[trubandloki]

In other words, as much as necessary but as little as possible.

That is a terrific way of wording it.


The days of deworming just to deworm are gone. Like the over use of antibiotics causing resistance, over use and improper use of deworming products has caused resistance.



Fharoah, lots of things, many of them not worm related can cause tail rubbing.

[JB]

Just curious. How long do you wait for a frost? I have had my equimax for a few weeks now and have been tempted to just go ahead and give it because the closest we have gotten to a freeze is upper 30's.

Wait

Well, you will probably want to do something with Juliet before, depending on when you last dewormed her. But for adults, assuming you've got clean FECs and you're just waiting on the weather, you're still fine. I've done the Fall Equimax in early December.

[Fharoah]

That is a terrific way of wording it.


The days of deworming just to deworm are gone. Like the over use of antibiotics causing resistance, over use and improper use of deworming products has caused resistance.



Fharoah, lots of things, many of them not worm related can cause tail rubbing.

Well how do I determine if my horses should be wormed or not. They are healthy decent coats, good weight. Stool sample showed no worms, my vets relies on fecal cycle saying nothing shows skip worming, But they have not been wormed since the Spring, One horse get itchy but not sure if that has anything to do with parasites, he is very sensitive chestnut and used to get random hives do to bugs at random times he is prone to itchiness. But my horses never show any worms to stool samples so do I just never worm. It is all confusing to me.

[Fharoah]

Also right now it is wet and mild. To me its cold but I am a total wimp whom likes hawaii and holidays and the hotter the better. We are no where near to frost so should I just wait until January or the first snow fall if we get one. Often it snows for like one or two days here then warms up and dramatically melts really quickly.

Advice would be greatly appreciated!

[JB]

Well how do I determine if my horses should be wormed or not. They are healthy decent coats, good weight. Stool sample showed no worms, my vets relies on fecal cycle saying nothing shows skip worming, But they have not been wormed since the Spring, One horse get itchy but not sure if that has anything to do with parasites, he is very sensitive chestnut and used to get random hives do to bugs at random times he is prone to itchiness. But my horses never show any worms to stool samples so do I just never worm. It is all confusing to me.

As per the above conversations, you HAVE to take care of the things that are very, very unreliable in FECs - bots and tapeworms. So, you take care of those Spring and Fall, *regardless of FEC counts*

But you still want to do your FECs before doing those dewormings to make sure the horse is still taking care of (most importantly) strongyles on his own. If you find a late Summer FEC that is high, for example then you would want to deworm him right then with ivermectin, THEN do the Equimax after a freeze/hard frost.

Also right now it is wet and mild. To me its cold but I am a total wimp whom likes hawaii and holidays and the hotter the better. We are no where near to frost so should I just wait until January or the first snow fall if we get one. Often it snows for like one or two days here then warms up and dramatically melts really quickly.

If it's going to take you until Jan to get a freeze, then do the Equimax about 6 months after the Spring worming was done.

[Cat Tap]

I have been worming according to fecal samples for several years now. The first year I dewormed spring and late fall. Last year only one horse needed to be dewormed in spring. This year they have all been clean each time tested.

I will still use Quest + after the first good frost because tapes do not show in fecal samples. The cost is the same as if I used wormer but I would rather pay for the fecal sample than unnecessary chemicals.

[Peggy]

My vet said do not worm since both horses showed zero worms and zero eggs based on McMaster fecal count. Just recheck every six months. I'll ask again when she comes on Wednesday to do a second fecal on the one horse.

[pryme_thyme]

My sister keeps her horses at home and purchased a colt in the spring. She wormed him with the same wormer's as the other horses and when he was not gaining weight she had his manure tested, nothing.

Wormed him 3 months later with a different wormer, all of a sudden worm central.

I am not entirely sure how it happened but I always worm every 3 months and I change wormers every time.

[JB]

My vet said do not worm since both horses showed zero worms and zero eggs based on McMaster fecal count. Just recheck every six months. I'll ask again when she comes on Wednesday to do a second fecal on the one horse.

Except that FECs do not, once again, show bots or tapeworms.

You're in So Cal, where tapes are much less of a problem than most areas of the country, but you still need to target them once a year.

I don't know the bot situation where you are, specifically, but I do know they are out your way in general. So, 1-2 times a year you have to target them as well, and that's regardless of clean FECs.

[JB]

My sister keeps her horses at home and purchased a colt in the spring. She wormed him with the same wormer's as the other horses and when he was not gaining weight she had his manure tested, nothing.

Wormed him 3 months later with a different wormer, all of a sudden worm central.

Many possibilities, can't begin to guess without knowing his history and what chemicals were used.

I am not entirely sure how it happened but I always worm every 3 months and I change wormers every time.

Deworming every 3 months "just because" and rotating wormers "just because" is not the current practice that should be followed.

[pryme_thyme]

What is current practice now, if horse goes to say 4-5 shows per year. No changes in herd?

[JB]

Ummm, read the thread I don't mean that snarky, but it's been laid out

[pryme_thyme]

Thanks but I guess I have a case of the Monday's... It isn't 100% clear for me.

[JB]

Ok, the summary is:

FEC late Winter and late Summer.

If high, deworm and check at an appropriate interval (4 weeks past effectiveness of the chemical)

If low/clean, the deworm in Spring anyway to get tapes/bots; deworm in Fall/after a freeze to get tapes/bots.

It's that simple, and doesn't change based on how often a horse travels. Clean FECs are clean FECs and you still have to get tapes and bots which rarely show on FECs

[pryme_thyme]

Ok, the summary is:

FEC late Winter and late Summer.

If high, deworm and check at an appropriate interval (4 weeks past effectiveness of the chemical)

If low/clean, the deworm in Spring anyway to get tapes/bots; deworm in Fall/after a freeze to get tapes/bots.

It's that simple, and doesn't change based on how often a horse travels. Clean FECs are clean FECs and you still have to get tapes and bots which rarely show on FECs

Aww gotcha, thank you, it has been a loonnggg day!

[Peggy]

Except that FECs do not, once again, show bots or tapeworms.

You're in So Cal, where tapes are much less of a problem than most areas of the country, but you still need to target them once a year.

I don't know the bot situation where you are, specifically, but I do know they are out your way in general. So, 1-2 times a year you have to target them as well, and that's regardless of clean FECs.

Thanks. I haven't seen a bot fly in decades. I will ask the vet about the tapeworms.

[trubandloki]

Thanks. I haven't seen a bot fly in decades. .

I had not either, until this summer.

[KrazyTBMare]

JB, I used Equimax back in August. This Sunday will be 16 weeks which I read that its effective for 12 weeks so that's obviously 4 weeks later. If they come back negative, I'll obviously wait until the first frost. But I was going to use Quest plus since I used equimax before. Was not aware that it was better to use in the spring. Anyways, is it ok to use the Quest anyways? Sometimes down here we don't get a frost/freeze until Jan or later so I won't necessarily be using it right now.

[JB]

Yes, 16 weeks post Equimax is an appropriate time to do a FEC.

Yes, you can use the QP this time It almost doesn't matter. Since it's better to use moxidectin in the Spring, you should use ivermectin now. But since you just used ivermectin, it would be better to use moxidectin. So watcha gonna do LOL Either way you'll be using 1 of them back to back, so...

[KrazyTBMare]

Yeh that's kind of how I was looking at it. Fingers crossed for a negative fecal.