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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by AirForceWife View Post
    Not only the girls high school but a young girl's swim team as well. I would be severely disturbed by this and not because he wants to be a she but because she is hanging out her manly bits in front of 6 year old children.
    If you think this way about people who are transgender then you are sadly mistaken.

    Saying that people who are transgender ~want~ to be a different gender just because they want to do so is like saying gay people choose to be gay.
    *The Quietman ~ Irish Approved Gr.1 Stallion
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    7 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
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    Dec. 25, 2011
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    I'm fairly curious about how you thought this was going to go, twotru.

    You are very defensive and sound quite surprised that not many people agree with you.

    What was the point? To poke fun? I'd argue you didn't want a well informed and unemotional round robin of a debate, given your reaction to dissent.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  3. #23
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    Sorry, he is a guy. Give him all the hormones you want, give him fake boobs...until the external plumbing is changed, he is a guy. Doesn't belong around normal women and especially not girls.
    "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"


    17 members found this post helpful.

  4. #24
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    Oct. 12, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by over the moon View Post
    Would you not want your child to get over her discomfort? Transgender men and women aren't going away. Instead of shielding her from some facts of life, why not give her the opportunity to come to terms with such things?
    Yes, you talk to your kids about such matters. But as far as experiencing them firsthand... plenty of time when they are adults to do that.

    I think that what most are forgetting is that kids are not emotionally ready to handle some of this stuff yet. They are kids. If we force it on them before they are emotionally ready to process their feelings, who knows how it will affect them?


    9 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
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    Nov. 1, 2007
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    The article and during the interview its stated that Colleen was using the sauna.

    Now, as a woman, when I use a sauna I generally wrap a towel around me, I may go topless but I will have a towel around my bottom half. I feel that women are generally more discrete about such things. I even went to a Turkish Hamam in Paris and it was required to wear bottoms.

    Men on the other hand, are generally more....open about their nakedness and perhaps some of that carried over to Colleen while she was steam bathing.

    If Colleen wants to live like a woman I don't care, but do some research and conduct your self like a woman and not a man.


    11 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
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    Mar. 6, 2002
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    ZOMG it's a PENIS!

    You are not in the locker room to pay attention to anyone's business but your own. Eyes on your own junk (and frankly, I don't get why ANYONE feels it necessary to just hang out totally naked in a populated locker room, vagina or not).

    Maybe it's time the other school build it's own locker room.
    What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what
    lies with in us. - Emerson


    5 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Nov. 18, 2010
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    california
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    Quote Originally Posted by over the moon View Post
    Would you not want your child to get over her discomfort? Transgender men and women aren't going away. Instead of shielding her from some facts of life, why not give her the opportunity to come to terms with such things?
    She will when she is a bit older. Not all teenagers are comfortable in their own skin and some are still children. My point is that the considerations of children come first, all children even those that at 15 still enjoy cartoon movies, have no interest in dating and may not be comfortable with a woman with a penis being exposed. I also wear a bra around my son's 12 year old friends.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
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    Sep. 26, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trakehner View Post
    Sorry, he is a guy. Give him all the hormones you want, give him fake boobs...until the external plumbing is changed, he is a guy. Doesn't belong around normal women and especially not girls.
    I agree with this.

    Not to hijack the thread, but what's to prevent a guy from saying he identifies himself as a women and using that as a ruse to get into women's locker rooms to gawk or something else? I'm not saying the subject of the OP's post was doing that, not at all, however, I don't see that there's anything to prevent that...


    9 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    Mar. 30, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heinz 57 View Post
    ZOMG it's a PENIS!
    That's what she said.
    Thus do we growl that our big toes have,
    at this moment, been thrown up from below!


    5 members found this post helpful.

  10. #30
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    Sep. 26, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by MunchingonHay View Post
    The article and during the interview its stated that Colleen was using the sauna.

    Now, as a woman, when I use a sauna I generally wrap a towel around me, I may go topless but I will have a towel around my bottom half. I feel that women are generally more discrete about such things. I even went to a Turkish Hamam in Paris and it was required to wear bottoms.

    Men on the other hand, are generally more....open about their nakedness and perhaps some of that carried over to Colleen while she was steam bathing.

    If Colleen wants to live like a woman I don't care, but do some research and conduct your self like a woman and not a man.

    Exactly. One would think that the guy who identifies as a women, i.e. Colleen, would try to do things that fit in with that gender group and not do things that might make them feel uncomfortable. An open shower is one thing, you can't do anything about it unless there;s a curtain. In many gyms, some of the ones I remember from college and high school they were just spouts along the wall, no way to cover up anything. However, in a sauna, one can certainly sit on a towel and make some attempt to be discreet.

    Just from a sanitary perspective I wouldn't want to sit naked on some bench where another naked person just put their @$$. Even in parts of downtown SF where nudity is accepted, people still have to cover their @$$ when they sit down in a restaurant.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Dec. 4, 2005
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    Bliss, I don't need to be defensive. I am curious to know what people think and asking pointed questions is a sure way to get a response. I have shared my opinion and others have shared theirs.

    Here are my reactions to dissenting opinion--
    "I don't have any issue with the woman. And, before y'all start in with the hopped up crazy, I know her. Yes, I know her. She works where I used to and I was one who helped to accommodate her with our bathroom policy (she wished to use the female one). No biggie there (at least to me).

    However! I do not think males and females need to be hanging out their genitals especially with minors around. Otherwise, why not just have coed locker rooms.

    Answer me. Then why not just have coed locker rooms at public schools ???"


    "
    If you read the article, the girls high school uses it. Please know what you are saying "

    "She's a woman to me too-but I don't want her penis hanging out all over my after-workout shower. And I'll tell her that next time I see her. Equality and tolerance go both ways, toots. Neither should be made to feel uncomfortable."


    "Don't accuse me of staring, there "reading things into this that don't exist" big red.

    I don't go to the gym. As the locker rooms are clearly labeled male and female, the one who has different equipment or is pre-op should take measure to cover up. The majority have girl parts, those with male parts can go behind a curtain.

    That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it. And will tell the person in question it too Over coffee downtown or maybe at Jakes, we'll see."

    Umm...what reaction are you trying to infer, Bliss? I'm really not the hyper-ventilating pearl clutching type.

    And, I still have the same opinion
    The Knotted Pony

    Proud and upstanding member of the Snort and Blow Clique.



  12. #32
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    Dec. 12, 2004
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    Ya'll babbling about 15 year olds not being ready to see a penis are living in some imaginary dream world. Your 15 year old (of either gender) has seen a penis, this I promise you. My 6th grade health class showed a picture of a penis, although I live in MA where we are not afraid of penises. (Penii?)

    And contrary to what some of you seem to believe, childhood is the PERFECT time to teach your children about acceptance, and to put it in practice as well. Who says they need to wait until 18 to have some common decency when it comes to treating other humans like humans?


    8 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    It's not about JUST seeing a penis. It is about emotionally processing the very complicated transgender issues.


    13 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Well, you must be referring to me, I used my own daughter as an example. It is not an issue of having seen a penis-yes, on her father and brother but not sitting next to someone in a sauna.

    Really, I am a parent and I should have some control over what my children are exposed to. But hey I guess the female hockey player should have just sucked it up and showered with the boys....Whatever, I am amazed at what people think is appropriate for children....


    13 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    Apr. 29, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by headsupheelsdown View Post
    It's not about JUST seeing a penis. It is about emotionally processing the very complicated transgender issues.
    Generally I find that it's adults who find issues like this complicated. Children seem to start out being much more accepting of individual differences, but that kind of openness declines rapidly when the adults in their lives tell them how "things are supposed to be."
    "In order to really enjoy a dog, one doesn’t merely train him to be semi-human. The point of it is to open oneself to the possibility of becoming part dog."
    -Edward Hoagland


    10 members found this post helpful.

  16. #36
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    Dec. 12, 2004
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    You should look into some child psychology. There really is not anything "very complicated" about "emotionally processing" different sexual orientations at a certain age. If the child is brought up appropriately, it's just "normal" and easily accepted. Children do not make issues of things the way adults love to. If all the adults around them (or at least the ones that they take their cues from) are not making a fuss, then they do not make a fuss either.

    I grew up in a very open household, with an openly gay babysitter who often brought her girlfriend along. I did not realize that there was anything "weird" about being gay until middle school. It was just another way for a person to be.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by over the moon View Post
    I'm not sure I know any young children who haven't seen their father naked.
    Yeah, this. I don't get the body-shame in this country. I saw my parents naked, and I even went to some clothing-optional beaches with them before I was 10.

    Children are perfectly ready to "process" nakedness. The problem comes when they're taught the naked body is sinful and evil and perverted, and that it's particularly bad if the body is of the opposite sex - then they have problems "processing" when faced with nudity. But it's not something inherent to children and their tender age, it's something they have been taught by their families.

    Don't teach them body shame and they will "process" just fine at 6.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  18. #38
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    Well, I happen to agree with the OP. If a transgender woman hasn't finished surgery yet, said transgender woman should make an effort to cover herself when minors are present. I probably would say the same about regular women as well. Whatever happened to modesty? It's just plain bad manners to wander around naked in front of children. There are usually towels in locker rooms.

    Not all children see their fathers naked; or their mothers for that matter. It should be up to the parents to decide when their children are ready to see naked people.

    Is it okay for a male to expose his penis in front of small children?

    I don't happen to agree with the previous post AT ALL.
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire


    15 members found this post helpful.

  19. #39
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    Dec. 12, 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by vineyridge View Post
    Well, I happen to agree with the OP. If a transgender woman hasn't finished surgery yet, said transgender woman should make an effort to cover herself when minors are present. I probably would say the same about regular women as well. Whatever happened to modesty? It's just plain bad manners to wander around naked in front of children.
    The article doesn't make it sound like the woman in question is wandering around all over the place...it sounds like it's specifically in the sauna. (Although I just skimmed.) It's pretty standard practice to be (mostly) nude in a sauna....if for some reason someone doesn't feel that their child is capable of handling the human body (whatever the gender), then they should use the sauna when it's empty, or not at all.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  20. #40
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    This is not an issue of being gay it is an issue of processing a penis on a woman. My daughter is more comfortable being naked around me than her father or brother and expecting teen girls to be comfortable around essentially a man in long hair behaving like a woman is a bit much. 18 years old OK, but let children be children for as long as they need. Sex education is not the issue allowing children to process the world without having to uncomfortably exposed to it is my issue.


    8 members found this post helpful.

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