don't need one to order from them.