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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    I understand that domestic violence is a psychologically complicated matter, but at some point, we have to begin to assume that you just like being hit.
    Wow.

    I think I'm going to bow out of this thread now.
    friend of bar.ka



  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celeritas View Post
    Wow.

    I think I'm going to bow out of this thread now.
    Hey, if you can explain to me why someone would have literally dozens of complaints against their abuser and keep going back after TEN YEARS of abuse, please do. I'd really love to understand.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    Hey, if you can explain to me why someone would have literally dozens of complaints against their abuser and keep going back after TEN YEARS of abuse, please do. I'd really love to understand.
    I can think of a few.

    No money.
    No place to go.
    No way to avoid the abuser if they do leave (i.e., has the same social circle and others have never seen the abusive behavior).
    Threats of bodily harm against loved ones if the victim leaves.
    Victim is convinced (accurately or not) that the abuser will track her down.

    What happens when your abuser is such a psychopath that they only show their violent side to you? When your friends and family think you're the crazy one because he always appears genuinely honest and caring?
    Life would be infinitely better if pinatas suddenly appeared throughout the day.


    6 members found this post helpful.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sing Mia Song View Post
    I can think of a few.

    No money.
    No place to go.
    No way to avoid the abuser if they do leave (i.e., has the same social circle and others have never seen the abusive behavior).
    Threats of bodily harm against loved ones if the victim leaves.
    Victim is convinced (accurately or not) that the abuser will track her down.

    What happens when your abuser is such a psychopath that they only show their violent side to you? When your friends and family think you're the crazy one because he always appears genuinely honest and caring?
    Add that the abused really believes the abuser when they promise they will not do it again.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  5. #85
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    Flame suit zipped, but at some point, you have to take responsibility for your own life.

    In the specific case I referenced, said "victim" would visit her abuser in jail and immediately move back in with him after he got out, in violation of PFAs. She wasted resources and time every time she called the police, filed a report, and then moved back in with him.

    I understand that most of these cases are extremely complicated, but again, at some point, you have to take responsibility for your own life.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris


    3 members found this post helpful.

  6. #86
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    Wow. This has taken a turn that I did not expect. I am going to end my participation in this discussion at this point. I truly appreciate all the advice I have received and support offered to me. I won't delete any of my posts just for the purpose of helping anyone else if they are going through the same thing at this time.


    10 members found this post helpful.

  7. #87
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    OP, I hope you understand that I was/am absolutely NOT talking about you and your situation. Good luck. I wish I was close enough to offer help.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bedazzle View Post
    In fact this whole thing is slightly out of proportion. The situation is bad, I am unhappy. But its not dangerous. Thank you.
    If you do come back to visit this thread I want to address this. You seem like you have a good head on your shoulders, and assuming your plan is to move out somewhere in the next week or so, I think you should trust your judgement on that.

    If you want to go re-read my post, it was written from the point of view of someone (me) who has been in a codependent relationship very similar to yours. He was not violent and never became violent, but that doesn't mean there weren't abusive aspects to the relationship.

    I still recommend having someone with you when you leave for all the reasons I listed earlier. Also, once he realizes that your are leaving and he's not going to manipulate back into it, be aware that he COULD become violent. I'm not saying he will, but please don't write it off as "well he hasn't been in the past so he won't be now."

    Like others have said, it also wouldn't hurt to research your rights and resources (shelters, restraining orders, etc.) JUST IN CASE you need them. I hope you don't, and you don't seem to think you will, but it's good information to know even if you never need it.

    Oh, and still never contact him after you leave. Violent or not, it's just truly better that way.
    Proud member of the "I'm In My 20's and Hope to Be a Good Rider Someday" clique

    Fourteen Months Living and Working in Costa Rica


    3 members found this post helpful.

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    Hey, if you can explain to me why someone would have literally dozens of complaints against their abuser and keep going back after TEN YEARS of abuse, please do. I'd really love to understand.
    This makes me so sad. You've never been in an abusive relationship, have you?

    There are a lot of reasons why someone would stay.
    - Financial dependence (and lack of job history to get a job that pays a living wage)
    - Abusers isolate their victims. It's common for victims, especially of long term abuse, to have no friends or family to turn to for support.
    - Fear that something is wrong with them, they're "damaged", or no one else will love them again. (Victims can already feel this way depending on the abuse, and abusers love to encourage these feelings.)
    - Desire to make up for their mistakes (Abusers like to blame their victims for their behavior. "You did this and it made me mad so..." And because of that, the victim may go back in an attempt to do better next time or otherwise make up for their mistakes.)
    - Fear of violence towards themselves or other for leaving.
    - A variety of other reasons that seem very important and real to the victim.

    However... there's also a huge other aspect to abusive relationships that I wish people understood better. Spend a little time reading up on the cycle of abuse. The terrible part of the cycle is the "incident" and it can last only minutes. Then the honeymoon phase... Well that can last a lot longer. And during this time (depending on how the abuser goes about it) than victim can feel very loved. The abuser may shower them with love, give them gifts, tell them how sorry they are, convince them it will never happen again, and promise to change. The honeymoon phase, plus what they list here as the "calm phase" can sometimes make up a vast majority of the relationship. So when things are good, they're REALLY good, which makes the bad moments more forgivable.

    This is not the most eloquent explanation, but I hope it was enough to englighten you a little bit. Victim blame is not the solution. I can understand your frustration with the time or money being "wasted" on someone who keeps returning to their abuser, but that frustration should not be taken out on the victim by saying they like being hit.

    OP: I realize most of this does not apply to you, and I'm sorry for engaging I'm the derailment of the thread. However, I felt like this needed to be addressed and hopefully it will do some good and help educate some people.
    Proud member of the "I'm In My 20's and Hope to Be a Good Rider Someday" clique

    Fourteen Months Living and Working in Costa Rica


    8 members found this post helpful.

  10. #90
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    Nothing to add but be smart Bedazzle, these CoTHers can be a little extreme, but noone wants to see you hurt, physically, mentally or any other way. Big steps ahead- I for one believe you will be tough enough to get what you need done... and take care of yourself. Once you get on the other side your whole life can open up again. Be smart, good luck girl!


    4 members found this post helpful.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celeritas View Post
    Yeah, I would make some "just in case" contingency plans. My a-hole ex wasn't mentally ill (at least not diagnosed) and wasn't outright abusive, but when I finally broke up with him he did threaten me a couple times. He was too much of a coward to actually do anything...
    Whoa -- he was a COWARD because he didn't become violent with you? I can understand that you are angry, but that's not clear thinking.
    Quote Originally Posted by SuzieQNutter
    The whip is held across your thigh so as you can still hold the reins without spilling your coffee!!
    SillyHorse adds: Or your wine.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  12. #92
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    It will probably be the best Christmas present your parents have ever gotten when they get that call from you!


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  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    I'm not sure how applicable this is the the OP's situation, but as a general commentary on domestic violence, I tend to agree with Trakehner.

    After spending a year working in the criminal justice system, I saw a lot of domestic violence victims. 99% of them had filed previous reports against the same person and had then begged to have the charges dropped/PFAs lifted. We had one "victim" that had dozens of cases going back over a decade. I understand that domestic violence is a psychologically complicated matter, but at some point, we have to begin to assume that you just like being hit.
    Wow, one whole year of indirect experience? You must be an expert.


    "A lack of financial resources is the number one reason why women who have been abused return to the man who abused them.
    Fear for her safety and the safety of her children. Where is he…when will he pop up…what is he planning to do? Sadly, it may be safer to stay so it’s possible for her to keep an eye and ear on him. Victims are up to 75% more likely to be murdered when they flee. Leaving/fleeing is the most deadly time in an abusive relationship.
    Contrary to popular belief, most fathers who attempt to gain custody of their children do so successfully and abusive men are much more likely to attempt to gain custody then non-abusive men.
    Abusive men often use nonpayment of child support as a means of harassing the victim and forcing her to return. She had been a wife and mother for years, so her education is frequently either incomplete or obsolete. She may have no job prospects or job training and is looking at a life in poverty.
    She and the children are homeless. Since they're homeless, she risks losing custody of her children to her husband. And if he gets physical custody she won't be able to defend them.
    Fear that her children will be taken from her. Abusive men nearly always threaten that they will take the children from the victim either legally or illegally if she dares to leave the relationship.
    One of her children has a fairly serious medical condition, like asthma or allergies, both of which are very common ailments in children with an abusive father. But the insurance is in her husband's name, so medical care is not available or extremely difficult to access.
    They're hungry, and she has no idea where she will get their next meal.
    No transportation. Women who have been abused by a man often cannot leave their home because of lack of transportation. She may not have access to a vehicle, or a driver’s license. Even if she does have a vehicle, she may be reluctant to drive to appointments with service providers for fear the abuser will check mileage.
    Security. Many women have never lived anywhere else, and leaving the security of a family and friends is a giant step into the unknown.
    Children are begging to return. It is difficult to ignore the pleas of children to return to their homes, even when a woman who has been abused by a man knows that the situation is unsafe.
    No childcare. There is a severe shortage of childcare, particularly in rural areas. Mothers who work outside the home often have to piece together childcare arrangements that includes friends and relatives, or they must transport their children to another community where childcare is available. Mothers are often worried about the emotional and physical well-being of their young children or that their abusive mate will take the children while she is at work.
    Religious reasons. Churches are often the backbone of the social fabric in small towns and rural communities in particular. Many rural women are deeply religious, and deeply opposed to breaking up the family. Additionally, many religious leaders are strongly opposed to divorce regardless of the reason…till death do us part.
    Extended Family. Family plays a huge role in the lives of women who have been abused by a man. Family provides comfort and security, and sometimes is the only social outlet. Homes, businesses, and farms are often intertwined among extended family members. Preserving the relationship is vital to the emotional and financial health of each individual. Divorce wreaks havoc on this intricate structure. Women who have been abused by a man are often pressured to stay with these abusive men for the sake of the family.
    Abusive men deliberately create these situations. They coerce their victims to stay by systematically destroying all other options."

    That enough reasons for you?

    My ex said "I will kill you or myself if you leave." So... I'm pretty sure I was AFRAID OF DYING, rather than enjoying being hit/called names/having my life taken away from me slowly. Protective orders are mostly civil orders and are very weak (in terms of actual protection that they offer)... 1000's of women (and men!) are killed by their abusers every year.

    But THANK YOU for using your expert opinion to promulgate a negative, false, and injurious stigma in a thread that should be about help. Disgusting.


    19 members found this post helpful.

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by vixen View Post
    Wow, one whole year of indirect experience? You must be an expert.

    ....

    But THANK YOU for using your expert opinion to promulgate a negative, false, and injurious stigma in a thread that should be about help. Disgusting.
    Hey, I never said I was an expert. I said that my experiences have shaped my opinion.

    I'm sorry that you don't like my opinion, but it is what it is. I didn't say that we shouldn't help victims of abuse. I didn't say that the resources shouldn't be there. I didn't say that it was all the victims' fault.

    But, in my (admittedly limited) experience, some women return to their abusers repeatedly, and not always under duress. At some point, you're only a victim because you want to be one.
    "Are you yawning? You don't ride well enough to yawn. I can yawn, because I ride better than you. Meredith Michael Beerbaum can yawn. But you? Not so much..."
    -George Morris



  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wonders12 View Post
    If you do come back to visit this thread I want to address this. You seem like you have a good head on your shoulders, and assuming your plan is to move out somewhere in the next week or so, I think you should trust your judgement on that.

    If you want to go re-read my post, it was written from the point of view of someone (me) who has been in a codependent relationship very similar to yours. He was not violent and never became violent, but that doesn't mean there weren't abusive aspects to the relationship.

    I still recommend having someone with you when you leave for all the reasons I listed earlier. Also, once he realizes that your are leaving and he's not going to manipulate back into it, be aware that he COULD become violent. I'm not saying he will, but please don't write it off as "well he hasn't been in the past so he won't be now."

    Like others have said, it also wouldn't hurt to research your rights and resources (shelters, restraining orders, etc.) JUST IN CASE you need them. I hope you don't, and you don't seem to think you will, but it's good information to know even if you never need it.

    Oh, and still never contact him after you leave. Violent or not, it's just truly better that way.
    This^^
    Pack what you really want and leave the rest. Then never look back, anything that you didn't pack is gone, period. Close the door and never, ever speak to this person again.

    Good luck and take care of yourself.
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim



  16. #96
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    Oh boy. Wow.

    Yep, women just like to be hit. That is quite the synopsis. It's probably because they're weak and stupid, right?

    I'm just really, really disappointed at that outlook. Absolutely people are initially in charge of their own lives, but abuse, at its fundamental core, is when someone takes control of your life away from you.

    In many cases, a woman leaves an abusive situation only to be tracked down by the abuser. I knew someone who left many, many times, and each time, the abuser would find her and try to kill her. Eventually, she stopped trying to leave because she didn't enjoy being tied up at gunpoint. Furthermore, friends were less and less willing to help her, because they didn't want to be killed in the aftermath. It's been many years and much jail time, but the abuser still occasionally finds her and attempts to harm her.

    Abusers are abusers because they take control of another person- physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually. They can brainwash people to believe they deserve nothing, that they deserve the abuse, and use fear to dictate every movement. If you knew the punishment for your every movement was death, how willing would you be to just wander away? Victims of abuse are literally tied to their abusers with this sort of control. It's easy to say, "Well if someone hit me for buying the wrong kind of soda, I'd walk right out the door." Sure you would. But what if you knew that, if you walked out the door, you would be stabbed as soon as you hit the front lawn? Shot as you were unlocking your car?

    Many abused women DO stand up at first, and that's what escalates the situation initially. And it continues because if this is how the abuser acts over a minor infraction, what will it be if they ACTUALLY have something to be angry about?

    It's hard to understand, and there are many, many reasons victims use to stay in an abusive situation. But none of them have ever been "I like to be hit."


    8 members found this post helpful.

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sing Mia Song View Post
    ... I was ready to go, but then my mother was diagnosed with metastatic cancer and I stayed several more months because I just couldn't handle two life-altering changes at the same time...
    I had a similar situation a few years ago where there would have been two completely unrelated things going on at the same time a thousand miles apart, either would have been an almost full-time challenge to manage for any stretch of time, and it just wasn't possible to manage them both simultaneously. So I waited until one of them stabilized before taking action on the other. It was a two year wait and got pretty bad with the deferred one just before the end when I finally did. There was simply no other way to do it.
    "Things should be as simple as possible,
    but no simpler." - Einstein

    “So what’s up with years of lessons? You still can’t ride a damn horse?!”



  18. #98
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    OP: Just want to add all my love and support to that which many COTHers have already expressed. Wish I lived anywhere near you, or I'd certainly be glad to help. I moved out from my BF's place several months ago, and was able to do so through the help of my BO and trainer. I ended up meeting some people who would end up becoming a second family to me. I did end up going back to the BF (and we're happy) but good things came out of the separation for both of us.

    Best of luck to you, and though I can't physically be there, if you ever need an ear I am just a PM away!
    "A horse gallops with his lungs, perseveres with his heart, and wins with his character." - Tesio



  19. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaturdayNightLive View Post
    Hey, I never said I was an expert. I said that my experiences have shaped my But, in my (admittedly limited) experience, some women return to their abusers repeatedly, and not always under duress. At some point, you're only a victim because you want to be one.
    Be careful assuming someone is "not under duress."

    It is difficult to imagine when you have a living wage, are completely on your own two feet in terms of your finances, and have awesome friends and family who would pick you up from the airport at 1am in the morning but unfortunately there are many people who do not have these things.

    Sure, *I* can pick up a phone and say, "Hey listen. I need to move out of this house, NOW," and I have a friend who will get that call, get in the car, drive four hours to get to me, and have me moved out that night.

    Actually, it is MY EFFING HOUSE so if I want someone to leave the police will forcibly remove who I tell them to.

    If *I* want to 'disappear' I can call three or four people in Texas, a person in Maine, a friend in VA, my brother in CA, my brothers in MA, and several people in various parts of Europe, any one of those people will pick me up from whatever airport I land in and put me up with them, no questions asked.
    Then again, I have the spare money and my own bank account and a passport, so I *CAN* do this.

    I have several cowokers at my job (not everyone has a job) who would come pick me up from whereever, etc.



    On the other end of the spectrum:
    I once bought a dog from a woman off craigslist. She had a kid and lived with her boyfriend. I wrote her a check for $100.
    Three days later she emailed me and said, "The bank won't cash your check."
    I said, "??? Is this your bank's policy or something with my check?"
    "Well they won't cash it."
    "Are you trying to deposit it or get cash? Usually if you want to cash it you have to have an equal amount of available funds already in your account. At least that is how my bank does it."
    "Cash. I don't have a bank account so I just want them to cash it."


    Stop for a minute.
    She DOESN'T. HAVE. A BANK ACCOUNT.


    How would this woman:
    -have a car that she controls?
    -pay rent on her own place ever?
    -be employed in any kind of W2-filling-out-way and get paid?
    -have her own Netflix account?
    -drive her own car over to her friend's place to bring chinese food and watch a movie?
    -order something from Amazon that she likes?
    -buy a bus ticket?


    Look at the options I have.
    If *I* want to pick up an leave, I take my savings, my long history of employment, my excellent credit store, my OWN F*CKING BANK ACCOUNT, my OWN vehicles, load up my OWN horses, drive WHEREEVER THE HELL I WANT, and use my considerable resources to carry on with life. I have enough money that I control to get by until I find work, which I have the skills and ability to do.

    What is that lady going to do?
    Squirrel away a wad of cash left over from her boyfriend somewhere and then get her life started again without even the life skills to NEGOTIATE A CHECK before this little pile of cash runs out?
    He is the pipeline to EVERYTHING in her life. Every Amazon purchase. Every Netflix subscription. The money is in his control, if she wants it she has to play his game. He hands her CASH or HIS credit card when she wants something.
    And if he is a jerk (I have no evidence that he is, but IF he is a jerk) she is just going to take her no-bank-account self and leave?
    Righto.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  20. #100
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    Bedazzle, please do go through with your plans to leave. You're not happy and the relationship is not healthy. These relationships tend to get worse, not better. In that sense, your solution is pretty simple and you need to leave him. I don't expect it will be easy, but you seem like a smart, capable woman so you will work through the rest of it. I expect the next step will actually be easier than living with this guy!!

    Do it. Nobody deserves this.

    All the best.
    Born under a rock and owned by beasts!


    1 members found this post helpful.

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