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  1. #21
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    Dec. 4, 2005
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    washington state
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    Unfortunately, when the government mandates that you have to buy insurance, it's like handing the insurance companies a big ole wad of free cash. We are forced to buy a product at any price they decree.

    I hate insurance agencies with the fire of a thousand suns!

    If we as a society decide we need to have car and health insurance then the insurance providers need to be run as a not-for-profit entity, similar to how state run "business" like state colleges, etc., are run. What is going on now is freely allowing insurance creeps to make as much money as possible off those who can least afford it.
    The Knotted Pony

    Proud and upstanding member of the Snort and Blow Clique.


    14 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar. 23, 2005
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    SF Bay Area
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    2,632

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    dazed, have you checked to see if your income level makes you eligible for Medicaid in your state?

    As an earlier poster said, in a couple of years there should be insurance exchanges in each state that will make insurance available to all - with a subsidy in some cases. I think that is scheduled to take effect in 2014.

    Hope your nasty break heals well now. (and how do your parents cover their health needs?)

    Count me as someone who would be willing to pay more for all to have health care - on pragmatic as well as on moral grounds.


    10 members found this post helpful.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Oct. 14, 2010
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    2,309

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    Quote Originally Posted by prairiewind2 View Post
    Are you blaming Obamacare for this? Cuz this sort of thing has been happening for years now. Insurance seems expendable until you need it. Then, not so much. If you are young, then insurance shouldn't be too expensive. If you don't bother to buy it even though you are in a hazardous job and ride a hazardous vehicle, well, I guess you learn a lesson.

    Obamacare saved us somewhere north of $1200 this year on our insurance, so while I was and am doubtful about it long term - I sure am happy with it short term.

    I've made sure I was insured since I fell off my parents policy when I was 18 or so. Have only needed it a couple of times - and one of them was for a badly damaged hand and wrist. Sure glad I had it then for the surgery!

    I am sorry your lesson had to be so painful.

    Liz
    I'm glad you're saving money, because I'm not. The premiums on my current policy are going almost $2000 next year, and are about a 300% increase. I would rather pay the $35 copay than get a Pap test for "free"; at this rate, I can't afford free.

    I am all for having health insurance decoupled from the workplace, but Obamacare is not the answer.


    18 members found this post helpful.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar. 23, 2005
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    SF Bay Area
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    2,632

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    Quote Originally Posted by red mares View Post
    I'm glad you're saving money, because I'm not.
    but that is the way insurance works.. be glad you're not having medical problems costly enough to make insurance pay. Nobody wants to be in a collision or have a house fire, but that is when you need it. The best deal for a young, healthy person is often actually some kind of catastrophic health policy in which only major expenses are covered... but under those some people don't get preventative care.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Oct. 4, 2003
    Location
    Hurdle Mills, NC
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    4,101

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    Thank you, Dazednconfused, for telling your story. Far too many people in this country never give a thought to the people whose lives are ruined or lost for lack national health care until they or someone close to them becomes one of them.

    Lots of people have criticized Obama for focusing on Healthcare "instead of the economy" during the years when he had a Democratic Majority in congress and could (theoretically) pass whatever he wanted. As he tried to make clear at the time, Affordable Health care is not just about healthcare-- it's simultaneously very much about the economy. It's about eliminating the #1 reason for bankruptcies in our country, it's about freeing people from dead end jobs to pursue entrepreneurship because their health insurance will no longer be dependent upon those jobs, and the list goes on and on.

    It's just a shame that it is taking so long for the various provisions of this act to go into effect, so that many voters have yet to feel its full impact. Guess I'm "lucky" that way-- my 25 year old niece has cystic fibrosis, and the provision that allows her to remain on her parents' insurance for another year has undoubtedly saved her life multiple times over the last year. I am so glad whenever I read about others benefiting from the shrinking of the "doughnut hole," the addition of preventive procedures to Medicare, etc., hoping that those frightened by massive anti-"Obamacare" propaganda will realize what a long-needed advance it is, and how horrible its repeal would be.
    Last edited by fish; Nov. 4, 2012 at 07:26 PM.


    19 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Feb. 23, 2005
    Location
    Spotsylvania, VA
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    12,715

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    Quote Originally Posted by twotrudoc View Post
    Unfortunately, when the government mandates that you have to buy insurance, it's like handing the insurance companies a big ole wad of free cash. We are forced to buy a product at any price they decree.

    I hate insurance agencies with the fire of a thousand suns!

    If we as a society decide we need to have car and health insurance then the insurance providers need to be run as a not-for-profit entity, similar to how state run "business" like state colleges, etc., are run. What is going on now is freely allowing insurance creeps to make as much money as possible off those who can least afford it.
    That's not exactly true. The insurance companies will have to pay out 80 or 85% of the premiums they collect or give a rebate to their customers.
    These stats are a few years old but health insurance isn't all that profitable
    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...tries/profits/
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar. 3, 2010
    Posts
    1,417

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    I am sorry you find yourself in this situation. However, many years ago, I decided to go to college at the urging of my teachers. My parents could afford to pay my way but chose not to. It made it impossible to get work on campus because I wasn't "needy". I was also young, 17, so I couldn't do the good stuff that paid well like bartend. I sold my clothes etc and made it through the first two years. THe school had health insurance. I

    I switched schools and they did NOT have health insurance. I had to find my own. I got one job as a barmaid to pay expenses like tuition and rent and another at a hospital to get benefits, i.e. health insurance.

    I understand what you want to do for a living and how important that is to you. However, you also found out you NEED health insurance. You need at least a part time job that will provide it. OR start a horsemen's group to buy it as a group or find one that already exists.
    “Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.”
    ― Albert Einstein


    11 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Oct. 25, 2008
    Posts
    2,123

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    It's not that hard to find an affordable monthly premium. Unfortunately, if you ever actually NEED the insurance, good luck affording the deductible.

    I, for one, would not have a problem paying more taxes if it meant we would have socialized health care. I work with mostly poor/disadvantaged people, many of them on Medical Assistance for reasonably minor things (diabetes, mental health issues, etc.), and many of them would gladly get jobs-- they WANT to get jobs-- but the jobs out there for low-skilled workers (temp agencies, warehouse work, etc.) don't offer insurance, and if they have an income, they lose their medical benefits. And without basic medical care, they can't stay healthy enough TO work. So it's a self-defeating cycle.
    *friend of bar.ka

    "Evidently, I am an unrepentant b*tch, possible trouble maker, and all around super villian"


    22 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Oct. 25, 2008
    Posts
    2,123

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    Double post. :-(
    *friend of bar.ka

    "Evidently, I am an unrepentant b*tch, possible trouble maker, and all around super villian"



  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    39,987

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    Quote Originally Posted by carolprudm View Post
    That's not exactly true. The insurance companies will have to pay out 80 or 85% of the premiums they collect or give a rebate to their customers.
    These stats are a few years old but health insurance isn't all that profitable
    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...tries/profits/
    I received a rebate from my insurance, BCBS a couple of weeks ago.
    There it explained why they had to do that, as you say.



  11. #31
    Join Date
    May. 15, 2006
    Location
    Eastern WV Panhandle
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    So, how exactly will Obamacare change anything with the OP's situation? She refused to purchase health insurance and got hurt in an accident - and starting in 2014 she'll pay higher income taxes for that choice, and she'll still be uninsured.

    While the at-fault driver's insurance company should have been paying the bills, nothing in Obamacare will 1) force the doctor or hospital to accept third-party insurance, and 2) force the at-fault driver's insurance company to pay anything until the police reports are done.

    So far the only effect I've personally seen from Obamacare is my company will be dumping the PPO, POS, and HMO health plans on 1/1/13, and we're left with only the catastrophic high deductible ($5,000 per year per family) w/ health savings account plan.


    21 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Oct. 14, 2010
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    2,309

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    The people I know who complained the loudest about their healthcare costs or premiums have plenty of funds, they just don't want to spend it there. The folks with a huge house, and spend $200 a week on doggy day care, $itching about the cost of care for their child. Guess what, if you would rather spend $$ on your dog and too big house, I'm really not inclined to pay for your kid's health care. If it's not your priority, why should it be mine?

    I had socialized medicine when I was in the service. It was one of the reasons I got out. I certainly DO NOT want higher taxes for it.

    For the last 5 years I've lived next to a woman on Section 8 and welfare. She finally got evicted this summer. After supporting (through my taxes) her efforts to devalue my property, trash the neighborhood and keep the locals in drugs, my outlook toward those on government assistance isn't as charitable as it was when I moved in.


    17 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Sep. 7, 2009
    Location
    Lexington, KY
    Posts
    16,669

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    OP, even if you had health insurance, it wouldn't have covered you because it was a car accident. Lesson here is to hire a lawyer in a situation like that ASAP. Otherwise, the auto insurance companies will jerk you around. No question.
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant


    7 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2006
    Posts
    9,954

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    Obamacare is NOT socialized medicine, for starters. If more people are buying health insurance across the board and many are young and healthy (which could change in an instant) premiums should be more affordable than they are now.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Mar. 23, 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area
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    2,632

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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    OP, even if you had health insurance, it wouldn't have covered you because it was a car accident. Lesson here is to hire a lawyer in a situation like that ASAP. Otherwise, the auto insurance companies will jerk you around. No question.
    I don't believe that is true. In case of an accident such as that, you'd get care. Your insurance company might well go after the responsible driver's insurance for reimbursement - or your own carrier if you were at fault. (it would make no sense for your health insurance carrier to deny immediate treatment, since to do so would likely increase the costs later in your life)


    2 members found this post helpful.

  16. #36
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    9,954

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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    OP, even if you had health insurance, it wouldn't have covered you because it was a car accident. Lesson here is to hire a lawyer in a situation like that ASAP. Otherwise, the auto insurance companies will jerk you around. No question.
    This is true, sadly.



  17. #37
    Join Date
    Aug. 20, 2006
    Location
    wyoming
    Posts
    498

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dazednconfused View Post
    No, I desperately WANT socialized medicine in this country.

    Why should this be a "lesson"? Why should I have to suffer? I DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG.

    I already explained health insurance was out of my reach. It doesn't matter if you're young and healthy - it is still insanely expensive. I could find no plan under about $250 a month and even that was a huge deductible. I didn't ride a hazardous vehicle. I had it so I would be spending within my means and not be in debt/have a car payment. Aside from that, she still would have hit me if I'd been in a car or a bike or anything else because she was paying attention to a yard sale sign and not the road.

    Are you proposing I should have just taken some money off the money tree in my backyard and come up with an extra $250 a month?? REALLY?

    Seriously. I can't believe people.
    You will need to pay for Obamacare. It won't be free, though it will probably be subsidized for you.

    And yes. I find $250 to be reasonable. DH and I have a $10,000 deductible each and still pay close to $1200 a month. We are in excellent health and have had no major claims in 35-40 years. My wrist/hand was my last claim of any size (a thousand or two, back in the day). So absolutely - I would kill for a policy that cost $250!

    As far as not affording it. You say you were socking away some money. Well, there's your payment. DH and I don't get cable, we drive a very old car and truck, we eat out rarely and I'm counting fast food here, and do only a couple movies a year. We don't buy lots of clothes. We don't have expensive smart phones.

    It's all a matter of priorities. Keeping our policy has caused us some real hardship at times, but it has always been a priority. I've seen too many people bankrupted by health care bills to do without our health insurance.

    So yes, I still say it's a valuable lesson. I wish it didn't have to be - I certainly wish our health care and health insurance systems weren't broken, but they are what they are. You have to deal with life the way it is, not the way you'd wish it to be. I am truly very sorry you were hurt, but fairly unsympathetic to your lack of insurance. Makes me a creep, I know.

    Any vehicle such as a motorcycle or Vespa is a hazardous vehicle. Drivers can't see you well, so they are more dangerous to drive than cars. (I am remembering right, aren't I? You did say Vespa? If you didn't, never mind!)

    Liz


    14 members found this post helpful.

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    19,592

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    It is true. I was injured slightly in a car accident that was not my fault and the urgent care place would not accept my health insurance and made me put it on my credit card. Luckily the bill was small but it would have been the same even if it was huge.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Jul. 28, 2006
    Posts
    343

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    Quote Originally Posted by red mares View Post
    I'm glad you're saving money, because I'm not. The premiums on my current policy are going almost $2000 next year, and are about a 300% increase. I would rather pay the $35 copay than get a Pap test for "free"; at this rate, I can't afford free.

    I am all for having health insurance decoupled from the workplace, but Obamacare is not the answer.
    I'm not sure that his original plans have been reflected in the current "Obamacare" plan.. because of having to adopt to Dems/Reps demands, that plan is certainly not the plan we have in place here, nor is it the plan I think he originally had in mind. So "Obamacare" now, is not Obama.

    In my world, you would not be paying $2,000 insurance premiums. You would be taxed at your income level. We pay no premiums. We do pay taxes.

    For what it's worth, my household makes well over $500/year, we pay 50% in provincial/federal taxes. But that includes all schools, education, roads, provincials, etc. There are breakdowns you can run to see where you fit into the charts.

    If you made $100/year, your tax threshold would be about significantly less than mine.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Jun. 4, 2002
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    Suffolk, VA
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    Was talking yesterday to a friend who is an MD and runs her own private practice in Newport News. The talk was about politics...she is Catholic and very conservative, and Obamacare came up. As we discussed it I mentioned that I had heard that originally Obamacare was going to eliminate mammograms for women under 50 and over 70 and that it caused an uproar and they "changed" it to fix the problem.. We talked about the A, B and C level issue where now the mammograms from 40 to 50 are considered "C" level procedures and will only be done if your doctor agrees that you need one. She said when that happens you get into an insurance company pissing contest over who will pay since it is a low priority procedure. She also said that even if a woman wants to pay for her own mammogram out of concerns for early cancer detection, she will be lucky to find a place to do it as there will be waiting lists and such preventative care will be rationed. Her comment (not mine) was that a woman will be able to get an abortion for nothing but not a mammogram in the US if this goes through.

    I found that a bit disturbing to say the least as my sister in law is alive now because her breast cancer was detected at age 44. Under Obamacare, she'd most likely be dead now..her cancer was invasive, fast spreading, and ended up in her brain and now is in her liver. 4 years later and she's still fighting but at least she has a chance.

    My doctor friend and I both agreed that health care reform is important and necessary but that Obamacare is not the right answer.

    Romney, if elected, says that he will replace Obamacare with state run health care similar to what Massachusetts had (and no it's not the same as Obamacare) so I don't think all is lost for those of you who are uninsured now. I certainly understand that it can be a big issue and it's one I may face one day myself.

    From my perspective, we are faced this year with a large premium increase for Tricare...covering military personnel and retirees. Every year it gets more and more expensive it seems. My husband is covered as a retiree and has insurance from his current job which is much better than Tricare which is our secondary insurance at the moment. If he dies before I do and I'm under 65, I'll be uninsured unless I can get my own insurance. It's a worry no doubt and as I said earlier, health care reform is necessary but there has to be a better way than socializing it. I experienced socialized medicine in the Army years ago and it sucked compared to what I have now.


    7 members found this post helpful.

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