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  1. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post
    Here are some facts regarding oil production...

    1. Many US refineries are older, unable to process the full-range of crude available in the supply line, and therefore cannot maintain profit, which is why more are closing every year for the past decade. New refineries are badly needed in the US, especially on the East Coast.

    2. We have more than enough oil. Opening up drilling is not going to decrease the cost of gas across the board when we cannot refine or direct the oil into our own market and there are foreign markets where they can make more money for less effort.

    3. The President cannot dictate where the oil extracted from our ground goes. If the oil companies want to send it elsewhere, they are free to do so. It is possible for the government to make agreements that oil extracted from Federal lands will be refined and sold to the American market, but that is all they can do. Romney and the Repubs can shout to the Heavens that they will bring low gas prices back, but that shit ain't happening unless the oil and gas companies want it to or they start making cars that run on warm fuzzy feelings.
    But wouldn't that mean that the government controls the market for oil if oil extracted from federal or non-federal lands were required to be sold in the US and and and wait for it............whouldn't that be socialism ?


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  2. #362

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    Do people realize that the US is now the second largest oil producing country in the world and this happened during Obama's presidency?


    5 members found this post helpful.

  3. #363
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    If I remember correctly (IF) Obama wanted to stop the big oil subsidies.
    Can you say PO'd Republicans??? Heaven forbid big oil should lose their subsidies - let's do away with Planned Parenthood and funding for Sesame Street instead.

    Quote Originally Posted by subk View Post
    Thank you for making my point that excessive regulation makes it more difficult to do business. And yes, the judge laughed the US Attorney out of the court room.

    But you know you didn't answer my question. Do you think this type of law suit harassment by the Obama administration has any reflection on their energy policies? As they are supposedly so pro-oil and all...


    6 members found this post helpful.

  4. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prime Time Rider View Post
    Do people realize that the US is now the second largest oil producing country in the world and this happened during Obama's presidency?
    Yes, in spite of him, because of new technology that is being used on private lands, not because of Obama's energy policies, as those have a definite dampening effect where he could hinder production, according to THIS set of figures:

    http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/...ng-under-obama


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  5. #365
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    Bluey that article is very biased and not very specific . Off shore drilling off the coast of Cal. is not allowed due to California voters not Obama and that article implys that it is Obama. Do you have other sources for those statements ?

    I work in oil & gas and what I hear from clients is that the oil and gas remaining is much harder to access. But I could be wrong.


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  6. #366
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    Suggestion for everyone.
    Rent the documentary "Weather Underground". It is about the founding, activity and breakup of the 1960-1970's radical group known as the Weather Underground. Why watch this?

    Bill Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn formed the WU from the SDS (Students for a Democratic Society). It was in their living room that BO announced his run for President.

    Watch it and make up your own mind.
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim


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  7. #367
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    Oh nothing political about that little gem. Oh please the ayers BS----makes it stop. Or instead google Mormon underwear, yes Romney actually wears Mormon underwear. Really, how about listening to what they say, or for Romney/Ryan what they lack in saying...


    7 members found this post helpful.

  8. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by stolen virtue View Post
    Obama has a record, remember healthcare reform ?

    Again, what is Romney/Ryan going to do specifically to fix the economy ?

    Crickets.......................................... ..................
    Just catching up here... Obama has a record of enacting, what, 21 new taxes on the American people through Obamacare. And jobs? He's repeating what he preached 4 years ago, isn't he? Shovel ready jobs, right? Mmm Hmmm. So how's that working out for people? Didn't happen then, what makes people think it will happen now?
    Personally, I worry about our country and the direction it's going in. On the way home from class, I heard a famous talk show guy scream something about the republicans need to gain control of the Senate so the 'nation can begin healing.' Had flashbacks to Gingrich and his 'Contract with America.' (sorry if I didn't get that verbatim). Republicans promised things would be different but when they gained control, they forgot about the people of this country. IMO, democrats have done the same thing. It's become so much about which party is in power that politicos completely disregard we the people. In fact, money has become the end all as to who is elected. Remember the Obama campaign touting it's billion dollar price tag to get re-elected? When are we the people gonna practice what we preach by forcing those hired to represent us practice what they preach?

    For the record, I'm an Independent. Early voted mostly Libertarian...
    It's only when a mosquito lands on your privates that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence. fb meme.


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  9. #369
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    A few thoughts on oil & gas ... The fuel you put into your tank was fungible. You may be getting fuel from anywhere and anyplace. The oil companies put fuel of specific grade into the pipelines. With only a few exceptions, the oil companies then get fuel of specific grade delivered at the pipeline terminal. The fuel might be from company A or B or F ... doesn't matter.
    The gasoline is then blended with the brand's additive package and trucked to you as brand X gasoline. Until it was blended, the gas was fungible.

    Think of it like a dollar bill. You put a dollar into the bank yesterday. Today you get a dollar from the bank. Is it the same dollar bill ??? Not likely. The dollar bills are fungible.

    Oil is fungible on the world markets. To say oil drilled and produced in the US should stay in the US is impractical. It is enough to say that oil produced here creates wealth in the USA instead of in lands that their people wish us ill.


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  10. #370
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    Independent, no FEMA. When are we gonna practice what we preach ? When "independent " means we help each other in seperate states. Which for you means "never".


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  11. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by mercedespony View Post
    Shermy, the Keystone Pipeline might be. Wouldn't it be grand to have the time to actually determine the environmental costs to both countries, before either candidate uses it as a platform?

    As many of the Canucks are discussing, you have the same American farmers/families discussing. this pipeline has a proposed long line, into many water sources, that will seriously affect all of us if one leak starts. That's why holding off and looking at different routes makes sense.

    A pipeline is not safer, if it affects 1,000,000 of us down the line and our aqafires for the next 50 years.

    btw, Still think Bluey is drunk.
    Gotta say that I agree with alot of what Bluey posts. That said, my problem with the Keystone is we have a foreign company using eminent domain in the U.S. to take peoples land to run their pipeline through. Here is the case; http://stateimpact.npr.org/texas/201...e-xl-pipeline/
    Ms. Crawford has several other pipelines running through her property and the companies worked with her to avoid jeopardizing the water source for cattle. Keystone refused. In Texas, all a company has to do is check a box to claim it's a common carrier and they can take whatever land they want. Per our Constitution, landowners are to properly compensated but we all know that's a lie.

    Either we have rights or we don't. So, does the right for people to work override property rights? Is Ms. Crawford wrong to protect her land? Pipelines bring work but at what cost?
    God, both parties really piss me off.
    It's only when a mosquito lands on your privates that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence. fb meme.



  12. #372
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    Quote Originally Posted by stolen virtue View Post
    Independent, no FEMA. When are we gonna practice what we preach ? When "independent " means we help each other in seperate states. Which for you means "never".
    Was this directed at me? If so, what are you talking about?
    It's only when a mosquito lands on your privates that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence. fb meme.



  13. #373
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    Quote Originally Posted by subk View Post
    So you don't think the Obama Justice Department bringing felony charges that could have included imprisonment against seven oil and natural gas companies for killing a total 28 migratory birds (ducks, most of them mallards) that were found dead near waste pits wasn't part of a policy to reduce oil production?

    After a good deal of expense to the oil companies the case was thrown out by the judge.

    The American Bird Conservancy estimates that the wind industry kills over 400,000 birds a year including scores of bald and golden eagles which are highly protected by the federal government. There have been no federal prosecutions of anyone in the wind industry.
    I recently heard an NPR program on wind energy which pointed out that the damage done birds by wind turbines is miniscule compared to that done by fossil fuels' large scale destruction of both birds and their habitats-- not to mention our own (e.g. consider what fuel residues in the water did to Marine families at Camp Lejune . Yes, fuel is important, but, IMO, nowhere near as much so as breathable air and potable water).

    One of the things that bothers me most about this election is the absence of discussion of what's happening to the environment-- it's barely mentioned that Romney does not believe that human activity/consumption of fossil fuels is responsible for global warming. If he had his way, our air and water would start looking like Peiking's and Cairo's due to the same kind of pollution.
    Last edited by fish; Oct. 31, 2012 at 08:51 AM.


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  14. #374
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    “There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by debt.”
    John Adams


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  15. #375
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    Thanks, Frank B. I love the cartoon.

    Stephen Colbert: "Election debate coverage 2012. Two men. One wheel. Who gets to drive us over the cliff?"


    3 members found this post helpful.

  16. #376
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    Quote Originally Posted by fish View Post
    I recently heard an NPR program on wind energy which pointed out that the damage done birds by wind turbines is miniscule compared to that done by fossil fuels' large scale destruction of both birds and their habitats-- not to mention our own (e.g. consider what fuel residues in the water did to Marine families at Camp Lejune . Yes, fuel is important, but, IMO, nowhere near as much so as breathable air and potable water).

    One of the things that bothers me most about this election is the absence of discussion of what's happening to the environment-- it's barely mentioned that Romney does not believe that human activity/consumption of fossil fuels is responsible for global warming. If he had his way, our air and water would start looking like Peiking's and Cairo's due to the same kind of pollution.
    Fear mongering talk as that about Romney reminds me of the one about Obama being a communist when he was running.

    Really, whatever it is said on either side, once they are president, they don't have quite the free hand those against them keep warning about, thankfully.

    I do feel that Obama has put many in power to regulate and change by law that may still implement questionable social engineering type changes if he gets back in, but also hope that, as in his first term, someone or common sense will still keep holding his hand there.

    See, two can play the same game.


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  17. #377
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anne FS View Post
    Thanks, Frank B. I love the cartoon.

    Stephen Colbert: "Election debate coverage 2012. Two men. One wheel. Who gets to drive us over the cliff?"
    Now that is not a joke, sadly.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  18. #378
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noms View Post
    You are mistaken, there was a significant amount of time when Obama had a fillibuster proof house and senate.
    You will have to prove that given that all reliable sources say the contrary.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  19. #379
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Now that is not a joke, sadly.
    Yes, it is a joke. We're not going over the cliff no matter who wins. Whichever one of these two is President will do their very best, and after the election no matter who wins we're not going to run riot through the streets.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  20. #380
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    May. 25, 2006
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    The most important responsiblity of our President is to protect the citizens of this great country. We have been put in more danger by our current President from those through out this world who would do us harm and have publicly called for our destruction. Why else would there have been such a coordinated attack on our Ambassdor in Benghazi Libya. He never sent help when it was asked for by those courageous Americans in Benghazi. Why? Why did he fabricate a tale of some you tube video for over two weeks as being responsible for the attack? The CIA, State Dept and the White House were all watching this attack in real time from a drone. Why did they tell Navy Seals NOT to go help the Ambassador and those with him when they begged for help? Why did the President allow those 4 Americans to be killed rather than to send help? This fabrication about the attack from the President and cover up shows us he does not have the protection of the citizens as his most important responsiblity.

    The United States is the only place in this world that celebrates individual freedom.


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